RaceCafe..#1...Tipsters Thread.... Share Your Fancies For Fun...Lets See Who The Best Tipsters Here Are.
Blossom Lady

Ellerslie / Counties merger

Recommended Posts

18 hours ago, Red Rum said:

So you are saying 100k minimum per race   , so maidens will be running for 100k at Ellerslie , when does this start ? , that's decent pot for maiden . I don't think even in Japan the maidens run for 100k , it's not much more if they do . 

1st August 2023 , see you on course

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Blossom Lady said:

1st August 2023 , see you on course

If the maidens are 100k , I will be in the owners bar . That course will be the only course the horse would race at , assuming the horse beats the ballot .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

36 minutes ago, mckenzie said:

Exactly. Are these stakes sustainable into the longer term? Selling your assets is good for the short term but what after that?

Perhaps they are not selling all  , perhaps leasing ???

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A few racecourses run hotels , Dubai the flagship I suppose but a lot in Europe have one attached , some run by chains . That's a long term income , keep selling land unless you running stakes out of  interest /dividends off cash eventually it must run out , the courses will get smaller and smaller . 40 meetings they talking x say 8 races average 100k so 320 x 100k that's a lot of cash to pay put each year minus the industry contribution  to stakes .Thats 32 mill in stakes per year , or is my maths out of whack .Plus cost of installing track .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, chevy86 said:

Not quite how I remember the meeting MS. My take was that AJC was keen to "work with" but not "combine with" Ellerslie and Counties. i.e. retain some autonomy and control of their prospective financial windfall after a wind-down of Avondale operations over the next 3-4 years.

That is right, wanted to retain autonomy  and identity but be part of the umbrella. At that stage talks were being held and I think they said they couldn't see any fish hooks to stop it happening,  

So was just wondering what has transpired in talks to change things and where they see their future now.      I can't see them lasting as go it alone. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ellerslie without it's hill would be like a woman without tits. It would just not be an attractive place to go anymore. Sounds like it's a done deal, however - despite the good prize money they say it will offer - it will make racing so clean and clinical they might as well be racing in a doctor's surgery. But then I guess racing in New Zealand is in need of resuscitation followed by major surgery. Will be sad to see it go......

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, Ohokaman said:

Quite ironic your name is from the darkside...couldn’t come up with a decent thoroughbred then...?? 🤔

Blossom Lady (Champion pacer) one of the best ever in NZ. won a NZ Cup , 2 x Hunter Cups ,and even got on a postage stamp like Cardigan Bay did. (quite an honour) 

Was just having a chuckle , as just above are Idolmite and Mister Spyro who both had very moderate form most of the time around 1980 ish at the harness racing 

Pure Steel being near the Best Aussie ever , around that era,  as well. 

Was OHAKAMAN a thoroughbred that won anything? somewhere sometime?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

19 hours ago, Idolmite said:

Ellerslie without it's hill would be like a woman without tits. It would just not be an attractive place to go anymore. Sounds like it's a done deal, however - despite the good prize money they say it will offer - it will make racing so clean and clinical they might as well be racing in a doctor's surgery. But then I guess racing in New Zealand is in need of resuscitation followed by major surgery. Will be sad to see it go......

No one looks at the hill over their 2 summer carnivals !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, Pure Steel said:

Blossom Lady (Champion pacer) one of the best ever in NZ. won a NZ Cup , 2 x Hunter Cups ,and even got on a postage stamp like Cardigan Bay did. (quite an honour) 

Was just having a chuckle , as just above are Idolmite and Mister Spyro who both had very moderate form most of the time around 1980 ish at the harness racing 

Pure Steel being near the Best Aussie ever , around that era,  as well. 

Was OHAKAMAN a thoroughbred that won anything? somewhere sometime?

Plenty of winners out of Ohoka matey, from Ohoka Punter GN Derby, Victoria Derby etc...going right back to Orbiter, Burlington Bertie, The Mighty Quinn.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 5/11/2021 at 1:11 PM, THE TORCH said:

If you're happy to get rid of the hill, why not just get rid of the whole joint? That'll change your tune.......

Indeed, Torch...

And who needs Mile-and-a-half Derbies, either, eh?

Flog off that eyesore extension at the top of the straight and make the Derby 2200m!

I saw on the News that the members were promised average stakes of $100,000 within 3 years.

Are they really that gullible?

I shall make a diary note now to come back in May 2024 and laugh...

There's more chance of Jacinda's railway being within 10km of the Airport by then...

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

29 minutes ago, Leggy said:

Some like Blossom Lady seem to think they were promised MINIMUM stakes of 100k. Which is it? Big difference.

Agreed, Leggy ... and slick b*stards with Power Points at their disposal can do anything with numbers.

I never like Averages.

Take the following sequence of numbers:

1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  500

The average of those ten numbers is 54.5.

But only one number is actually above that figure.

I prefer Medians.

The Median is the middle value when a data set is ordered from least to greatest.

In the instance I have given, the median is 5.5.

And that number, I would suggest, will be far more relevant to the eventuai stakes split that this 'super' club will come up! 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Disillusioned said:

Agreed, Leggy ... and slick b*stards with Power Points at their disposal can do anything with numbers.

I never like Averages.

Take the following sequence of numbers:

1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  500

The average of those ten numbers is 54.5.

But only one number is actually above that figure.

I prefer Medians.

The Median is the middle value when a data set is ordered from least to greatest.

In the instance I have given, the median is 5.5.

And that number, I would suggest, will be far more relevant to the eventuai stakes split that this 'super' club will come up! 

 

 

Cheer up you disillusionaries and negaholics....there's hope on the horizon.

Firstly ,still some water to flow under the bridge , as club members have to give a decent majority thumbs up to the proposal..

Great to see the excellent well rounded ARC Board bringing in real estate and financial professionals to help them look at the viability of their plans.

Quite a simple ,easy to follow presentation with only a couple of slides to assist.........received high praise from experienced racing club folk along with the various Trainers ,jockey ,breeders reps.

Too early then to state exact Stakes but enough info given to confidently expect and assume that most races would see a decent increase in stakes. 

It was indicated that NO increase to the 3x million $ races ,but more at the next level........assume the $25 - $30 k races considerably higher.The big days eg Boxing Day ,New Years ,Derby etc have $50k minimums NOW...but expect more !

As for maidens .....there are not that many now ,and there MAY be even less in future .....but these miserable $10k events have been discussed at past few AGM's and will again....expect increase in stakes !

It is relevant to talk of average stakes cos every year this figure is stated in Annual Report and this info publicly available.

I'd envisage a  special maiden event featuring all recent winners from Industry days around the place racing for $100k...a field of 18 from the 1600m mark.....similar to how those Dunstan finals run ,but once a month ! A Harness Jewels twice a month !

More cash for Owners,trainers,jockeys ,TAB and ultimately filtered back to the whole industry. Horse ownership exciting again.

Part of this whole project is to increase betting ,owners returns and narrow the gap between racing in NZ and that of Australia.

Doing nothing is not an option and full marks to these clubs for progressing this......hopefully those who get to vote will look at the sustainability of the plan .

Any criticism of the ARC currently is around their track which avoids racing in winter months , its selfish 'elite' approach ,and the fact it receives more code distribution than it deserves.

Well this plan SMASHES all those concerns.......the strathayr track wiil be amazing ,and utilized more[ up to 40 times incl use by Avondale] , the plan will be a collaborative effort between Northern clubs and also enhance Pukekohe as a training centre , and the combined club will be financing stakes with much of their own funds.

Clubs throughout NZ hopefully will benefit from increased betting via Code distributions.

And it gives us young blokes some incentive to get amongst it !

Any further genuine concerns.... put forward and if relevant I will endeavour to get answers...just tell me what area/angle you coming from.No green-eyed cynics !

Me....I a small time owner, who has gotten more reluctant in recent years as costs outstrip returns , and a regular enthusiastic  participant.A member of 2 x clubs currently !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

55 minutes ago, tasman man said:

 

 

I dunno how 'young' you are, Tasman Man, but I am decidedly sceptical when it comes to bold new plans that even you, a big fan, can't summarise without some very telling, and largely meaningless, phraseology:

·         'Hope on the horizon'

·         'Some water to flow under the bridge'

·         'Too early ... to state'

·         'It was indicated'

·         'Assume'

·         'Envisage'

·         At least three 'will be' references

Pointing that out might, in your eyes, make me a 'disillusionary' or a 'negaholic' but if I am asked to vote on something I likes me to have a bit more certainty...

Loved the bit about 'the excellent well rounded ARC Board' and 'real estate and financial professionals', too. Such folk, of course, never err, and never ever fail to deliver on their promises. Yeah, right.

You are correct in saying doing nothing is not an option but what you have summarised would cause me to run to the hills.

Curious, too, that the 'simple, easy to follow presentation' left some in here uncertain as to what was being talked about increase-wise - average stakes or minimum stakes.

Do you have a link to a list of every race run at Ellerslie - you say it is 'publicly available' - so that I can Excel-analyse same?

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was at Whanganui today. I thought if they built a dirty big hill down by Carlton Ave they could have the best race in NZ in the new future when Ellerslie sells theirs to the highest bidder. 

Ozis don’t take much notice of  most Kiwi races but they do of the Great Northern. 

Whanganui the home of the Great Western. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, tasman man said:

Any criticism of the ARC currently is around their track which avoids racing in winter months , its selfish 'elite' approach ,and the fact it receives more code distribution than it deserves.

Well this plan SMASHES all those concerns.......the strathayr track wiil be amazing ,and utilized more[ up to 40 times incl use by Avondale] , the plan will be a collaborative effort between Northern clubs and also enhance Pukekohe as a training centre , and the combined club will be financing stakes with much of their own funds.

Clearly jumping races, including iconic ones, are not part of the plans. The Bool must be a mystery to them......🙄

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.