Abandoned meetings

[Contentious 616]

22 minutes ago, Pak Star said:

So one horse slips at Trentham and the day is called off...

Same day Ellerslie at least 3 horses report to lose their footing plus two jockey meetings throughout the day, but the show must go on?

It's not really passing the smell test..

 

Big $$$$$$$$

[Pam Robson 1,551]

9 hours ago, We're Doomed said:

Certainly a precedent set after the stewards report mentions slips in several races at Ellerslie and various comments from jockeys. I wonder how many other meetings would have continued in those circumstance. I wonder if Reefton would have carried on with that number of comments from jockeys.

There doesn't have to be a legitimate slip to abandon Reefton.

[We're Doomed 4,884]

The other thing I found quite interesting at Ellerslie was no close finishes. The closest  winning margin was just under a length and a half, mostly much more. Riccarton had 5 winners by a length or less.

It looked like horses either handled it or they didn't. Some like Luberon seemed to be perfectly placed but showed nothing when asked to go.

[stodge 1,953]

I write from 13,000 miles away so forgive my gross ignorance...

I've just read on Loveracing they put 15mm of water on the track the night before and the day was showery.

That's a huge amount of water (up here we might put on 5 mm at most even in midsummer) and they certainly seemed to be kicking off the top in the first couple of races.

Artificial irrigation isn't the same as proper natural rain - it seems odd to me.

Were they trying to produce a particular surface for the Karaka Millions races - the risk of watering so much is produces uneven or false ground.

[We're Doomed 4,884]

1 minute ago, stodge said:

I write from 13,000 miles away so forgive my gross ignorance...

I've just read on Loveracing they put 15mm of water on the track the night before and the day was showery.

That's a huge amount of water (up here we might put on 5 mm at most even in midsummer) and they certainly seemed to be kicking off the top in the first couple of races.

Artificial irrigation isn't the same as proper natural rain - it seems odd to me.

Were they trying to produce a particular surface for the Karaka Millions races - the risk of watering so much is produces uneven or false ground.

Showers were always predicted on the day and when that happens in NZ clubs run scared and try to pour water on to mitigate any slippery problems on race day.

[Pete Lane 640]

1 minute ago, stodge said:

I write from 13,000 miles away so forgive my gross ignorance...

I've just read on Loveracing they put 15mm of water on the track the night before and the day was showery.

That's a huge amount of water (up here we might put on 5 mm at most even in midsummer) and they certainly seemed to be kicking off the top in the first couple of races.

Artificial irrigation isn't the same as proper natural rain - it seems odd to me.

Were they trying to produce a particular surface for the Karaka Millions races - the risk of watering so much is produces uneven or false ground.

I saw the Track Manager's preview on Friday.

They were under the impression that they were going to get no rain on the day which obviously influenced the thinking around watering. The weather has been very warm and I guess they were scared of it being too firm.

Even before the rain I noticed the divots flying on the home turn which did raise some alarm bells.

 

[tripple alliance 1,026]

 ex stipe report ,Race 3  Following this race comment was made by some riders that their mounts were shifting in the ground. Films from Race 3 were also further reviewed where it was apparent that TEVERE had lost its footing rounding the final turn. Stewards convened a meeting with all riders and after viewing available film footage it was agreed that the meeting should continue.

Race 5 , Following further comment from riders regarding the footing including W Kennedy who reported that his mount lost its footing passing the 600 metres, a further meeting was convened with all riders. After reviewing film footage and considering submissions from all riders present the decision was made to run the last race as scheduled

Race 6, PENDRAGON (M Zahra) – Lost its footing entering the final straight.

So we have the most modern probably  best track ever seen in NZ and still have problems which just goes to prove all the other tracks around the country have zero chance of avoiding the slippery track issue , the common factor in all of this is  rain on the day , so unless all tracks race under a big umbrella or we learn to control the weather nothing can change .

I do fear for Ellerslie , a fantastic looking  upmarket track but I doubt any more can be done to avoid this happening on a regular basis in the future , lets blame global warming .

[Pete Lane 640]

The thing is they may have to change their approach to irrigation.

I thought Strathayr provided a cushion even when the ground is dry but I could be wrong on that.

I'm sure it's a learning curve for them and they'll certainly be in touch with the suppliers for advice.

[stodge 1,953]

@We're Doomed has a valid point. If you water on firm ground the bends can be a real problem - if it's any consolation, we have that problem as well. It requires specific track management of bends (aligning the camber properly) and a well-managed irrigation policy but I do get it.

@PeteL - I watched the first, the divots were flying but that doesn't mean the ground further down was easier. I'm sure we all know how a track walks and how it rides on a racehorse at full speed can be very different. We occasionally get changes in going descriptions up here after the first race when it's been galloped on.

Weather forecasts can be a nightmare for clerks especially in summer if showers or storms are forecast.

[stodge 1,953]

1 minute ago, PeteL said:

The thing is they may have to change their approach to irrigation.

I thought Strathayr provided a cushion even when the ground is dry but I could be wrong on that.

I'm sure it's a learning curve for them and they'll certainly be in touch with the suppliers for advice.

We don't have Strathayr in Europe - I thought it was particularly designed to cope with intense tropical-type rainfall.

[dmg 26]

Tevere McNabb Race 3  rounding LOST  FOOTING 400    ALSO jOCKEYS COMMENTING HORSES SHIFTING GROUND

Holymanz race 5 Kennedy lost footing 600

Pendragon Zarha lost footing entering straight

LUCKY NO ACCIDDENT  SHOULD BEEN CALLED OFF  BUT BECUASE SHOWCASING ELLERSLIE AND CROWD AND MONEY 

WOULD LOOKED REALLY GOOD HASTINGS ABANDONED FRIDAY WELLINGTON SATRDAY ELLERSLIE SATURDAY AFTERNOON

ANY OTHER MEETING WOULD OFF BEEN CALLED OFF HORSES LOOSING FOOTING HORSES SHIFTING ON TRACK

 NZTR  SHOULD  DO SAFETY FIRST/BE FORE SHOWCASING 

[Pete Lane 640]

From their website, maybe they overwatered it.

"We lay a track that is resilient and damage resistant. Moonee Valley Racecourse records show the StrathAyr Track System requires less irrigation and has a lower maintenance cost than conventional racing turf profiles."

[Phar Lap Fan 104]

Convert to dirt tracks?

[Pete Lane 640]

And this:

ReFlex® mesh technology ensures our tracks have greater surface uniformity and cushion impact, lowering injury potential for both horses and jockeys. In over 20 years of racing there has never been a Fast rating on any of the ReFlex® tracks.

[Pete Lane 640]

Here's the Friday preview.

 

[stodge 1,953]

Was it overwatered?

It's not real grass so it doesn't dry like real grass where the moisture is sucked out of the ground and the top can get firm  - Good 4 is its "natural" state (like Standard on a Polytrack or Tapeta).

It sounds like it doesn't need much irrigation so why 15 mm?

[Benbatl 17]

2 hours ago, Contentious said:

Big $$$$$$$$

Agreed and sometimes it turns out the horse lost a shoe and changed legs on a corner or even got a bump. 

[Benbatl 17]

18 minutes ago, stodge said:

Was it overwatered?

It's not real grass so it doesn't dry like real grass where the moisture is sucked out of the ground and the top can get firm  - Good 4 is its "natural" state (like Standard on a Polytrack or Tapeta).

It sounds like it doesn't need much irrigation so why 15 mm?

Yes I understand will always be a Good 4 no matter what! But it may be like the synthetic tracks and Martin Collins in that once it laid and paid for thier support seems to dissapear. There is really a skill and science needed for maintenance and I hope Ellerslie will figure it out. As for horses  some just don’t like it (ie Moone Valley, although the tight track is another factor) and agree the margins over the first half of the fields was huge

[Contentious 616]

14 hours ago, nomates said:

The problem is they have run 6 meetings in 8 weekends since the beginning of December . Amateur management by Race and NZTR , anyone with brains could see this happening , Trentham can barely handle a couple of meetings over a month .

How many full time track staff worked on the track 40+ hours a week during those 7 weeks? - Race simply do not have enough ground staff.

[Leggy 4,101]

1 hour ago, stodge said:

It's not real grass so it doesn't dry like real grass where the moisture is sucked out of the ground and the top can get firm  -

What do you mean it's not real grass? Of course it is. Nothing like the synthetic tracks you mention. And with superior drainage to most grass tracks, you'd think it would need more, not less, irrigation.

[Benbatl 17]

38 minutes ago, Contentious said:

How many full time track staff worked on the track 40+ hours a week during those 7 weeks? - Race simply do not have enough ground staff.

Yet the likes and Randwick have 24-26 full time track staff… yes they have something like 600 horses training but still they would know every m2 of that course

[CabooseKid 7]

Poor old Trentham and track staff  - the cancellation yesterday from the slips in the last race resulting from the riders going extremely wide. This in turn was triggered by the rail being out 6m, the pack following the leader who also sat a good 6m wide of the rail seeking better ground and then the horses that slipped trying to 4-5 horses wide - so hit the unirrigated patches of the track that were dry until the raceday morning when 11mm of rain fell.

Really the outside rail needs to  align more with the irrigated/usable race track - in the last year they have replaced the outside rail along the straight with a movable plastic version but this has not happened around the corner. This would allow the outside rail to be bought in if needed. However this was the widest a horse has ever raced on a summer raceday in my memory and likely in the 100+ years of racing at Trentham.

[mr_gee 417]

one  thing i notice with  our  jockeys when these days  are called off,  not all   jockeys are in agreeance  and  i know it was case last night at   auckland  ,  there was a number of jockeys that wanted to call meeting off /  dowgrade the  track   and  i seen  it recently  with another track   jokey slipped   and  then told  after meeting   jockey wanted to get home quicker as they were going to a concert  surely,   the   way they decided  the track is unsafe  should be seen even before the race day starts  ( if that is really the  case  

 

 

for mine  i think we need better educate our  jockeys if they  slipped yesterday at trentham  for same stakes  as auckland  would it gone ahead or  called off you be the judge 

[Contentious 616]

1 hour ago, Benbatl said:

Yet the likes and Randwick have 24-26 full time track staff… yes they have something like 600 horses training but still they would know every m2 of that course

And some chair warming administrator here with a degree in nothing useful, would say that Trentham has less than 6 horses in training so based on Randwicks figures we only need point two six of a person per week to look after the track

 

[Chris Wood 1,577]

Martin Collins hasn’t walked away at all Benbati, they are in regular contact here in Cambridge, not sure where your getting your info from.