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Absolute rubbish

Drink Shoeys crosses the line at 25.

Ends up 25.59

Federal Morgan crosses at 25.

Ends up at 25.50

Pedro Lee runs 25.

The clock has somehow malfunctioned so they panic and go to an outside influence from last year's rules, not this years, and leave everyone hanging 

Finally 25.61? Is declared wtf 

How could it go up when all the other times stayed in the 25.? And become 25.61

Cannot wait to see the replay when I get home because surprisingly has yet to be posted 😳

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Accidents happen especially whereby human element is involved. The most concerning aspect of this is that the so-called back-up plan to work out the time for Pedro Lee is obviously flawed. Having operated photo-finish systems including Finish-Lynx which is pretty well used nearly everywhere nowadays I can understand how this debacle unfolded so will try and enlighten you.

As the lure approaches the winning post the judge presses a button on a hand held device to activate the camera to take in all that crosses the line until he presses it off again thus every dog is recorded at precisely the moment and time it crosses the winning post. A time was registered for the runner-up but not the winner so the judge obviously forgot to press the button until after the winner had crossed the line. The normal timing system will still work and is activated as the winner crosses the beam on the line. This timing method is also linked to the finish lynx system. The timer clearly showed 25.5. Now this is where it gets really technical. when a dog crosses the line and activates the timer it is whatever part of the dog breaks the very thin beam first generally it's neck or chest as it is set atop the rail. When checked on Finish Lynx the time adjusts to the precise moment the dog's nose hits the line so it will usually come down a fraction by .01 to .03 or so not increase.  

The time of the second dog was 25.82 so they have obviously had to determine a margin to be able to determine a winning time. seems the only logical way to do it. After this process was undertaken the time accredited to Pedro Lee was 25.61. Someone has got the margin wrong as the winner clearly registered a time in the 25.50 to 59 range. It looks like the margin they came up with is 3.25 lengths however the margin must have been slightly more than that most likely 3.5 lengths. Had they put up 3.5 then the time would have been 25.58 or maybe 59 and probably no argument. The only way the dog could have run in the 25.60 and above range was if it's bum had triggered the timing mechanism. His first two sections were only .04 behind Federal Morgan and his second was .12 faster than Drink Shoeys so he was certainly in the mix..  

At 25.58 it would have been a dead heat for second so the poor old exotic punters and are screwed over. Have to feel for the owners of the dog as well deprived of deserved prizemoney. I've clocked the replays of all the Match races many times and can't argue with the times posted as i got them the same apart from Pedro Lee who clocked 25.58 by my calculations. 

GRNZ need to come up with a better back-up mechanism as this one is clearly flawed.        

 

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1 hour ago, Flabbergasted said:

At 25.58 it would have been a dead heat for second so the poor old exotic punters and are screwed over. Have to feel for the owners of the dog as well deprived of deserved prizemoney. I've clocked the replays of all the Match races many times and can't argue with the times posted as i got them the same apart from Pedro Lee who clocked 25.58 by my calculations. 

GRNZ need to come up with a better back-up mechanism as this one is clearly flawed.        

 

Interesting. At what point did you trigger your timing of each heat?

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2 hours ago, NeilD said:

Interesting. At what point did you trigger your timing of each heat?

I clock the lure as it hits the trip start on the rail which is what activates the boxes to open. It is the electrical conduit hanging down bellow the rail which is clearly visible hanging down under the rail just before the boxes. Using this method gives you an accurate time, to within a couple of hundredths, whereby trying to clock the lids you usually end up two  tenths faster. 

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Taped the trackside coverage which i often do.  

Interestingly I just saw this somewhere on fb regarding yesterday's times, which pretty much sums up my previous post.  

These are the times from the day that were able to be seen on tv. You can decide which one looks well out of place
   Board.  Actual
R1 23.7.     23.71
R4 42.2.   42.22
R5 26.1.    26.11
R6 26.0.    25.98
R7. 26.4.   26.38
R8 26.1.    26.17
R9 26.3.   26.26
R10 26.0.  25.98
R11a 25.6. 25.59
R11b 25.7. 25.68
R11c 25.5. 25.50
R11d 25.5. 25.61

 

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So you are saying you can use a stopwatch to confidently and accurately time a greyhound race at the speed they are going past the start and finish and get the exact same time every time?

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21 hours ago, Flabbergasted said:

 

...was 25.82 so they have obviously had to determine a margin to be able to determine a winning time. seems the only logical way to do it.   

 

Flabbergasted - as you can see, thee world authority on Finish Lynx has said "the ONLY logical way to do it" was to 'determine a margin'. 

Is that how YOU did it?
 

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Have been clocking dogs with a stopwatch for over 40 years and was always relied upon as a back-up if other methods failed when judging. i can give you a couple of examples whereby incorrect times have been posted as being official yet I will guarantee they are false. 

Pickel, funny man and no world authority but i do know the system well and processes that have been used in my prior experience. They had a time for the second dog and the winner stopped the clock at 25.5? so therefore it would be simple to ascertain the margin between first and second by freezing the video on the winning post. 3.5 lengths is .24  so 25.82 less .24 equates to 25.58. It lines up with the clock display. 

 

 

 

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12 minutes ago, Flabbergasted said:

Have been clocking dogs with a stopwatch for over 40 years and was always relied upon as a back-up if other methods failed when judging. i can give you a couple of examples whereby incorrect times have been posted as being official yet I will guarantee they are false. 

Pickel, funny man and no world authority but i do know the system well and processes that have been used in my prior experience. They had a time for the second dog and the winner stopped the clock at 25.5? so therefore it would be simple to ascertain the margin between first and second by freezing the video on the winning post. 3.5 lengths is .24  so 25.82 less .24 equates to 25.58. It lines up with the clock display. 

 

 

 

So what time do you allow per length?

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Finishlynx adopted a 15 lengths per second platform which works on .07 per length when everything was digitised a few years ago and pretty sure this was accepted and implemented across Australia and New Zealand tracks.   

Prior to that we worked on a .066 per length which is a 17 lengths per second platform.

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Flabbergasted - I thought you were being the funny man insisting that there was only one way to do it, and then doing it yourself another way!

Don't Trackside now do everything in HD?  So their recording/playback gear will have a frame counter which will give accuracy between 1/60 to 1/24 of a second.

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Pickel, I never said it was the only way just said that it was the logical way to go given that they had information at their disposal (second dog's time etc.) to assist them in arriving at the correct decision.

The time arrived at seems out of whack with other times posted on the display on the day. That's just my opinion and I can only let others be the judge when they weigh all the facts up,   

Re. Trackside HD - I believe you are right so why wasn't it used/ checked too.

   

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I downloaded all four heats as MP4 files just after they raced and agreed exactly with the first three heat times. Heat four was triggered at exactly the same point as the first three heats and on the finish line and three times I got the same exact time of 25.61 and also agreed with the second dog of 25.82. I was aware of the 25.5? showing on Trackside but all I could do was advise on what I actually got. Using a stopwatch to check dog times just isn't reliable enough as you just can't stop the race at the exact start moment and finish moment.

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Firstly the judge has nothing to do with the timing its the photo finish opperator.

The time for Pedro Lee of 25.61 is a crock of shit!

In race mode the Brooks timing system only shows 3 digits on the the semaphore board however still shows 4 digits upstairs.

The board on track showed 25.5 for Pedro Lee and at the photofinishers end showed 25.59 on the timing box.

This was reported to the stipes who one agreed the winning time must be less than 25.59 as its generally the chest of the dog that triggers the timmer at the finish NOT the lure.

When the time of 25.61 was presented it was argued that the time simply cant be slower than when the dog triggered the timer as if its the chest that triggers it on track the nose is ahead therefore faster.

The correct time for Pedro Lee should be around 25.56-57.

Best case they could have simply gone with the 25.59 that the photofinish opperator presented however they chose to go with bullshit hand timing off a tv that doesnt have cameras on the line.

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Thankyou and bang on Tick-Tock and pretty much what I said. you know your stuff and the processes involved.  

The only thing I might add is that at some tracks the judge and photo-finish operator is one and the same. 

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I care because I want to know the answer or is this just another unfounded question?

Re your second statement, how many live baiting charges have resulted in convictions and how many cases of P have there been?

 

 

 

 

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