Ohokaman 5,850 Report post Posted May 7, 2018 1 hour ago, Fartoomuch said: Im pretty sure Purdon would have had some say in this decision. Just as Cran's owners decided to sell CM and BOL to the states although in the latters case im not 100% it was a unanimous decision. Both have won there new connections a few $$$$$$$ so perhaps the question to owners of a good horse in NZ is why not race it yourself in USA. The other issue is with all the horses mentioned in multiple ownership interests its always going to be a tough call as to what to do. He certainly did. I thought the owners comment that it was a difficult decision but they were " guided by what Mark told us regarding where he thought the horse was today" was interesting.....you can read into that what you will. Is he still ok, does he have problems, or showing signs of wear...? Let's face it he has nothing left to prove here and would have to win a hell of a lot of races to match a sale price of $4-5m.....just take the money and re invest it in the next Champ....? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohokaman 5,850 Report post Posted May 7, 2018 Even the Aussies are sad.... https://www.racenet.com.au/news/down-under-harness-cops-a-massive-lazarus-blow-20180507 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee270744 684 Report post Posted May 7, 2018 18 hours ago, chelseacol said: Yes they will be gutted - tough part of training to lose horses when sold etc etc. Wonder if their training contract gives them 10% of sale price ??? I'm not sure if trainers ask owners to sign contracts also the 10% is a gentlemans agreement, I could be wrong. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chelseacol 2,488 Report post Posted May 7, 2018 2 hours ago, Lee270744 said: I'm not sure if trainers ask owners to sign contracts also the 10% is a gentlemans agreement, I could be wrong. Yes agreed that is the way of it. Always struck me as remarkably loose for what can be a high $ matter... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double R 260 Report post Posted May 8, 2018 Hi Col, The 10% is a strange one really. What is it actually for? In many cases the trainer recommends to sell, so he understands he will be losing potential training fees and percentages. What would the be position if the connections of a horse take someone else into the partnership, and the horse changes trainers? Does the original trainer get 10% of the newbies buy in? As I am writing this, it has just dawn on me, if we abolished the 10% trainers clause, then there is good chance more horses would stay in N.Z. I think most reasonable owners would give the trainer a gratitude stipend. Look, I know it is tough training horses, and the variables can be cruel at times, and the 10% is a bonus that has been a given in the past, and it is a really hard one to try to be fair on all parties. Cheers. Robert. chelseacol and Iraklis 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iraklis 2,231 Report post Posted May 8, 2018 DoubleR, it's certainly a poser no matter which way you go, from an ardent fans perspective this is the very thing we all fear a fricken sale but that said, I do not begrudge the owners making their decisions after all that's why you breed, buy, and race to hopefully make some cash, and to be so lucky to get one so special why would you not want to give him his shot at the bigtime, it's stinkin for us fans at the time cos we just enjoyed him so much (hehehe reckon the aussies just copped a break) but hey at least he's goin there with a future in front him, I for one will be front an centre watchin his first race, don't care what time I gotta get up either gotta support our boy......GOOOO!!!!! THE MIGHTY, MIGHTY LAZ!!!! Cheers Iraklis Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spikecity 749 Report post Posted May 8, 2018 Lessens the loss after reading this - I think “Incredibly hard decision”- owner of Lazarus on USA sale 08 May 2018 NZ HARNESS NEWS The decision to part with the pacer of a generation was “incredibly hard” for the man that selected him as a yearling and raced him to dizzying heights over four seasons. But ultimately, Phil Kennard says, he felt an obligation to give Lazarus the chance to be a trail-blazer for the New Zealand breed. “The opportunity being given to ‘Laz’ to be a great stallion and return to New Zealand is some solace,” he said. Last month, Lazarus’ new owners, Taylor Made Stallions in Kentucky, opened communications with Kennard, his wife Glenys and fellow co-owners Trevor Casey and Kevin Riseley and trainers Mark Purdon and Natalie Rasmussen about what they envisioned for New Zealand’s richest ever pacer. “They had a vision and they spent a lot of time talking with us about what that was,” said Kennard. It was an idea that held merit – and more money – and subsequently leap-frogged a proposal put to the owners by Alabar Stud that would see the horse race on here for another season. “That (Alabar) was our first option and we were definitely in their camp to start with,” said Kennard “Then the other thing came as a bolt out of the blue. “Once we started talking to Mark and Natalie, and there was a lot of discussion, they really said to us that he was probably only up for a fairly limited season ahead. “He would be lightly-raced and then retired.” The intense physical demands of racing at the highest level may well have taken a toll on Lazarus’ body and, despite him getting a clean bill of health last month, there was a nagging belief with his trainers that the ride may soon be over on the track. So, Taylor Made’s plans for a micro-campaign in North America later this year, that could be as little as four races before retirement, suddenly seemed to fit in nicely when partnered with the shuttle stallion idea. But for the Kennards especially, the decision would come at great cost on multiple levels. “The major thing for us was that we always wanted him to try and join history and have a go at the three-peat in the New Zealand Cup in November.” Beyond that, there is also the obligation they felt to the public. After all, Lazarus is arguably the best standardbred any young fan has seen and one of the all-time greats for those with a few more years in the memory bank. “He was a horse that was enjoyed by any and all harness racing enthusiasts. “Wherever he went, he drew people to the track; I remember at the Hunter Cup in Melbourne earlier this year they had to stop people from going down the walkways at Melton to get a look at him. “They had to queue and they were lining up two or three-deep to see him. “Even if only ten or a dozen extra people were coming to the track to see him, that was important to us so to see scenes like that was amazing.” For the Kennards, Lazarus’ departure follows Smolda’s retirement and Heaven Rocks’ sale to America in the past year. It means they will now look to the next wave of horses to carry the torch and that is, of course, headlined by star four-year-old Ultimate Machete. “We’ve got him on the way back from injury, as well as Thefixer and then there are a couple of nice rising four-year-olds that had a few health issues this season in The Devils Own and Spankem. “So, there is a reasonable base of a team there, but it certainly doesn’t go anywhere near replacing the three names we’ve lost in the last year.“ Selling what is likely to be the best horse you’ll ever race ahead of a third New Zealand Cup attempt can’t have been easy. “It’s a pain that hasn’t gone away yet,” said Kennard, pangs of regret evident in his voice. “But, as Mark said, the opportunity for the horse, and the deal put in front of us, it’s a massive thing for him and the industry. “To have a horse go in this direction and look to become the first New Zealand-born shuttle sire that has raced in North America, that’s very exciting.” Christian Cullen stood one season in North America, in 2009, but as he was 15-years-old and nine years retired with no track profile in the Northern Hemisphere, he only got a limited book and left 26 foals. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double R 260 Report post Posted May 8, 2018 1 hour ago, Spikecity said: Lessens the loss after reading this - I think “Incredibly hard decision”- owner of Lazarus on USA sale 08 May 2018 NZ HARNESS NEWS The decision to part with the pacer of a generation was “incredibly hard” for the man that selected him as a yearling and raced him to dizzying heights over four seasons. But ultimately, Phil Kennard says, he felt an obligation to give Lazarus the chance to be a trail-blazer for the New Zealand breed. “The opportunity being given to ‘Laz’ to be a great stallion and return to New Zealand is some solace,” he said. Last month, Lazarus’ new owners, Taylor Made Stallions in Kentucky, opened communications with Kennard, his wife Glenys and fellow co-owners Trevor Casey and Kevin Riseley and trainers Mark Purdon and Natalie Rasmussen about what they envisioned for New Zealand’s richest ever pacer. “They had a vision and they spent a lot of time talking with us about what that was,” said Kennard. It was an idea that held merit – and more money – and subsequently leap-frogged a proposal put to the owners by Alabar Stud that would see the horse race on here for another season. “That (Alabar) was our first option and we were definitely in their camp to start with,” said Kennard “Then the other thing came as a bolt out of the blue. “Once we started talking to Mark and Natalie, and there was a lot of discussion, they really said to us that he was probably only up for a fairly limited season ahead. “He would be lightly-raced and then retired.” The intense physical demands of racing at the highest level may well have taken a toll on Lazarus’ body and, despite him getting a clean bill of health last month, there was a nagging belief with his trainers that the ride may soon be over on the track. So, Taylor Made’s plans for a micro-campaign in North America later this year, that could be as little as four races before retirement, suddenly seemed to fit in nicely when partnered with the shuttle stallion idea. But for the Kennards especially, the decision would come at great cost on multiple levels. “The major thing for us was that we always wanted him to try and join history and have a go at the three-peat in the New Zealand Cup in November.” Beyond that, there is also the obligation they felt to the public. After all, Lazarus is arguably the best standardbred any young fan has seen and one of the all-time greats for those with a few more years in the memory bank. “He was a horse that was enjoyed by any and all harness racing enthusiasts. “Wherever he went, he drew people to the track; I remember at the Hunter Cup in Melbourne earlier this year they had to stop people from going down the walkways at Melton to get a look at him. “They had to queue and they were lining up two or three-deep to see him. “Even if only ten or a dozen extra people were coming to the track to see him, that was important to us so to see scenes like that was amazing.” For the Kennards, Lazarus’ departure follows Smolda’s retirement and Heaven Rocks’ sale to America in the past year. It means they will now look to the next wave of horses to carry the torch and that is, of course, headlined by star four-year-old Ultimate Machete. “We’ve got him on the way back from injury, as well as Thefixer and then there are a couple of nice rising four-year-olds that had a few health issues this season in The Devils Own and Spankem. “So, there is a reasonable base of a team there, but it certainly doesn’t go anywhere near replacing the three names we’ve lost in the last year.“ Selling what is likely to be the best horse you’ll ever race ahead of a third New Zealand Cup attempt can’t have been easy. “It’s a pain that hasn’t gone away yet,” said Kennard, pangs of regret evident in his voice. “But, as Mark said, the opportunity for the horse, and the deal put in front of us, it’s a massive thing for him and the industry. “To have a horse go in this direction and look to become the first New Zealand-born shuttle sire that has raced in North America, that’s very exciting.” Christian Cullen stood one season in North America, in 2009, but as he was 15-years-old and nine years retired with no track profile in the Northern Hemisphere, he only got a limited book and left 26 foals. This is a ownership partnership, and majority will rule in most cases, and there can always be room for disappointment by one or more parties involved. I do feel for the parties who may have wanted to keep Lazarus under their wing. Cheers. Robert. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterEd 332 Report post Posted May 8, 2018 Good stayers nearly always make good milers. He went 1-52.4 at Addington suggesting he would go under 1-50 in the States without breaking a sweat. The draws were not kind to him in the Miracle miles Iraklis 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fartoomuch 1,376 Report post Posted May 8, 2018 2 hours ago, Spikecity said: Lessens the loss after reading this - I think “Incredibly hard decision”- owner of Lazarus on USA sale 08 May 2018 NZ HARNESS NEWS The decision to part with the pacer of a generation was “incredibly hard” for the man that selected him as a yearling and raced him to dizzying heights over four seasons. But ultimately, Phil Kennard says, he felt an obligation to give Lazarus the chance to be a trail-blazer for the New Zealand breed. “The opportunity being given to ‘Laz’ to be a great stallion and return to New Zealand is some solace,” he said. Last month, Lazarus’ new owners, Taylor Made Stallions in Kentucky, opened communications with Kennard, his wife Glenys and fellow co-owners Trevor Casey and Kevin Riseley and trainers Mark Purdon and Natalie Rasmussen about what they envisioned for New Zealand’s richest ever pacer. “They had a vision and they spent a lot of time talking with us about what that was,” said Kennard. It was an idea that held merit – and more money – and subsequently leap-frogged a proposal put to the owners by Alabar Stud that would see the horse race on here for another season. “That (Alabar) was our first option and we were definitely in their camp to start with,” said Kennard “Then the other thing came as a bolt out of the blue. “Once we started talking to Mark and Natalie, and there was a lot of discussion, they really said to us that he was probably only up for a fairly limited season ahead. “He would be lightly-raced and then retired.” The intense physical demands of racing at the highest level may well have taken a toll on Lazarus’ body and, despite him getting a clean bill of health last month, there was a nagging belief with his trainers that the ride may soon be over on the track. So, Taylor Made’s plans for a micro-campaign in North America later this year, that could be as little as four races before retirement, suddenly seemed to fit in nicely when partnered with the shuttle stallion idea. But for the Kennards especially, the decision would come at great cost on multiple levels. “The major thing for us was that we always wanted him to try and join history and have a go at the three-peat in the New Zealand Cup in November.” Beyond that, there is also the obligation they felt to the public. After all, Lazarus is arguably the best standardbred any young fan has seen and one of the all-time greats for those with a few more years in the memory bank. “He was a horse that was enjoyed by any and all harness racing enthusiasts. “Wherever he went, he drew people to the track; I remember at the Hunter Cup in Melbourne earlier this year they had to stop people from going down the walkways at Melton to get a look at him. “They had to queue and they were lining up two or three-deep to see him. “Even if only ten or a dozen extra people were coming to the track to see him, that was important to us so to see scenes like that was amazing.” For the Kennards, Lazarus’ departure follows Smolda’s retirement and Heaven Rocks’ sale to America in the past year. It means they will now look to the next wave of horses to carry the torch and that is, of course, headlined by star four-year-old Ultimate Machete. “We’ve got him on the way back from injury, as well as Thefixer and then there are a couple of nice rising four-year-olds that had a few health issues this season in The Devils Own and Spankem. “So, there is a reasonable base of a team there, but it certainly doesn’t go anywhere near replacing the three names we’ve lost in the last year.“ Selling what is likely to be the best horse you’ll ever race ahead of a third New Zealand Cup attempt can’t have been easy. “It’s a pain that hasn’t gone away yet,” said Kennard, pangs of regret evident in his voice. “But, as Mark said, the opportunity for the horse, and the deal put in front of us, it’s a massive thing for him and the industry. “To have a horse go in this direction and look to become the first New Zealand-born shuttle sire that has raced in North America, that’s very exciting.” Christian Cullen stood one season in North America, in 2009, but as he was 15-years-old and nine years retired with no track profile in the Northern Hemisphere, he only got a limited book and left 26 foals. i thought that Mark gave his thoughts on what he liked and left it to his owners, in this case the Kennards to do the bidding at sales time and syndicate it thereafter Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
globederby12 1,495 Report post Posted May 8, 2018 Pardon my ignorance on this topic , but presumably with the advent of AI , then much like some overseas sires e.g. Love You for instance, we may see frozen semen filter back down here from him.? Double R 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enteebee 61 Report post Posted May 8, 2018 10 minutes ago, globederby12 said: Pardon my ignorance on this topic , but presumably with the advent of AI , then much like some overseas sires e.g. Love You for instance, we may see frozen semen filter back down here from him.? He will shuttle back and forwards as fresh chilled semen is so much better than frozen for most mares. globederby12 and Fartoomuch 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iraklis 2,231 Report post Posted May 8, 2018 Great article Spike thanks for posting still smarting at loosin him from here yup I am, but understand......NUTS!!!! !@#$@! it all!!!! it always feels like shite when the Champions go even tho you know at some stage they will retire or go to stud, you know they're still here not thousands of miles away......nuts again! Cheers Iraklis Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fartoomuch 1,376 Report post Posted May 9, 2018 22 hours ago, Iraklis said: Great article Spike thanks for posting still smarting at loosin him from here yup I am, but understand......NUTS!!!! !@#$@! it all!!!! it always feels like shite when the Champions go even tho you know at some stage they will retire or go to stud, you know they're still here not thousands of miles away......nuts again! Cheers Iraklis Agreed I Man but looking ahead with all those prize money increases at ATC you should be getting better racing in the future on a weekly basis if the trainers can get their marketing caps on Iraklis 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CosmicBlackie 128 Report post Posted May 10, 2018 I know his ownership module was varied and they are running it as a business, and there is no room for sentiment, but I could, would never part with him, even if he was showing wear and tear. Man, for an animal to be able to give you those thrills and that lifestyle, he’d be buried somewhere on my place in time to come. Iraklis and ivanthegreat 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fartoomuch 1,376 Report post Posted May 10, 2018 7 hours ago, CosmicBlackie said: I know his ownership module was varied and they are running it as a business, and there is no room for sentiment, but I could, would never part with him, even if he was showing wear and tear. Man, for an animal to be able to give you those thrills and that lifestyle, he’d be buried somewhere on my place in time to come. Sir Patrick Hogan would be in full agreement Cosmic and proved it time and time again Alan B 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Piper 408 Report post Posted May 10, 2018 On 06/05/2018 at 10:44 PM, 2Piper said: Harnesslink reports he will run at the Red Mile twice in October then onto Pocono for Breeders Crown. Then its getting ready for stud duties. With him being a Bettors Delight over Cullen will be good over there as services per stallion over there are capped each year. Here there are an abundance of Cullen and Bettors mares in which will not be bred to him. Leaves Art Major, Falcon Seelster and Mach Three mares for him commercially here and in Aussie. Someone mentioned his service fee could be as high as 10k . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohokaman 5,850 Report post Posted May 11, 2018 Those comments in that article pretty much confirmed he was coming to the end of it. Not surprising then that they took the decision they did. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...