Just Looking 44 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 The open entry races have made the fields difficult for lower rated horses - particularly a rating 67, 68 horse - take Friday at Wanganui the rating 88 race framed race has 63 kg top weight and the bottom at 55 kg minimum Can someone please tell me the last time a first starter started in an open framed market - the B1 horse should be getting 21kg off the top weight Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
We're Doomed 4,824 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 I imagine the trainer is a bit dopy. Balloted in a rating 88 when it could have got a start in a maiden over the same distance. Perhaps we need an intelligence test when people apply for a trainers licence. napier, Baz (NZ) and sharne 2 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nomates 3,453 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 10 hours ago, We're Doomed said: I imagine the trainer is a bit dopy. Balloted in a rating 88 when it could have got a start in a maiden over the same distance. Perhaps we need an intelligence test when people apply for a trainers licence. Be careful what you suggest , that one could thin the ranks a bit . We're Doomed 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Rum 1,833 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 How does the handicapper know how good the horse is , handicap is weight on ability , that's why in a lot of places the horse needs 3 runs or a win whatever is earlier to get a mark. This horse could be well in . I doubt it though . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss Hogg 320 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 Hi J L In the early 70's a horse called Dyak I think it was only about his 3rd or 4th start was placed in an open handicap ,everyone went on about it ,how did he get into the race etc etc . Guess what he won so never under estimate what a trainer thinks of his horse . By the way your phone needs charging J L just saying .Cheers BH Black Kirrama 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Looking 44 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 21 minutes ago, Boss Hogg said: Hi J L In the early 70's a horse called Dyak I think it was only about his 3rd or 4th start was placed in an open handicap ,everyone went on about it ,how did he get into the race etc etc . Guess what he won so never under estimate what a trainer thinks of his horse . By the way your phone needs charging J L just saying .Cheers BH Won after three or four starts with experience down on a much lower minimum than the 55kg tomorrow - this is a first starter - no Raceday Experience - and one trial - let’s see ...if it gets off the ballot Boss Hogg 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leggy 4,007 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 19 minutes ago, Just Looking said: Won after three or four starts with experience down on a much lower minimum than the 55kg tomorrow - this is a first starter - no Raceday Experience - and one trial - let’s see ...if it gets off the ballot They may be hoping to not get off the ballot. Remember that entering and not getting a start costs nothing and means it will have preference for a start when next entered. That means it can run pretty much wherever and whenever they want. If that's the case, I'd regard it as a pretty smart strategy. Insider 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Rum 1,833 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 41 minutes ago, Leggy said: They may be hoping to not get off the ballot. Remember that entering and not getting a start costs nothing and means it will have preference for a start when next entered. That means it can run pretty much wherever and whenever they want. If that's the case, I'd regard it as a pretty smart strategy. That's smart thinking by trainer In UK and Ireland that horse would be automatic top weight .Luca Cumani was a very shrewd operator with some his 3 year olds working the system , 3 quiet runs up North England to start career , get a mark into a decent Goodwood handicap on 8 stone ish , win then by end year horse is pattern class and you realise the horse was nailed on at 8st 2 months before . Mark Johnstone does that a bit , watch out for them next week at Goodwood . Dopey 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz (NZ) 1,719 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 I recall a horse named Secret Admirer placing in a Foxbridge Plate as a maiden? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Rum 1,833 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 9 minutes ago, Baz (NZ) said: I recall a horse named Secret Admirer placing in a Foxbridge Plate as a maiden? I think there was a thread about maidens winning big ones a while back, horse I remember from about 10 back in UK was Dragon Dancer , as a maiden he got to 119 (multiple winner like Magic Wand is only on peak of 116 ) , beat home future Arc winner , placed in two Derbys . Took until 4 years old to get his head in front . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdytdy 5,335 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 1 hour ago, Leggy said: They may be hoping to not get off the ballot. Remember that entering and not getting a start costs nothing and means it will have preference for a start when next entered. That means it can run pretty much wherever and whenever they want. If that's the case, I'd regard it as a pretty smart strategy. I thought that process had now ceased Leggy? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leggy 4,007 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 14 minutes ago, rdytdy said: I thought that process had now ceased Leggy? Where did you see that? Don't think I was advised but may have missed it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
army 156 Report post Posted July 22, 2020 11 minutes ago, Leggy said: Where did you see that? Don't think I was advised but may have missed it. I agree there is no more ballots getting preference and the next meeting. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter R S 408 Report post Posted July 23, 2020 8 hours ago, Baz (NZ) said: I recall a horse named Secret Admirer placing in a Foxbridge Plate as a maiden? And one called Saracino winning that race as a maiden? Baz (NZ) 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz (NZ) 1,719 Report post Posted July 23, 2020 21 hours ago, Just Looking said: The open entry races have made the fields difficult for lower rated horses - particularly a rating 67, 68 horse - take Friday at Wanganui the rating 88 race framed race has 63 kg top weight and the bottom at 55 kg minimum Can someone please tell me the last time a first starter started in an open framed market - the B1 horse should be getting 21kg off the top weight I was going to get someone to ask Swanny just how good this thing was??? I now see someone scratched it ! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Looking 44 Report post Posted July 23, 2020 11 hours ago, Leggy said: They may be hoping to not get off the ballot. Remember that entering and not getting a start costs nothing and means it will have preference for a start when next entered. That means it can run pretty much wherever and whenever they want. If that's the case, I'd regard it as a pretty smart strategy. Would have made the field in a maiden today - that criteria for guaranteed a start only for July - it’s scratched now Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeepers 276 Report post Posted July 24, 2020 I have a horse in Aust having its first start.Won a jump out on grass.The trainer is starting first up on Synthetic at Pakenham which has a reputation for bad kickback.He has a 30win apprentice riding. Wouldn't it be more prudent to start on a grass track with a fully fledged jockey first up. Obviously I don't wish to tell the trainer his job but just wondering. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Rum 1,833 Report post Posted July 24, 2020 2 hours ago, jeepers said: I have a horse in Aust having its first start.Won a jump out on grass.The trainer is starting first up on Synthetic at Pakenham which has a reputation for bad kickback.He has a 30win apprentice riding. Wouldn't it be more prudent to start on a grass track with a fully fledged jockey first up. Obviously I don't wish to tell the trainer his job but just wondering. The vast majority of horses in Europe go similar levels on turf and polytrack according to ratings , a few have different marks . Most good trainers up there gallop horses on poly no problem . Good luck with your horse for its debut . Black Kirrama 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeepers 276 Report post Posted July 24, 2020 Thank you Red Rum.Have had no feedback from the Trainer as to chances or ability but have been paying since sales 2years ago. I have another horse and young trainer at Bendigo who contacts me every 2 weeks,Tops. Black Kirrama 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Rum 1,833 Report post Posted July 24, 2020 36 minutes ago, jeepers said: Thank you Red Rum.Have had no feedback from the Trainer as to chances or ability but have been paying since sales 2years ago. I have another horse and young trainer at Bendigo who contacts me every 2 weeks,Tops. The stats re performance level of horses on turf and synthetic are on BHA website , horses like Enable and Kameko trainers have no bother running them on Tapeta or Poly and Andrew Balding just put in polytrack gallop . Not sure the stats in OZ , I think sometimes performance levels go up and down turf / synthetic is IMHO because a lot of horses running on that surface in the main midweekers who are in and out anyway . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohokaman 5,760 Report post Posted July 24, 2020 2 hours ago, Red Rum said: The stats re performance level of horses on turf and synthetic are on BHA website , horses like Enable and Kameko trainers have no bother running them on Tapeta or Poly and Andrew Balding just put in polytrack gallop . Not sure the stats in OZ , I think sometimes performance levels go up and down turf / synthetic is IMHO because a lot of horses running on that surface in the main midweekers who are in and out anyway . Robert Hickmott made the point that those horses who preferred wet tracks are disadvantaged on synthetic tracks but are sometimes forced to run there due to meeting changes or cancellations. Clearly some horses like it and many do not. You have to consider this in doing the form. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue 1,080 Report post Posted July 26, 2020 On 7/23/2020 at 8:37 AM, Boss Hogg said: Hi J L In the early 70's a horse called Dyak I think it was only about his 3rd or 4th start was placed in an open handicap ,everyone went on about it ,how did he get into the race etc etc . Guess what he won so never under estimate what a trainer thinks of his horse . By the way your phone needs charging J L just saying .Cheers BH Was it also this same Dyak who became a reasonably handy horse but then stripped of several wins due to an ownership snarl-up? I seem to recall the name of Ron Kingsnorth associated with the saga. Black Kirrama 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohokaman 5,760 Report post Posted July 27, 2020 On 7/24/2020 at 1:14 PM, jeepers said: I have a horse in Aust having its first start.Won a jump out on grass.The trainer is starting first up on Synthetic at Pakenham which has a reputation for bad kickback.He has a 30win apprentice riding. Wouldn't it be more prudent to start on a grass track with a fully fledged jockey first up. Obviously I don't wish to tell the trainer his job but just wondering. If it was Lord Wonder, well done. Very nice effort first up. And if it wasn’t, follow it..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeepers 276 Report post Posted July 27, 2020 Yes Ohokaman Thank you.Probably only a senior rider would have made the difference,but looks promising.All reports are he's pulled up well. Ohokaman 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insider 3,875 Report post Posted July 27, 2020 On 7/23/2020 at 8:37 AM, Boss Hogg said: Hi J L In the early 70's a horse called Dyak I think it was only about his 3rd or 4th start was placed in an open handicap ,everyone went on about it ,how did he get into the race etc etc . Guess what he won so never under estimate what a trainer thinks of his horse . By the way your phone needs charging J L just saying .Cheers BH I damn near owned Dyak way back then. Rob Fielder offered him to us before he went on to be open class but for some reason between my partner and me we didn’t proceed. We were also offered another horse about the same time that also went on to open class and again we said no. His name was Classico. Both were maidens or one win horses at the time, so an opportunity went begging that’s for sure. Liz Boss Hogg 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...