dkc 181 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 Isn't it time for owners and trainers to stand up and boycott these races. If everyone refused to nominate for the NZ cup then they would be forced into stopping these fees that only hurt the owners pockets Really I can see no reason for it. Can someone please tell me why they do it? LongOwner and lamour 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stables 577 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 How is it different from Breeders and owners funding the likes of the sires stakes and the yearling sales series Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkc 181 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 It's totally different. The sires stake payments start when a horse is a foal. These payments are made to mainly enhance the foals value at the sales. If you breed a foal for the sales then you basically have to pay the sires stakes payments. These races are then not counted for jewels qualification. The New Zealand cup is a race that we want the best horses racing in. If I owned a horse like U May Collect and say it won its first 3 races in the season just past then it starts the new season and wins its next 4. All of a sudden it becomes a horse we want in the cup but because Addington persist in charging acceptance fees for their group 1 races, It is then up for a huge late entry payment. Why? Don't we want the best starting in these races. I'm sure there are some fringe horse that aren't back at the races yet so why force them to pay a nomination fee now or hit then with a late entry payment later. All addington are doing is making the stakes look better than they actually are and in the process costing the owners GST that most can't get back. Owners are our life blood let's stop robbing them. lamour, LongOwner and Toblerone 2 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty 575 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 2 hours ago, dkc said: Really I can see no reason for it. Can someone please tell me why they do it? Because they are greedy and arrogant. And don't forget everyone, GST is included in these nomination fees. The GST component within these fees is an awful waste of money. Auckland Trotting Club don't do nomination fees do they? For their big races. Pretty sure they don't. Wakey wakey, hand off snakey Addington. LongOwner, dkc and lamour 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkc 181 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 Here's an idea. Nobody nominate for the NZ Cup. What are they going to do. There's only one thing they can do. Take the nomination fee away. Force them to change. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty 575 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 For that proposal to work, it would need 100% buy in from connections and it would never be realistic to achieve that. What may be achievable is pressure put on the club by key members within the industry to scrap the nom fees, by other methods. People smarter than me may come up with something... Funny how Addington were over the moon with delight to announce a "media partner" for cup day... wasn't that long ago the club barred the media to the track when shit was going down with Op Inca. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash 2,115 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 7 hours ago, Rusty said: For that proposal to work, it would need 100% buy in from connections and it would never be realistic to achieve that. What may be achievable is pressure put on the club by key members within the industry to scrap the nom fees, by other methods. People smarter than me may come up with something... Funny how Addington were over the moon with delight to announce a "media partner" for cup day... wasn't that long ago the club barred the media to the track when shit was going down with Op Inca. And now he runs HRNZ Greg Hunter the punter 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamour 663 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 11 hours ago, Stables said: How is it different from Breeders and owners funding the likes of the sires stakes and the yearling sales series Sites stakes payments and the like are basically a sweepstake. You pay up and the money gets divided between the winners & placed horses. With group 1 acceptance fees the money is not paid up front by the owner, it is deducted off the stake you win, therefore making the fee pointless. It is smoke and mirrors to make the stake look bigger than it really is. Problem is it attracts a gst payment for no reason at all LongOwner 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkc 181 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 So we need to put pressure on Addington to stop this. It's not something that hrnz can force them to stop. It needs to be owner and trainer driven. Start with the top stables. All Stars, Dunns, The connection of Tiger Tara, These are the ones that can put the pressure on. Come on Addington do the right thing! LongOwner 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamour 663 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 2 minutes ago, dkc said: So we need to put pressure on Addington to stop this. It's not something that hrnz can force them to stop. It needs to be owner and trainer driven. Start with the top stables. All Stars, Dunns, The connection of Tiger Tara, These are the ones that can put the pressure on. Come on Addington do the right thing! Was it last year or the year before the horseman’s assoc put forward a remit to the annual conference that acceptance fees be abolished with a very reasoned argument. ? It was the only remit voted down. Apparently Addington was the main reason it was defeated. LongOwner 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkc 181 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 Addington said it's their business and they will run it the way they see fit Hence the pressure needs to come from owners and trainers Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eljay 1,711 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 dkc - why not just nominate for the cup and boycott the rest of the programme. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamour 663 Report post Posted August 19, 2019 Earlier in the year I attended the Canty Trotting Assoc AGM. Under general business I suggested the association should adopt a stance of limiting acceptance fees to 1pc with a view to eventually eliminating them. Barry Dent , Ex NZMTC president assured the meeting there were only acceptance fees on 4 group 1 races & the Met only took in 200k down from $700k in previous years from the fees This was utter B.S. A total lie. LongOwner, ivanthegreat and JJ Flash 2 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelli 426 Report post Posted August 20, 2019 I've long thought acceptance fees at Addington a ripoff for owners. We've had a horse in the Dominion in recent years and are well aware that the net "other runners" stake of $365 is less than the class races on the same day. If your horse is unlikely to be in the first few, you are better off financially to go in a lower class race if based in the South Island or not come at all if race at Auckland where even the "other runners" in higher rated races get $500 on ordinary race nights. You can tell by the lack of North Island horses coming south for the big races nowadays that owners do look at the bottom line. LongOwner 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamour 663 Report post Posted August 20, 2019 8 hours ago, dkc said: Addington said it's their business and they will run it the way they see fit Hence the pressure needs to come from owners and trainers Agree that pressure needs to come from owners & trainers dkc but not sure it would be possible to organise a boycott. You would need to get Allstars on board. I think the horseman’s association needs to put their previous remit forward again to the next AGM. Don’t give up just because it got voted down the 1st time it was put forward. Another tactic could be to do it in parts, therefore maybe put forward a remit that group 1 races are limited acceptance fees of 1pc of the stake and group 2 & 3 races .5pc of stake. Given the sustaining payments required to get into the Cup its a dam disgrace they deduct a the large acceptance fee off the money the owners earn in the race. LongOwner 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkc 181 Report post Posted August 20, 2019 Here's the nomination fees Inital nom $431.25 inclusive GST Sustaining payment $1293.75 Starting fee $12075.00 Total $13800.00 Also ran horse in the cup get $14710 The stake for the NZ Cup is $750,000 No it's not take the acceptance fees off and with 15 starters it under $550,000 It's a disgrace that they are getting away with this BS LongOwner 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamour 663 Report post Posted August 20, 2019 Last year the stake was 800k so they drop it 50k for this year Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkc 181 Report post Posted August 20, 2019 I don't hear anyone defending it. Mist be someone from Addington willing to give us some insight as to why you deem it necessary. Let's hear it! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamour 663 Report post Posted August 20, 2019 We could all become members of Met and go to their next AGM. And one by one question why they persist with tis irrational policy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkc 181 Report post Posted August 21, 2019 Perhaps some of the members on here can go and ask the question. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty 575 Report post Posted August 21, 2019 It won't make a difference at all, if members asked the question. The club officials have their heads stuck in the sand real good. I asked a question years ago at the AGM during my last year as a member... what tangible items have been done in the past 12 months, and or planned in the next few months, that are designed to retain, and or attract younger members to the club. Jesus the silence was deafening. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkc 181 Report post Posted August 22, 2019 Everyone barr Addington committee members seem to understand that it is a rip off. There silence is deafening Pressure needs to be applied from all in this industry. Including at conference and perhaps Garrick Knight and Jonny Turner can take up the fight! Who on their committee disagrees with this policy. I am sure there are numerous Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stables 577 Report post Posted August 22, 2019 What's it to you dkc, it seems very personal, have you a share in a horse that's being nominated? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamour 663 Report post Posted August 22, 2019 I have spoken to a few comittee members, a couple of Met ones & a committee member of the ATC. (The Auckland Cup also has acceptance fees) One on one they all admit they can’t see the sense in acceptance fees, yet no one seems to care about questioning the wisdom of these fees with those that insist on applying them to group races. DKC is right, no one is prepared to give a rational explanation of why we have them. LongOwner 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkc 181 Report post Posted August 22, 2019 Just think it's wrong. I do know people who have had horses in some of these races. As someone else stated on here they had a horse in the dominion and they would have been better off starting in a supporting race. What's you connection stables. Committee member perhaps. Owners are the most important ingredient in this industry. The last thing we need is Addington doing this to them. To be asking for nominations now before most horse that may start in the cup have hit the race track and ask for a $400 non refundable inital nomination fee is robery imho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...