say no more

World Cup of Tipping Round 1 - Entry Thread - Sat 10 Sept

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Please read this very carefully - because we are now participating in individual H2H contests, to ensure an interesting contest and some differentiation in selections, if you post after your H2H opponent, you will need to have at least 7 of your 24 selections different to your opponents picks.

Pretty simple to check if your opponent has posted and check that your picks are sufficiently different.  Hopefully shouldn't happen often, but if it does I will let you know as as soon as possible to give you time to rectify before the posting deadline.  If you haven't rectified prior to posting deadline, you won't be disqualified but I will drop selections (not BB selections) starting from the final race and working backwards until you have only 17 picks in common with your opponent.

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Pick two horses in each of the 12 races listed below and nominate two races as your best bet races.  You'll have $10 each way on both runners and a $2 quinella - double for your two best bet races.

Posting deadline is 1.30pm on Saturday.

Scratchings can be replaced up until posting deadline, after which you'll default to the sub (or second favourite if you already have the sub).

Hastings R5
Hastings R6
Hastings R7
Hastings R8
Hastings R9
Rosehill R6
Rosehill R7
Rosehill R8

Rosehill R9
Flemington R5
Flemington R7
Flemington R8

Please post horse numbers (not names) and remember two best bet races, and at least 7 different selections to your opponent's.

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If you missed last week and you're not in the 54 seeds, you are still welcome to post some picks on here.   There is a chance that one or more of the 54 won't post picks at the weekend, and I will slot new entrants in in place of those who haven't shown up.

If we have more no shows than roll-ups, I will post some random picks to ensure nobody gets a walk-over win.  The random picks can't earn the no shows a win but will give the no show's opponent something to beat.

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May I ask why these rulings not put in place in the original entry thread????

But I understand why you have put them in place, but its a tipping comp some people do there form and thats there selections and it is hard to choose another 1/2 when you have done the form already, why should I have to redo the form because of someone else its a head to head comp and if it ends up a draw thats life. . . . . 

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2 hours ago, Theladdownsouth said:

May I ask why these rulings not put in place in the original entry thread????

But I understand why you have put them in place, but its a tipping comp some people do there form and thats there selections and it is hard to choose another 1/2 when you have done the form already, why should I have to redo the form because of someone else its a head to head comp and if it ends up a draw thats life. . . . . 

You sound very similar to a recent poster who is not here anymore...I hope you are not Archer as If you are you will get found out.You sound very accusatory like he was. The comps are for FUN please dont forget that and saynomore gives up his time for free...so please either just roll with the comps or dont enter...I do not need or want stress associated to fun Saturdays...cheers.

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1 hour ago, scooby3051 said:

You sound very similar to a recent poster who is not here anymore...I hope you are not Archer as If you are you will get found out.You sound very accusatory like he was. The comps are for FUN please dont forget that and saynomore gives up his time for free...so please either just roll with the comps or dont enter...I do not need or want stress associated to fun Saturdays...cheers.

No I am that person you are referring to just asking a valud question in my opinion have a great competition. 

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Hastings R5 1,2
Hastings R6 3,7
Hastings R7 1,2 BB
Hastings R8 5,10
Hastings R9 8,9
Rosehill R6 4,11
Rosehill R7 1,11
Rosehill R8 2,9
Rosehill R9 2,6 BB
Flemington R5 1,7
Flemington R7 3,11
Flemington R8 4,10

There you go say no more thanks for running the comp and all the best to the rest of the team on Saturday.

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I think regarding the question at hand , being 'docked' runners because you may have the same as an opponent is pretty harsh.

Most Players wait until scratchings time has passed to post their picks and make the necessary changes. ( So the scorer isn't swamped with changes ) 

Now we are supposed (encouraged) to post ahead of head to head opponent ?  so you get the better horses. ? or Not get docked runners ? (If say both players were picking the 12 x Top 2 fav's each ......which is possible I guess..............   but seems Very unlikely. I'm not scratching around looking for opponents picks and then delving through them whatever the case. Changing your picks because someone else picked them is never a great strategy.

Even if you had 23 selections the same as a Head to Head opponent (astronimically unlikely) , the chance of the one remaining 'Differing Runner' paying exactly the same (or running exactly the same placing) are quite Long . A tie is unlikely.  

regards PS  

 

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14 minutes ago, Pure Steel said:

I think regarding the question at hand , being 'docked' runners because you may have the same as an opponent is pretty harsh.

Most Players wait until scratchings time has passed to post their picks and make the necessary changes. ( So the scorer isn't swamped with changes ) 

Now we are supposed (encouraged) to post ahead of head to head opponent ?  so you get the better horses. ? or Not get docked runners ? (If say both players were picking the 12 x Top 2 fav's each ......which is possible I guess..............   but seems Very unlikely. I'm not scratching around looking for opponents picks and then delving through them whatever the case. Changing your picks because someone else picked them is never a great strategy.

Even if you had 23 selections the same as a Head to Head opponent (astronimically unlikely) , the chance of the one remaining 'Differing Runner' paying exactly the same (or running exactly the same placing) are quite Long . A tie is unlikely.  

regards PS  

 

Thanks for backing up my Question.

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6 minutes ago, PeteL said:

Another iconic tipping comp had this rule in place for years and never a yelp was heard about it.

Can't see what all the fuss is about. If the complainant is who I think they are this won't be the only gripe to surface.

I was only the first person to bring it up in this thread but have had support around my question.

I am not that person at hand your talking about,  I was just asking a genuine question and getting knocked down for doing so. 

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1 hour ago, scooby3051 said:

Rules are the rules follow them for the fun of it or dont play very simple.....saynomore does this week after week for everyones enjoyment and for fun...if its not fun for you guys dont enter...cheers.

Never said anything about it not being fun . Already looking forward to taking Pete on , on Guinea's Day . Should be heaps of Fun  lol........ 

1 hour ago, PeteL said:

Can't see what all the fuss is about.

No Fuss.... just a comment to say it could be easier for SayNoMore with his scoring and counting people's tips and scratchings , and posters too.............>>>>>

By considering dropping an Un-Necessary Rule . was just an opinion to save 'Docking' peoples tips.  That can't be much Fun Shirly but anyway ... sorry for offence caused . Back to the Fun then of picking some winners .................  And thank you Scooby and Pete and Say No More for your Great Comps !!!!!!  well done chaps.

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3 hours ago, Pure Steel said:

I think regarding the question at hand , being 'docked' runners because you may have the same as an opponent is pretty harsh.

Most Players wait until scratchings time has passed to post their picks and make the necessary changes. ( So the scorer isn't swamped with changes ) 

Now we are supposed (encouraged) to post ahead of head to head opponent ?  so you get the better horses. ? or Not get docked runners ? (If say both players were picking the 12 x Top 2 fav's each ......which is possible I guess..............   but seems Very unlikely. I'm not scratching around looking for opponents picks and then delving through them whatever the case. Changing your picks because someone else picked them is never a great strategy.

Even if you had 23 selections the same as a Head to Head opponent (astronimically unlikely) , the chance of the one remaining 'Differing Runner' paying exactly the same (or running exactly the same placing) are quite Long . A tie is unlikely.  

At the risk of extending this discussion further, here are my thoughts on this PS, and some of the thinking behind the rule.

  • This rule is not intended to avoid "ties"
  • Using your 23 selections example, imagine a situation where we didn't have this rule, and you post first.  One of your 24 picks is a bit of a roughie.  Your opponent could look at your picks, replicate your other 23 picks and put a favourite in instead of your roughie.  Your H2H match then comes down a one runner shootout between your roughie and their favourite.   In this example your opponent had a significant second player advantage.  This is what we're trying to protect against.
  • Looking for your opponents picks and jotting them down on a piece of paper besides your picks would take no more than a couple of minutes.  I spend a bit more time than this capturing everyone's picks.
  • If you don't look at your opponents picks before posting then the chances of having more than 17 in common are very slim - so no problem.  And on the off chance that you do, I will let you know and give you time to remediate.
  • I'm not encouraging anyone to post early - I was simply responding to the original post by saying that if you're bothered by the rule, then you might want to post early.
  • Being docked runners is a lot less harsh than being disqualified for too many picks in common - seems like the fairest approach to me.

Looking forward to the comp on Saturday and some great racing. 

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35 minutes ago, Pure Steel said:

Never said anything about it not being fun . Already looking forward to taking Pete on , on Guinea's Day . Should be heaps of Fun  lol........ 

No Fuss.... just a comment to say it could be easier for SayNoMore with his scoring and counting people's tips and scratchings , and posters too.............>>>>>

By considering dropping an Un-Necessary Rule . was just an opinion to save 'Docking' peoples tips.  That can't be much Fun Shirly but anyway ... sorry for offence caused . Back to the Fun then of picking some winners .................  And thank you Scooby and Pete and Say No More for your Great Comps !!!!!!  well done chaps.

100% agree it just seems a stage ruling and thats why I questioned it. In my opinion we are here to tip the winning horse not out tip the other person and in my own opinion if yous come up with the same horses so be it. 

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1 hour ago, Theladdownsouth said:

In my opinion we are here to tip the winning horse not out tip the other person and in my own opinion if yous come up with the same horses so be it. 

The concept of 'Head to Head' being overlooked here ? possibly .......

I've been away from the Cafe for a while but clearly remember the 'referenced person' - A right pain in the Archer! 

Thanks in advance to SNM for the weeks of work that are ahead of you. Your efforts are well appreciated by the majority I'm sure.

Cheers,

Phil

 

 

 

Edited by Alf Riston

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