tripple alliance 1,007 Report post Posted December 11, 2021 So just to be clear the reserve bank (a supposedly independent govt department) creates bonds with is effectively invented money and lends that invented money to the govt who then go out and pump it into the economy . This is why we have a property boom and demand for high value assets , the up coming yearling sales will be a bonanza and plenty will be arriving there in there brand new mercs . In the end the fairy tail money can be written off, it was just an invention , makes you wonder about the real value of money . Is that about right barryb ? Now the passport, if you are into conspiracy theories (I'm not) the passport could have more to do with trialling it for climate change control , tracking and controlling peoples purchases and dominating there lifestyles , tracking your TAB spending etc , if you want something to worrying about and ruin your day worry about that it's more likely than a vaccine pumping a micro chip into your body of other nutter stuff . JJ Flash and dock leaf 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shad 1,540 Report post Posted December 11, 2021 Anyone out there put a submission in on digital currency, and your thoughts on it. meomy 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb 2,062 Report post Posted December 11, 2021 31 minutes ago, tripple alliance said: So just to be clear the reserve bank (a supposedly independent govt department) creates bonds with is effectively invented money and lends that invented money to the govt who then go out and pump it into the economy . This is why we have a property boom and demand for high value assets , the up coming yearling sales will be a bonanza and plenty will be arriving there in there brand new mercs . In the end the fairy tail money can be written off, it was just an invention , makes you wonder about the real value of money . Is that about right barryb ? Now the passport, if you are into conspiracy theories (I'm not) the passport could have more to do with trialling it for climate change control , tracking and controlling peoples purchases and dominating there lifestyles , tracking your TAB spending etc , if you want something to worrying about and ruin your day worry about that it's more likely than a vaccine pumping a micro chip into your body of other nutter stuff . No, the money can't be written off, its the same as any other money borrowed, has an interest rate & must be paid back eventually. But like any money borrowed, if the return exceeds the value of paying it back then there is no hurry. The indebtedness of NZ as rightly pointed out has climbed significantly & makes us less attractive to overseas & internal investers as our ability to cover interest and repayment schedules has worsened, However we are near the bottom of Worlds indebted countries so nothing alarming. Public Debt to GPD Russia 18% NZ 46% China 69% Aus 72% UK 107% US 132% Japan 256% meomy and JJ Flash 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shad 1,540 Report post Posted December 11, 2021 The festive season will be interesting with the party revelers full of alcohol queuing to get in pubs clubs ect, while all vaccine passports are checked along with identification, and cleared, may just add to xmas stress, be interesting to see what unfolds, as many alcohol fuelled patrons don't need to much encouragement for an altercation. meomy 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash 2,115 Report post Posted December 11, 2021 5 hours ago, tripple alliance said: So just to be clear the reserve bank (a supposedly independent govt department) creates bonds with is effectively invented money and lends that invented money to the govt who then go out and pump it into the economy What a load of rubbish. Here's how things really happen and given ive done this stuff for 30 years i have a pretty good insight of QE The government Debt Office which is part of NZ Treasury runs regular bond auctions to either roll over existing debt or create new debt . This debt/bonds is purchased by either private sources eg banks or multi nationals as a means of risk management/investment. Post these auctions where the lowest interest rate is usually accepted by DMO a secondary market also operates. It is here where the RBNZ purchase those bonds and create a NZD transaction to the counter party. Hence they effectively print money/QE whilst at the same time enlarging their own balance sheet. So you can see that all the government has done is hold more auctions to pay for their expenditure from . Hope this helps. Leggy 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz (NZ) 1,719 Report post Posted December 11, 2021 dock leaf, meomy and Gruff 1 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berri 2,131 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 2 hours ago, JJ Flash said: What a load of rubbish. Here's how things really happen and given ive done this stuff for 30 years i have a pretty good insight of QE The government Debt Office which is part of NZ Treasury runs regular bond auctions to either roll over existing debt or create new debt . This debt/bonds is purchased by either private sources eg banks or multi nationals as a means of risk management/investment. Post these auctions where the lowest interest rate is usually accepted by DMO a secondary market also operates. It is here where the RBNZ purchase those bonds and create a NZD transaction to the counter party. Hence they effectively print money/QE whilst at the same time enlarging their own balance sheet. So you can see that all the government has done is hold more auctions to pay for their expenditure from . Hope this helps. I get that and I have always understood how the roundabout occurs. My question was quite simple....who is actually buying the debt? This is the answer I was after. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragamuffin 122 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 On 12/10/2021 at 10:42 PM, Idolmite said: Are you suggesting the numbers are different? Care to provide a link? Govt's own webiste Medsafe hold the stats, which can differ from those being touted by Jakcinda & media, still experimental/ provisional consent "data to support the longer-term safety and efficacy of COVID-19 vaccines is not yet available". Guinea pigs abound Shad, Baz (NZ), meomy and 2 others 3 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leggy 4,010 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 1 hour ago, Berri said: I get that and I have always understood how the roundabout occurs. My question was quite simple....who is actually buying the debt? This is the answer I was after. Any investor who wants to surely. Same as any other bond offers, government or not. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berri 2,131 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 1 hour ago, Leggy said: Any investor who wants to surely. Same as any other bond offers, government or not. So would you be happy if the Chinese were buying up the debt? meomy 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash 2,115 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 4 hours ago, Berri said: I get that and I have always understood how the roundabout occurs. My question was quite simple....who is actually buying the debt? This is the answer I was after. You would be one of the few members of public who does understand the Government debt management Initially, Pension funds, Banks who have to hold NZD denominated bonds, Central banks and last but not least the RBNZ but they only buy in the secondary market. In doing so they exercise some control on interest rates on long term debt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dock leaf 142 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 Getting back to the Covid Passports, I've got a question for the passport cheerleaders. Say I'm a fat old man going to the races at Trentham, I'm ready to flash my passport at the gate but I'm getting held up in the queue and I'm already feeling a bit vulnerable in the crowd despite having had my booster. Once I'm in the gate I shuffle over to the back of the stand and begin to climb the stairs. Because I'm fat and old and used to be a smoker I take my mask off to climb the stairs, while I'm sucking in the big ones some ignorant young bastard that is running down the stairs sneezes right in front of me. So now, I'm huffing and puffing in a panic because I have no faith in the vaccine and I'm paranoid that the youth has delta. Question - Am I glad that the youth has a vax passport? (that could be five months old) OR would I feel safer if he had produced at the gate the negative result of his rapid antigen test he had taken that morning? meomy, Pam Robson, Huey and 1 other 3 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Idolmite 2,460 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 1 hour ago, dock leaf said: Getting back to the Covid Passports, I've got a question for the passport cheerleaders. Say I'm a fat old man going to the races at Trentham, I'm ready to flash my passport at the gate but I'm getting held up in the queue and I'm already feeling a bit vulnerable in the crowd despite having had my booster. Once I'm in the gate I shuffle over to the back of the stand and begin to climb the stairs. Because I'm fat and old and used to be a smoker I take my mask off to climb the stairs, while I'm sucking in the big ones some ignorant young bastard that is running down the stairs sneezes right in front of me. So now, I'm huffing and puffing in a panic because I have no faith in the vaccine and I'm paranoid that the youth has delta. Question - Am I glad that the youth has a vax passport? (that could be five months old) OR would I feel safer if he had produced at the gate the negative result of his rapid antigen test he had taken that morning? The answer is simple. Back number 10 in Race 1. dock leaf 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
meomy 971 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 On 12/11/2021 at 3:45 AM, stodge said: Mrs Stodge and I had our third vaccinations two weeks ago and I strongly suspect we'll be back for round 4 in the spring. All the evidence we're seeing is those who are triple vaccinated, even if they contract the Omicron variant of Coronavirus, will have mild symptoms not requiring hospital treatment. There is a concern for those whose second vaccination was longer than four months ago as there seems some evidence Omicron is more effective against those whose vaccine protection has diminished with time hence the push to get more people over here triple vaccinated. As for Vaccine passports, they will be mandatory for all racecourse admission from next Monday (apparently even a midweek all-weather card at Lingfield counts as a "significant public event" (news to me). I have to be honest, those who have chosen for whatever reason not to have a vaccination (as is their right) have to recognise that decision has consequences (as do all decisions to be fair). There's a line about no man being free if in gaining their freedom they cost the freedom of another man. See our other post in Mainstreet.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
meomy 971 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 Big Tech platforms in health research: Re-purposing big data governance in light of the General Data Protection Regulation’s research exemption First Published May 30, 2021 Research Article https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/20539517211018783 Digital epidemiology: how big data challenge ethics, society and politics in infectious disease surveillance https://www.biomedcentral.com/collections/DEBD https://www.google.com/search?q=Epidemiologists+%26+Big+Tech+Privacy&ie=&oe= Re David Halpern Nudge Unit, who worked alongside Miss Ardern and Miss Clarks colleague in Labour, that of Tony Blair, is on the SAGE UK for the C19 response. DH is pushing his own Agenda with his Beliefs, reduce salt, stop smoking, seat belts in cars etc etc in Australia, UK, USA, Canada and New Zealand amongt others. David Campbell School of Law, Lancaster University UK a paternal government ... is the most despotic of all, for it treats its citizens as children. https://core.ac.uk/download/pdf/42416273.pdf Nudging does not treat citizens as children; it treats them as mugs. Coaxing better behavior - December 2014, Vol 45, No. 11 https://www.apa.org/monitor/2014/12/cover-coaxing Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nerula 1,389 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 What about a MATERNAL government? Its a kindy here! Baz (NZ) and meomy 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
meomy 971 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 2 hours ago, Nerula said: What about a MATERNAL government? Its a kindy here! 2 hours ago, Nerula said: What about a MATERNAL government? Its a kindy here! We would like to know who signed the New Zealand contract with David Halpern and those tied in with Behaviour Insights and when. Have a look online about the unfettered B/S this DH spins with no end in sight. He's a Political spin Doctor who has spread his own 'virus' to collect our Private Information under the guise of a serious Infectious Disease. He has links to Professor Robert West aka The Fake Reverend who was party to instigating The Lincolnshire Riots in the UK in 2005 era. He's around 55 years of age - same age bracket as Bryan Betty, Bloomfield, Baker and ilk. They all have close ties with WHO and have sway with the World Bank and have munted the stability of world wide economies with their Social Engineering. They are all left wingers. Just saying Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
meomy 971 Report post Posted December 12, 2021 On 12/12/2021 at 8:21 AM, Shad said: Anyone out there put a submission in on digital currency, and your thoughts on it. Have you seen the interview with Christina Lagarde and Klaus S re Digital Currency? There's around a 2 year working "Plan" on it, which may of course be extended as common sense suggests it should be. Personally I think we should still have several Options of what form we would like our money rather than rely on one version, as in Digital Currency where it's a Wild West for Fraud and Corruption. Nothing beats the feel of notes and coins with our own Identity on it as it's all part of Life's stories and History which makes up the Circular economy and Humanities. This well balanced report on EBA was written earlier this year on Climatic Change impacts on Banking/ Finance Industry by a person who also lived in New Zealand for a couple of months as a young adult and has lived in a variety of Geographically challenged regions growing up and currently in the thick of it all in Europe where they have also lived in France and Belgium. https://www.isda.org/a/qeITE/AFME-ISDA-Response-to-EBA-Discussion-Paper-on-Management-and-Supervision-of-ESG-Risks-for-Credit-Institutions-and-Investment-Firms.pdf Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooby3051 10,695 Report post Posted December 13, 2021 Guys either stay on topic or take it elsewhere...cheers. dock leaf and meomy 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archer 296 Report post Posted December 13, 2021 Have to laugh, a few weeks ago went to Henderson tab, drive around backdoor because f all parking on main st, door locked, give it a tickle but nothing, go around the front, front door locked shake it up a bit, about 6-7 day f os in tab, and apparently a room full of pokie players. She told me next day, that it was the numbers game, I was taken back, as all I wanted to do was make a deposit. How insane ! meomy 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berri 2,131 Report post Posted December 13, 2021 On 12/12/2021 at 8:30 AM, barryb said: No, the money can't be written off, its the same as any other money borrowed, has an interest rate & must be paid back eventually. But like any money borrowed, if the return exceeds the value of paying it back then there is no hurry. The indebtedness of NZ as rightly pointed out has climbed significantly & makes us less attractive to overseas & internal investers as our ability to cover interest and repayment schedules has worsened, However we are near the bottom of Worlds indebted countries so nothing alarming. Public Debt to GPD Russia 18% NZ 46% China 69% Aus 72% UK 107% US 132% Japan 256% This may be well and true but on many occasions you can't compare apples and pears. If you asked all the previous governments what one of their biggest challenges were, they would all say fiscal management. We are a society with a certain population at the bottom of the Earth. Previous governments have struggled to manage 20% debt to GDP. This government has bumped that up to 46%. If our historic governments have found 20% difficult, what happens at 46%? That's one of the points. The other is who are they selling the debt to? meomy 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leggy 4,010 Report post Posted December 13, 2021 On 12/12/2021 at 6:16 PM, Berri said: So would you be happy if the Chinese were buying up the debt? Whoever has the money and wants to invest it. Don't have any racial /ethnic preferences. meomy 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shad 1,540 Report post Posted December 13, 2021 22 hours ago, meomy said: Have you seen the interview with Christina Lagarde and Klaus S re Digital Currency? There's around a 2 year working "Plan" on it, which may of course be extended as common sense suggests it should be. Personally I think we should still have several Options of what form we would like our money rather than rely on one version, as in Digital Currency where it's a Wild West for Fraud and Corruption. Nothing beats the feel of notes and coins with our own Identity on it as it's all part of Life's stories and History which makes up the Circular economy and Humanities. This well balanced report on EBA was written earlier this year on Climatic Change impacts on Banking/ Finance Industry by a person who also lived in New Zealand for a couple of months as a young adult and has lived in a variety of Geographically challenged regions growing up and currently in the thick of it all in Europe where they have also lived in France and Belgium. https://www.isda.org/a/qeITE/AFME-ISDA-Response-to-EBA-Discussion-Paper-on-Management-and-Supervision-of-ESG-Risks-for-Credit-Institutions-and-Investment-Firms.pdf That's a fair bit of reading will take me a while to get through it, haven't seen that interview, thanks for the info. meomy 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
meomy 971 Report post Posted December 14, 2021 If non vaccinated people traveling across boundaries in New Zealand can get an Anti-gen test at Pharmacies, and they test Negative, where does it lie with Access to TAB's and Racecourses where they say they have mandated Vaccine Passes?? After all they will have Negative results. Wouldn't it be conducive to a good forward thinking Business and Society to allow those people to join in with Racing?? @ellerslie@Berri@tasman man@Ohokaman@Nerula@rdytdy @scooby3051@poundforpound@Tauhei Notts@Pam Robson@Chris Wood Thoughts? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooby3051 10,695 Report post Posted December 14, 2021 Simple answer is get vaccinated like 90+ % of all other New Zealanders have...its not so hard to do.... and myself or anyone I know has not grown any extra bits yet.... Baz (NZ) 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...