Berri 2,131 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 We are on a slippery slope and the slope is as slippery as many of NZ's race tracks. Check this video out... A branch for heavens. He gives it a couple of smacks around the arse, not bad, and he's suspended in the UK. This is going to be a problem Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
say no more 2,747 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 a couple? May seem ok to horse people but possibly not to your average person. Popped up on TV News the other day and my family - not PC types or animal lovers - were pretty shocked by it. I guess everyone sees it differently. Memphis3, Leggy and Palliser 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leggy 4,084 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 A couple? With a branch? And here I am trying to get new people involved in racing. And they are wondering if that's how we treat them. Yes, different strokes for different folks I guess. Memphis3 and chelseacol 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeepers 276 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 While this is an equestrian training video and not racing it is only a matter of time before a complaint is lodged about the starter using a whip to get difficult horses into a barrier as sometimes shown on racing tv. Times have changed. dock leaf and Leggy 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berri 2,131 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 I was more worried that Mark wasn't going to get kicked in the head. Video was made a couple of years ago and listen to the players watching this. Horse went on the win his next event and became quite a good horse. If I had been given a dollar for every time a horse got one round the backside, or a dog got a swift kick, I'd be millionaire. It's going too far. This is not one of those occasions where you take away the livelihood of one of the best horsemen on the planet. Tauhei Notts and Breeder 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobysnacks 386 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 Had it been a whip, would there be a problem here? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memphis3 1,263 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 Prob looked worse because the leaves fell off the branch. Still not a good look in this day and age op Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leggy 4,084 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 5 hours ago, Berri said: I was more worried that Mark wasn't going to get kicked in the head. Video was made a couple of years ago and listen to the players watching this. Horse went on the win his next event and became quite a good horse. If I had been given a dollar for every time a horse got one round the backside, or a dog got a swift kick, I'd be millionaire. It's going too far. This is not one of those occasions where you take away the livelihood of one of the best horsemen on the planet. Yes, but unfortunately that's not a good demonstration of his outstanding horsemanship as he has readily acknowledged. Pain and fear are not an acceptable teaching method for horses or any animal these days. As Monty Roberts would say, "Adrenaline Up, Learning Down. Adrenaline Down, Learning Up”. There are kinder, more effective ways and this sadly is not a good look. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berri 2,131 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 Seriously....This is teaching a horse to jump into a water jump at it's first attempt...hence the video. How many times have you seen a horse get a flick of a whip going into the stalls for the first time, or into a swimming pool for the first time. Closest thing available to Mark was a branch he obviously pulled off a tree. He knows what he's doing....it's not cruel....and if you asked the horse I'll bet he would say it didn't hurt. We've all gone mad. We're being turned into a bunch of pussies.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chelseacol 2,488 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 22 minutes ago, Berri said: Seriously....This is teaching a horse to jump into a water jump at it's first attempt...hence the video. How many times have you seen a horse get a flick of a whip going into the stalls for the first time, or into a swimming pool for the first time. Closest thing available to Mark was a branch he obviously pulled off a tree. He knows what he's doing....it's not cruel....and if you asked the horse I'll bet he would say it didn't hurt. We've all gone mad. We're being turned into a bunch of pussies.... I'm not enough of a horseman to give an opinion on training methods. But I am smart enough to realise that the racing game needs to be very careful how it deals with use of the whip, "perceived" animal cruelty etc. Like it or not there are a lot of people who would use any excuse to chip away at the industry with a view to shutting it down. Ethereal 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaneMcAlister 1,425 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 Racing just needs to be a little bit clever. I was in the UK when National Hunt Racing was rebranded to jump racing. I never saw the sense in it (thought just a marketing ploy). Then within six months hunting was banned....and it became obvious why they were distancing themselves. You can't buy "cattle sticks" anymore, but you can buy "sorting poles". Same same but different. If I was NZ racing I would move to reword all documents from the wording "whip" to "corrective aid". I would then let it be known that todays corrective aids are just that and not a whip like past eras.... tasman man, Patiti, Pam Robson and 3 others 4 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leggy 4,084 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 3 hours ago, Berri said: How many times have you seen a horse get a flick of a whip going into the stalls for the first time, or into a swimming pool for the first time. So you think that's an acceptable teaching method too. Do you whip your kids to get them in the pool as well? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooby3051 10,915 Report post Posted February 17, 2022 I think Leggy is right...it is not a good look, however someone obviously has an axe to grind for this to surface years after the event...in this world of over the top PC the industry must protect itself from as much bad publicity as it can or the anti horse racing people will get their wish.....its just a sign of changing times unfortunately. Leggy and redrew2000 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tauhei Notts 1,413 Report post Posted February 18, 2022 I read Shane McAlister's comment several hours ago and thought it was stupid. But, since then I have given it some considerable thought. We have seen many name changes over the past few years and the time has come to remove the word whip from the Rules of Racing and insert the expression "Corrective Aid". Just as fudge packers must be referred to as Gays, whips must henceforth be referred to as Corrective Aids. The English is clumsy, but we live in clumsy times. Then I started thinking about some of those depraved aristocratic Englishmen who need a corrective aid administered to their buttocks by their highly paid dominatrices. Hurt me yelled the masochist. No replied the sadist. chevy86, Memphis3, Baz (NZ) and 1 other 1 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insider 3,960 Report post Posted February 18, 2022 If you don’t think using a wispy branch with a few loose leaves on is a good look WHAT DO YOU THINK OF WHIPS BEING USED EVERY SINGLE RACEDAY in this country. I remember suggesting a few years ago that they be done away with (except for correcting purposes) in a race and where have we got to? If Saundry had at least achieved that, then his salary of 250k might have been worthwhile…. but oh no. I rest my case. Liz Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
