RaceCafe..#1...Tipsters Thread.... Share Your Fancies For Fun...Lets See Who The Best Tipsters Here Are.
firepipe

TAB do not want my money ?

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Took 3 days and 3 emails to have my deposit lodged to my account this week. Initial response was we have noted your email, gave an identity number, please quote this when calling. Very slow going indeed and frustrating.

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I have had enough of it, I have been watching a lot of markets while in lock down and then find what I think is value only to click on the price and it is not available, basically every price will change from the click of the price to the place bet screen. Even the price on the TV is miles off what is available at the time. 

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I've had enough of NZ TAB. A few weeks ago they sent me a message saying i was using their bonus bet offers too much and they wanted me to spend more on other  types of bets or they would take the promotions away from me. They have had a lot of my money over the past 60yrs. but not any more. I am back betting on my Beteasy a/c in Aussie. 8 any race money back races yesterday with a bet up to $50.

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Yesterday, I gave my son $200 to put into his Bet 365 account for some bets, as i am over this monopoly called the TAB.

Well what a user-friendly site, you get the best odds offered, you can cancel your bets, not sure how long before the start of a race, as I didn't use that facility.

I just found the whole experience so much better than our $50m platform, so unlikely i will use our TAB again in the near future.

 

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3 hours ago, Midget said:

Yesterday, I gave my son $200 to put into his Bet 365 account for some bets, as i am over this monopoly called the TAB.

Well what a user-friendly site, you get the best odds offered, you can cancel your bets, not sure how long before the start of a race, as I didn't use that facility.

I just found the whole experience so much better than our $50m platform, so unlikely i will use our TAB again in the near future.

 

Fair enough Midget ......back when you were riding for a living ,then in recent years when you were training a few ,the races basically took part because , a little sponsorship aside and acceptance fees paid by owners , the show was largely funded because of Kiwis betting on the TAB.

Without the funding from the TAB going back to the clubs NZ racing would be in far worse shape than it currently is.

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18 hours ago, tasman man 11 said:

Fair enough Midget ......back when you were riding for a living ,then in recent years when you were training a few ,the races basically took part because , a little sponsorship aside and acceptance fees paid by owners , the show was largely funded because of Kiwis betting on the TAB.

Without the funding from the TAB going back to the clubs NZ racing would be in far worse shape than it currently is.

Correct Gary, but when you cant deposit funds into your account, it leaves you with the problem i had.

When the TAB  becomes more competitive and wants to look after its customers, I will change back to support our Industry.

The other issue, i got a lot more value on my bets.It is human nature to get the best deal available. When any business has competition, they must compete and the NZ TAB has a lot of ground to make up. 

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19 hours ago, tasman man 11 said:

Fair enough Midget ......back when you were riding for a living ,then in recent years when you were training a few ,the races basically took part because , a little sponsorship aside and acceptance fees paid by owners , the show was largely funded because of Kiwis betting on the TAB.

Without the funding from the TAB going back to the clubs NZ racing would be in far worse shape than it currently is.

Hi Tasman Man 11..I think we would all like to support the TAB, but the problem is it is so far off the pace, in terms of user friendly platform, options, performance and customer service.  If it was in line with its competitors it would get my funds everything.  

I support my local green grocer over a supermarket, but not if their fruit is out dated or poor quality.

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1 hour ago, shaneMcAlister said:

 

I support my local green grocer over a supermarket, but not if their fruit is out dated or poor quality.

But we have a Brand new $50m betting platform :rcfe-laughing::rcf-laughing-2: Ha ha 

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2 hours ago, Midget said:

Correct Gary, but when you cant deposit funds into your account, it leaves you with the problem i had.

When the TAB  becomes more competitive and wants to look after its customers, I will change back to support our Industry.

The other issue, i got a lot more value on my bets.It is human nature to get the best deal available. When any business has competition, they must compete and the NZ TAB has a lot of ground to make up. 

I fully understand......I too am staggered at some of the things that I hear go on and the frustrations.Some stupidity like the Money laundering ID requirements have been beyond the TAB's control etc. Others like the 'odds' etc and the pool size etc are a reflection of the size of our market/compared to Australia.

I suffer the frustrations too , and as I go back to long before MrAy Bee I marvel sometimes at some of advancements we have made and the standard of Trackside etc.

It pisses me to be charged $2 to make a deposit into my account by CC but I see they collected $4.5 mill from that and the industry sure needs it looking at the Financials.

I suspect they are Insolvent.

Possibly in my mind is that I have been involved in a few Organisations which Australia has been much bigger and more powerful than NZ yet Australia has gone belly up and in business their IT and admin skills have been well below NZ standards after a change has been made !

 

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The market % the TAB has covering the Australian racing is horrific, it is often significantly above anything on offer in Australia.

As an example today at Mornington race 6

NZ TAB 140.70

The Worst  from anyone in Aus on that race is 134.30

The best  in Aus is 129.10

Exactly as midget says there is zero value betting into markets with the TAB when the grossly inflated % are killing your chances. 

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1 hour ago, shaneMcAlister said:

Hi Tasman Man 11..I think we would all like to support the TAB, but the problem is it is so far off the pace, in terms of user friendly platform, options, performance and customer service.  If it was in line with its competitors it would get my funds everything.  

I support my local green grocer over a supermarket, but not if their fruit is out dated or poor quality.

Fair comment........in business size is important. Sometimes when the little guy goes the "Supermarket" eases up and things can change.

eg Air NZ ...in my region they often had competition but one by one they drove them out.And look at Air NZ now !

Sadly racing for various reasons has been losing its popularity in NZ , and people much prefer Lotto and Sports betting ,easier to understand and better trusted !

I have dealt with the TAB for a long time , so I understand the frustrations.

In view of the overall situation of racing in NZ , the standard of trackside TV , the fact the TAB gives a little back to grass roots sport[ It should be more] ,the fact that employ over 600 people [Yes their office staff should be trimmed ] etc etc and MOSTLY the standard of service and products I can access from the TAB in NZ, I give them a pass mark.I stick with them.

IMO a big part of their problems is that the Government appointees in recent years have been bad and the Codes etc and the regions etc have never gotten along ,then in recent years they have stupidly paid out more money than they have earned......crazy.

Hence they are now insolvent....little point standing over them putting the boot in to the rotting carcass !

IMO

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15 minutes ago, barryb said:

The market % the TAB has covering the Australian racing is horrific, it is often significantly above anything on offer in Australia.

As an example today at Mornington race 6

NZ TAB 140.70

The Worst  from anyone in Aus on that race is 134.30

The best  in Aus is 129.10

Exactly as midget says there is zero value betting into markets with the TAB when the grossly inflated % are killing your chances. 

Exactly big Barry.....a Monday at Mornington ....NZ TAB shouldn't be in on that but I guess they trying to provide a 'service' !

In view of current situation they should lay off all their staff on a Monday ,take a commission from the Aussie provider etc etc.

I used to own a business that lost money every Monday ...better closed .......but I see approx 4000 Kiwis bet on Russian Table Tennis last week as well.

The TAB is bleeding bad at the moment.....

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Is it time to open it up and let the corporate bookies and exchanges be a part of racing in NZ? They'd sponcer tracks, advertise and just add a new much need dimension to the industry. 

I was looking at how much extra money has been on the Aus markets on Betfair since UK stopped racing, should we be getting a good deal going with them for when we resume racing, even if we had to start our days racing at say 10am and be over and done with before the Aus racing starts...  

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7 minutes ago, tasman man 11 said:

Exactly big Barry.....a Monday at Mornington ....NZ TAB shouldn't be in on that but I guess they trying to provide a 'service' !

In view of current situation they should lay off all their staff on a Monday ,take a commission from the Aussie provider etc etc.

I used to own a business that lost money every Monday ...better closed .......but I see approx 4000 Kiwis bet on Russian Table Tennis last week as well.

The TAB is bleeding bad at the moment.....

So when its very similar on a Saturday/Sunday like it has been for the last few weeks?.

The Australian TAB's & Bookies are suffering as well, but what they are not doing is shafting there loyal customer base.

However of course most betting with the NZ TAB are not even aware that they are getting royally shafted, does that then make it ok to do so?.

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1 hour ago, tasman man 11 said:

Fair comment........in business size is important. Sometimes when the little guy goes the "Supermarket" eases up and things can change.

eg Air NZ ...in my region they often had competition but one by one they drove them out.And look at Air NZ now !

Sadly racing for various reasons has been losing its popularity in NZ , and people much prefer Lotto and Sports betting ,easier to understand and better trusted !

I have dealt with the TAB for a long time , so I understand the frustrations.

In view of the overall situation of racing in NZ , the standard of trackside TV , the fact the TAB gives a little back to grass roots sport[ It should be more] ,the fact that employ over 600 people [Yes their office staff should be trimmed ] etc etc and MOSTLY the standard of service and products I can access from the TAB in NZ, I give them a pass mark.I stick with them.

IMO a big part of their problems is that the Government appointees in recent years have been bad and the Codes etc and the regions etc have never gotten along ,then in recent years they have stupidly paid out more money than they have earned......crazy.

Hence they are now insolvent....little point standing over them putting the boot in to the rotting carcass !

IMO

I agree the TV coverage is good.  No issue there.

$2 CC charge is horrible.  As you mentioned they got $4.5M from that, what if they made it $5 charge, would they get $9M or lose customers.  I suspect lose customers, so I think they lose customers with the $2 charge.  

Some people like a $20 bet (without depositing $100), so effectively they pay 10%.  Just a slap in the face I feel.  Especially when non of your competitors do it.

Same analogy, but my green grocer does not charge me $2 because the supermarkets don't.

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2 hours ago, barryb said:

So when its very similar on a Saturday/Sunday like it has been for the last few weeks?.

The Australian TAB's & Bookies are suffering as well, but what they are not doing is shafting there loyal customer base.

However of course most betting with the NZ TAB are not even aware that they are getting royally shafted, does that then make it ok to do so?.

No big barry its not OK to shaft your customers.......I get pissed when I see differing petrol prices .

But is the Mornington race on a Monday a good sample.....are they doing this in every race ?

Do they do it on Saturdays as well ?

If they are they should have been told........and had certain basics explained to them 

e.g. like 95 % of punters lose ,so the bank/casino/ TAB must win overall !

Judging by the 'free bets' they dished out I think they know that !

I went to several of the 'road show' talks from TAB boss and expected him to be roasted about this type of thing , but alas ,nothing was ever said.

There was always other stuff of little significance coming from the floor.

I remember him saying 2 % of the punters drive 56% of the turnover.

I'm part of the 98% and a $5.50 price matters very little to $5.05.

But I notice 5 cent difference at the petrol pump...bloody rip off !

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1 hour ago, tasman man 11 said:

I remember him saying 2 % of the punters drive 56% of the turnover.

I'm part of the 98% and a $5.50 price matters very little to $5.05.

But I notice 5 cent difference at the petrol pump...bloody rip off !

The 5c price at the petrol pump is advertised, the TAB % isnt and for many they would not even know where to start to figure it out.

Mornington R6

TAB NZ now 138.60

Best is Topsport 128.60

Av Aussie bookie is 131.10

TAB Aus is 130.10

below is market % for Mornington Race 2 2 mins from jump

image.png.670744b99f527cd817d792cfdde80a2d.png

128.0 is NZ TAB

104.30 is Betfair

If you are happy to be taken for a ride and whinge about petrol and supermarkets but are happy for your recreational $ to be stolen from you under the assumption you are doing great things supporting the NZ industry then that's madness, all is you are doing is supporting the excess & not encouraging change.

The above suggests change is needed and now is the opportunity to do so.

 

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4 minutes ago, 100 1 said:

If I may ask Barry what % of your win betting would be with betfair?

Most of my late bets are. Remembering that BF markets don't form till very late in the piece normally.

However with all the UK betting on Aussie stuff the BF markets are full.

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6 minutes ago, barryb said:

& more

The below it the no 1 horse in race 6 at Mornington

image.png.72e8e69fc0ff4a5fd6e133a9d021adf5.png

$6.00 is NZ fixed odds

& the 11 in the same race

image.png.5dfd617d9e1030715424633edf0a3fea.png

$34 NZ

This stuff is just not bloody good enough, anyone taking $34 v the $61 on offer elsewhere is mad.

Great work Big Barry.....gather the facts  ,document and send them to the key people at RITA etc ,including those who make key decisions.

Also get a personal sitting with at least one of these key people.

I'll do my bit by bringing it up at the next road show should there be one.....I think FO betting is about 50% of betting so many still just run with the tote.

I also note that margins have been down significantly in recent times so someone has been getting a geed deal or extra rebates.

Finally ,these margins/pricing has never been a big interest of mine but I am interested why Kiwis refuse to bet with TAB in NZ.

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