RaceCafe..#1...Tipsters Thread.... Share Your Fancies For Fun...Lets See Who The Best Tipsters Here Are.
Berri

So I missed out...

Recommended Posts

not good enough....CEO of NZTR...

I just hope that the next CEO is as forward thinking and courageous as we need, this being demonstrated in Aussie.

Two new races added to the Magic Millions program....The Debut for horses that have never raced over 900m worth $500,000 and a horse worth $1,000,000 for horses raced in a syndicate with more than 20 owners. I just hope like hell that the new CEO of NZTR has the kahoonas to invent things like this to get the interest flowing...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

37 minutes ago, Berri said:

not good enough....CEO of NZTR...

I just hope that the next CEO is as forward thinking and courageous as we need, this being demonstrated in Aussie.

Two new races added to the Magic Millions program....The Debut for horses that have never raced over 900m worth $500,000 and a horse worth $1,000,000 for horses raced in a syndicate with more than 20 owners. I just hope like hell that the new CEO of NZTR has the kahoonas to invent things like this to get the interest flowing...

Sorry to see you missed out Berri.

We could add an extra two races to our KM night

the Elite Trainers 1600.           Horses only from the Elitist Trainers stables   With the trainer of the winner getting an all expenses paid trip USA  DUBHAI  FRANCE GREAT BRITAIN   Condition will apply. .

An overflow race to the above for those who don’t make the cut . An all expenses  paid trip to the Kumara Raceday 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Berri could find a loophole.......

His horse won the big 'Country Cup' for $500k Stake during Melbourne Cup week.......conditions of the race clearly [ to some] stated that the race was for horses trained by NON-metro trainers !

ie...a chance for the small people.

Berri's horse swoops in and takes the chocolates...with the horse clearly trained at Flemington ! 

Berri sometimes forgets that Aussie racing has a number of things/aspects that NZ racing will always lack.

The big one is MONEY !

Aussie is 5 x times the population , every person spends 3 x times more on gambling ...this fact historical so Aussie in effect about 30 x bigger and richer !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

58 minutes ago, tasman man said:

Berri sometimes forgets that Aussie racing has a number of things/aspects that NZ racing will always lack.

The big one is MONEY !

Many prefer to spend their $$$$$ on properties, sure fire win in NZ😋

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hang on a minute...you're not seeing the balanced view point. In terms of Bermadez, you needed to run in the country and perform well enough to get to that race which of course was held in the city. When you've got a nice horse like Bermadez, and you've had heaps of baby issues (cracked scapula at three, pulled muscle at 4) you have to nurse them along so that they can tell you when they're ready. So this R80 race is worth the value of the Auckland Cup. Due to the structure of the championship, the press that it got, the support that it had from all those trying their hand at winning this R80 race, the betting was 4.67 times the betting of the Auckland Cup. We don't have enough good horses to race against each other so we have to embrace some novel ideas. What say we put together a R80 race with some qualifying races in Australia (definitely with conditions), where the aussie horses were funded to race (travel allowance) in the final in NZ. What would happen? That's the sort of thinking that you need to have a go. I'm not saying it will 100% work, just that we need to become creative because at the moment we're dead. Why might you think that?....I live in NZ and I've just sent another very nice horse to Aussieland to race....go figure....one less

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Berri said:

Hang on a minute...you're not seeing the balanced view point. In terms of Bermadez, you needed to run in the country and perform well enough to get to that race which of course was held in the city. When you've got a nice horse like Bermadez, and you've had heaps of baby issues (cracked scapula at three, pulled muscle at 4) you have to nurse them along so that they can tell you when they're ready. So this R80 race is worth the value of the Auckland Cup. Due to the structure of the championship, the press that it got, the support that it had from all those trying their hand at winning this R80 race, the betting was 4.67 times the betting of the Auckland Cup. We don't have enough good horses to race against each other so we have to embrace some novel ideas. What say we put together a R80 race with some qualifying races in Australia (definitely with conditions), where the aussie horses were funded to race (travel allowance) in the final in NZ. What would happen? That's the sort of thinking that you need to have a go. I'm not saying it will 100% work, just that we need to become creative because at the moment we're dead. Why might you think that?....I live in NZ and I've just sent another very nice horse to Aussieland to race....go figure....one less

Haha...well done with Bermudez , Vic racing obviously saw it better for 8 Country tracks to run heats for the final .....than let battling country trainers race for big money !They should change their advertising as clearly it states ,,,the race is for country trainers licensed in Victoria without a metropolitan base nationwide.

Of course NZ has 2 x Dunstan Feeds finals [ 1600m and 2200 ] on NY day which has heats for R74 and below worth $100k.....which money wise / affordability is similar to the one you won.Dunstans give a bit of sponsorship ,or at least some bags of feed while nominated horses pay an entry fee and a second payment and an acceptance fee which I quickly calculated to be about $40 k which makes it basically a sweepstake race.

NZ owners are a gullible resilient lot.....they not in it for the money.   But it's not genius if you have a nice horse to send it to Aussie  , its bloody obvious !

But when all the nice horses are sold or go off shore to race , don't you think it unfair that you or anyone should then cry on here that NZ Group 1's lack both quality and depth.

Of course they do..... so whose fault is it ? Blame laid fair and square at the feet of NZTR Admin and maybe the TAB. They get their money to implement new exciting races from the betting public who prefer to bet on the nice NZ horses taken to Australia or just Australian racing fullstop.

Spoken to at least 10 folk this week ,regular punters/ ex-attendees on course and without exception they said they love Aussie racing and love watching it on TV...the courses ,the great jockeys the overall excellence of the racing and horses.

I asked...but is it better than the NZ diet of maidens and one win races from Kumara [mainly $12k stakes] and Marton last Saurday ? .....haha.

But who can blame them..so 10 folk at the beach is not a good sample ,more like mother-in-law research so consider the FACTS.

NZ punters .......remember many Kiwis dont use the NZTAB cos bigger Aussie outfits can offer more .......NZ punters bet more on the NZ TAB on Aussie races than NZ races.

And more than 85% of races on TAB  come from overseas. 

NZ tries to copy overseas initiatives....we have Country cups....worth about $30 k ,some higher eg Taupo $65 k after club boost. It's all relative .It's all NZ can afford !

Read the Messara report again ...currently not one track considered a good surface and most facilities below an acceptable standard !

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, gubellini said:

Why don’t clubs get together and organise sponsorship for a Summer and Winter Maiden Series? Qualifying races of $12,000 and say a final of $30,000. 

Maiden races are already worth $12,000 and if they win one they would already be racing in $30,000 races anyhow. And that is basically the same as the MAAT races, or whatever they are called, which never really get very big fields. The $250,000 MM maiden concept might work, but the stipes might be kept busy ensuring everyone really was trying to win in the lead ups.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, gubellini said:

Why don’t clubs get together and organise sponsorship for a Summer and Winter Maiden Series? Qualifying races of $12,000 and say a final of $30,000. 

What would this achieve ?

Historically clubs don't work together in NZ , volunteers stretched enough looking after own club ,though Race , Southern racing and other regions combined administration in recent times and some 'community' clubs run by someone from another community !

Maiden races tend to attract lowest betting .......owners of these slugs tend to hang on to them for a while as they invested heavily in them and they not attractive to sell.

If the idea is to attract more betting ,a spike would be easier to achieve over a Carnival  eg Cup week or Melbourne Cup day when the population hyped into getting involved.

This why NZTR give generous monetary support to the 5 or 6 days big NZ days of racing.

Easier to make the big days bigger than get blood out of stone eg  recently Reefton got 23% increase on last year ,this probably less than 1% of Melbourne Cup day !

Retaining talent and improving our horse quality is a big challenge as the rich Australian and Hong Kong owners need ,and will pay well for , our best stock.

Simply NZ's racing biggest problem is being so close to Australia and their money and Industry which is ably supported by their Governments to be the best .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We’re Doomed most maiden winners race next in R65 midweek $12,000 races not $30,000 Saturday races. Ideally my proposed Maiden Series races would be worth more than the sums I stated. A $50,000 Final would be great. My point is that owners and trainers should be given more incentives to retain horses to race here. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You're still not seeing the picture. If you went into a lottery store and saw there was a prize of $12,000, would you play? If you saw the prize at $30,000, would you play? Then the question would be how big would the prize have to be before you played?

So this is the sort of game that racing has to ask itself, because instead of having to pay $2.00 to have a crack at winning, we are now paying $25,000pa to have a horse in work, or an equivalent of $480 of lottery tickets a week. But in the lotteries you have a chance of winning $1,000,000 as long as no-one else also gets it. So along comes Powerball, where even though the odds are worse, there's $5m up for grabs. Needs to be at least that because that's where people's greed and good luck thresholds are set now-a-days. So start doing the analysis in your heads. What stake would need to be available to entice you to spend $480 per week to get you interested in playing the game? And therein lies the answer which no-one has addressed since I have been involved in racing.

Once you know the answer to that, you've simply got to work out how to get there

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 1/12/2022 at 10:32 AM, tasman man said:

Berri could find a loophole.......

His horse won the big 'Country Cup' for $500k Stake during Melbourne Cup week.......conditions of the race clearly [ to some] stated that the race was for horses trained by NON-metro trainers !

ie...a chance for the small people.

Berri's horse swoops in and takes the chocolates...with the horse clearly trained at Flemington ! 

Berri sometimes forgets that Aussie racing has a number of things/aspects that NZ racing will always lack.

The big one is MONEY !

Aussie is 5 x times the population , every person spends 3 x times more on gambling ...this fact historical so Aussie in effect about 30 x bigger and richer !

Ummm........Cubes never actually went to school but Tasminator......isn't 5 times 3 =14 ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Berri said:

You're still not seeing the picture. If you went into a lottery store and saw there was a prize of $12,000, would you play? If you saw the prize at $30,000, would you play? Then the question would be how big would the prize have to be before you played?

So this is the sort of game that racing has to ask itself, because instead of having to pay $2.00 to have a crack at winning, we are now paying $25,000pa to have a horse in work, or an equivalent of $480 of lottery tickets a week. But in the lotteries you have a chance of winning $1,000,000 as long as no-one else also gets it. So along comes Powerball, where even though the odds are worse, there's $5m up for grabs. Needs to be at least that because that's where people's greed and good luck thresholds are set now-a-days. So start doing the analysis in your heads. What stake would need to be available to entice you to spend $480 per week to get you interested in playing the game? And therein lies the answer which no-one has addressed since I have been involved in racing.

Once you know the answer to that, you've simply got to work out how to get there

Don't think that has anything to do with racing, for me anyway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Cubes said:

Ummm........Cubes never actually went to school but Tasminator......isn't 5 times 3 =14 ?

Cubes, never let the facts get in the way of a good story....sometimes you need to join the dots and stretch things to make a point.

I took two facts and added a bit of inflation , looked at net immigration statistics and considered Newtos law of motion and the pythagoras theorem and came up with the number 30 !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, Berri said:

You're still not seeing the picture. If you went into a lottery store and saw there was a prize of $12,000, would you play? If you saw the prize at $30,000, would you play? Then the question would be how big would the prize have to be before you played?

So this is the sort of game that racing has to ask itself, because instead of having to pay $2.00 to have a crack at winning, we are now paying $25,000pa to have a horse in work, or an equivalent of $480 of lottery tickets a week. But in the lotteries you have a chance of winning $1,000,000 as long as no-one else also gets it. So along comes Powerball, where even though the odds are worse, there's $5m up for grabs. Needs to be at least that because that's where people's greed and good luck thresholds are set now-a-days. So start doing the analysis in your heads. What stake would need to be available to entice you to spend $480 per week to get you interested in playing the game? And therein lies the answer which no-one has addressed since I have been involved in racing.

Once you know the answer to that, you've simply got to work out how to get there

For those horse people ONLY focussed on the money ,Australia is so close and convenient and they have the $$$$ in their racing.

NZ doesn't and this unlikely ever to change in the short to medium term...this a certainty !

Didn't the Government hand the Industry $50 million last year to pay their creditors and build 3 x much needed training tracks.

Auckland / Pukekohe are going to improve stakes but this will increase the gap between rich and poor and the futility of racing for minimum stakes will really test NZ racing's resilience.

Next door ,Sydney and Melbourne are at war to have the biggest !

As to increasing betting and TAB profits for stakes ,good luck with that. 

Our Racing will battle away ,the South Island will keep Harness going and the rest of us will hope we can get in on one good enough to race in Aussie. As you point out often ,our  budget bloodlines make this a slim chance !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.