4bettor-orworse

Yes indeed, very sad photos, the ones you posted Barry. Haven't been out to the park for a few months so they came as bit of a shock. Thank you for all your work: both for promoting awareness about the challenges the Noel J Taylor Hall of fame was facing and for your work in keeping the hope alive that the artifacts representing the history of the sport might one day be resurrected in a brand new housing.

FULL CIRCLE, JUST ABOUT... 1997/09/17

Ah yes, that could be it!

HRNZ seems to be back up now.

Ok, so the TAB site is down. It does happen from time to time, disproportionately on key horse racing dates. But the HRNZ site is also non-responsive as well. Anybody on here with sufficient technical knowledge to explain why both sites would be down simultaneously? Hmmmm

More signage around the racecourse and within the stands would help make people aware of the museum and possibly encourage them to take a look at the wonderful collection of artifacts inside. There are very few collections of racing memorabilia like the Hall of Fame in existence - and to think it could be lost for the sake of car parking is a travesty. Honestly, what are the dimensions of the land? How many car parking spaces would be gained? Perhaps 30? Thanks Barry for helping to make folk aware of the taonga that could be lost and the hard work put in by many volunteers over the years.

Hi Tasman Man. That was quite a response! Possibly overkill , relative to the point I was trying to make, but a great collection of anecdotes nonetheless! I don't post a lot in here these days but I've been part of the cafe long enough to know you're one of the stalwarts. Also long enough to have noticed the decline in interest in talking about harness racing in general. Even major races and meetings don't attract all that much discussion nowadays. I suppose that was what I was saying really. The way I worded my previous post was probably a bit deceptive in two ways: I'm possibly waaaay older that what you realise. Maybe not of your generation but I hit the half-century next year! Old enough to be part of the "lost generation" (except I wasn't lost) I also quite enjoy reminiscing about days gone by too - but there seem to be so few left who do. (But as you point out, some might do so via PM)

Was only a child at the time but the 83 series sticks in my mind. I was more interested in running around and badgering grandad for a chocolate bar from the tuck shop behind the main stand roughly somewhere around where the admin offices now are. I remember the horses' names vividly and have rewatched the series videos in more recent years. Pacers: Popular alm, armalight, gamalight, hands down, bonnies chance. A series dominated by the aussies but Delightful Lady got a third placing in the final. Trotters: Scotch Notch, Jenner, Basil Dean, Stormy Morn Two distance / start anomolies: I think the 83 series above had a round of standing start mile races In more recent times there was a 3200m mobile final.

I suppose one could always do the research on HRNZ. But to be able to answer those questions off the the top of one's head, you'd need to be of a certain age. How many people are there still out there that would be old enough to have that knowledge whilst being "young enough" to want to engage in social media. A pretty small intersection I would have thought.

I don't feel like going through everything posted above, point by point, except to say... In terms of the overall tenor, the long-term perspective and analysis, one of the best and most pertinent posts made in the cafe for some considerable time! It will, however, quickly get pushed down the lineup of forum threads. Far more imprtant things to talk about.... what do you think about Geoff Small? where should the next jewels be held? Like Mick Guerin? Purdon dominance good for the game? What commentators get your goat? Are the TAB cutting their throat by restricting successful punters? What were the stipes thinking? What driver just blew your hard-earned? Who cares about attracting future generations and broadening the appeal when we can put a bit more into the the pockets of the aging baby-boomers? (Ok , Ok, its not quite as simple as that)

Good on you Graigosx for sharing these videos. I had already seen the restored 1953 NZ cup video prior and was going to share a link myself - but never got around to it. What remarkable footage. I wish there was more video of that quality available. As for the crowd... well it just is what it is. 1953 - what else was there to do in those days? The first TV broadcast, of any form, was still 7 years away. TV didn't start in NZ 'til 1960! Give a few years for things to gain momentum, and a few more for developments in broadcasting and who knows when the first actual live televised horse race was? I'm sure there are boffins out there who will know. I doubt there was off-course betting back then. Look at the fashion as well - goodness me! There are actually some men without hats! (a minority though) Although, it is easy to yearn for crowds of that size today, given the poor attendance at most race meetings these days, its also worth noting that crowds of that size are physically uncomfortable to be part of - especially in warmer weather. I guess there is an optimum attendance that creates the perfect balance of atmosphere and comfort.

All water under the bride or ambulance at the bottom of the cliff stuff really. Especially, seeing that most people realise that investing in a horse is a losing propostion financially - its only the entertainment / social factor that gets them involved. The points raised above only address the issue of stakes return to existing owners. What will get new people involved in the game? New revenue streams for the ATC to help boost stakes only benefit existing owners. What relevance does that have to somebody that has never been to a race meeting before (or indeed to somebody that has been to a 1000 + but sees the folley in it all?)

Have attended 22 of the past 24 NYE meetings at Alexandra Park. Back in the 90s, it was a night meeting with fireworks to see in the new year. For the past decade (or more) it has been a day meeting 'til 2015. This year we had the compromise of a twilight meeting. Although it is fair to say that today's meeting did not have the crowd numbers of the 90s and earlier, I am of the opinion that both the overall crowd and atmosphere were an improvement on the day meetings of the past decade or so. Despite the calibre of horse on display, those day meetings completely lacked any atmosphere or sense of occasion. The relatively small number of people on the fence line is somewhat deceptive. The crowd was very good in the public stands today. The other aspect is Auckland itself. It would seem that the vast majority (75%???) either leave the city or have a night at home to see in the new year. Driving around the city today, its is hard to believe how dead the place feels compared to the usual hectic rat race. Something else to take into account is the Purdon domination. A dodgy topic yes, considering the recent gossiping. It is hard to believe that anyone would think that it won't have a detrimental effect on the sport in the long term. The problem is, in these social media dominated times, public thinking tends to be very binary. You're either a cheerleader or a hater. But it doesn't have to be that way. One can still admire that stable's achievements but at the same time see that it can't be healthy for the industry as a whole. And yet another factor is betting. NZ cup day at addington has some hot favourites yet still plenty of opportunities to bet. Auckland's premier meeting has a very predictable feeling to it, betting wise. Perhaps one solution, attendance-wise, is to change the date. Am I correct in saying that attaching the cup to NYE has only occurred from the 90's onwards? Looking at race cards from the 80's, they seemed to run the cup either on a) the last friday or saturday in December that didn't clash with Christmas or NYE or the first or second week in January.

I think societal evolution rather than social revolution is the more appropriate term . Society is evolving and racing will struggle to remain relevant. At the end of the day, racing falls into the entertainment category (for the general public). Regardless of diversification, we're still left with the concept of horses running around a track and that has to compete with so many other forms of entertainment. The examples of product diversification - or initiatives (whatever term you wish to you use) that have come into being over the past 20 years include: The harness jewels concept as a new race day "event" (popularity waning though) New betting platforms - ie internet and mobile devices Opportunities that offer 'hands-on' active involvement such as Kidz Kartz and amateur driving (needs to be supported, not frowned upon as they bring in new participants/ maintain horse numbers) Various syndicated ownership models that reduce the cost to individuals. Are these enough though?

Perhaps, its down to the fact there is still just under a month to go. Maybe the community is just tired of the discussion. It could be people have just 'wisened' up. We are yet to see the biannual 'Cambridge not suitable for Jewels because of draw bias' discussion emerge in here. To be honest, it amazed me that the discussion received so much mile-age (excuse the pun). If the jewels are becoming stale, its not the track at fault. Neither is it the distance. Its because the entire card consists of age-group racing. Age-group racing is very hierarchical and by this late stage in the season, the hierarchy is usually pretty clear. If one horse is head and shoulders above its 'rivals', draw generally won't matter. If the hierarchy is more compressed (evenness amongst the group) then obviously, draw does play a part. To this end, Cambridge is not fundamentally different to other tracks. Predictability is whats making the Jewels stale. Only the 2yo trotters and some fillies races contain an element of surprise. Look at the record for the 4yo emerald division: 2007 favourite 2008 2nd fav 2009 fav 2010 fav 2011 4th fav (an "outsider") 2012 fav 2013 fav 2014 fav 2015 fav