RaceCafe..#1...Tipsters Thread.... Share Your Fancies For Fun...Lets See Who The Best Tipsters Here Are.
tim vince

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Lets hope the riu does get their way. It is imperative that racing and in particular harness racing shows it has integrity. By running the saddle trots for an enthusiastic but very small group within an industry is somewhat selfish. To have horses not ready for this type of betting race is foolhardy and must not happen again as a fully bonafide betting race . One participant stated that their horse had actually not been saddled up for 8 months prior to last fridays debarcle.What does that divulge to the betting public? Many had not experienced a mobile saddle race and that includes riders as well as horses. very bad (or lack of) planning.

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Probably the best thing to be fair , the horses and riders were well below an acceptable standard and generally on the whole have been below that standard the whole way thru the tote races so far, the trials they have are a joke going mostly Upto 20-30 seconds slower than race speed just to get horses qualified. The stipes should’ve straight away not allowed horses going that slow just because they didn’t gallop to qualify. They should have had to pass at least the same as normal qualifications standards they do in the cart so you know they can handle running under saddle at speed. Half the riders have no balance and can’t even stand up in the stirrups for the length of the race. 

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On 6/26/2019 at 1:35 PM, tim vince said:

The montes as tote races are gawn.riu is recommending that.

 

 

atc put on amateur races to fill the void

I thought the RIU administered the rules not made them!       

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8 hours ago, hsvman said:

Probably the best thing to be fair , the horses and riders were well below an acceptable standard and generally on the whole have been below that standard the whole way thru the tote races so far, the trials they have are a joke going mostly Upto 20-30 seconds slower than race speed just to get horses qualified. The stipes should’ve straight away not allowed horses going that slow just because they didn’t gallop to qualify. They should have had to pass at least the same as normal qualifications standards they do in the cart so you know they can handle running under saddle at speed. Half the riders have no balance and can’t even stand up in the stirrups for the length of the race. 

A bit tough on the riders as I believe they mostly are accomplished horse people with a lot of skill ,certainly a lot of gutz !

Several of the riders have ridden in thoroughbred races ,others ridden in montes overseas where they are common and popular.

Montes were new in NZ....seemed to be given an extended lease of life to some older horses who love to race e.g. Cool Kahli and Bert Munro.

Bert was the horse who hadn't been under saddle for weeks...he won the race last Friday !

It was really exciting IMO....harness followers complain about sit sprint racing ,boring favs winning and procession races [even the jewels].

Watch the monte....the start was exhilirating , all horses right on the gate exactly even.

IMO the mobile was too fast to start...should have been a stand !

One horse just went too fast and broke ,but the field soon bunched and all girls were competitive [no males], one went 3 wide !

Again it was so exciting when the pressure went on at 600m and winner made its move....a couple broke ,but at the 300m there was 4 of 7 still into win.

Up the straight and it was a close finish between the horses with good previous Monte records......the fav and the winner Bert.

What a dividend for a form Monte performer.....these were all monte non-winners !

Unfortunately there was excessive breakers and some disqualifications...similar to most non-winner trotting races !

Most meetings have several horses tailed off ,pulled up or disqualified...this latter group was exaggerated by fact that race only had 7 starters for 4 dividend paying positions.

All horses paid a divvy.....First 4 's !

This race was different and very exhilirating.....something NEW !

Sure they should trial more and I'd suggest a stand start which can handicap the winners !

But anything worth doing is worth doing poorly at first ......only way to learn.

This was a non-winners monte ,so several other horses [better ones?] in wings.

Some winning jockeys not there either.....so cream of crop not there.

But these girls IMO turned on a great show so well done to them...skilful and gutzy !

Nice ride Tayla....winning with a smile !And the others too !

As to Betting on them.......horse racing is a gamble !

What a dividend.....thanks Bert and Invictus......I see an ad coming !...great trifecta !

Integrity......haha......I won't list what I could.......could be seen as an oxymoron !

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OMG Tasman Man. We all knew you like to go in to bat for the underdog, but this dog has rabies and needs to go back to the trials to be vaccinated!

What you saw as "exhilarating" and "exciting", almost everyone else saw as a "shambles" and a "circus". It was like watch a slow motion train wreck unfolding!

Apart from the cage fighting and demolition derby crowd I'm not sure who else it would have appealed to. Serial masochists maybe?

Tim may even be reviewing his recommendation of you for the ATC board after that diatribe!

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18 minutes ago, JackSprat said:

OMG Tasman Man. We all knew you like to go in to bat for the underdog, but this dog has rabies and needs to go back to the trials to be vaccinated!

What you saw as "exhilarating" and "exciting", almost everyone else saw as a "shambles" and a "circus". It was like watch a slow motion train wreck unfolding!

Apart from the cage fighting and demolition derby crowd I'm not sure who else it would have appealed to. Serial masochists maybe?

Tim may even be reviewing his recommendation of you for the ATC board after that diatribe!

Haha Jack......tell us what you really think.

You should consider journalism.

The filming of the race was upclose and made it an excellent watch.

A few on here throw out random criticism ......it was a non winners trot .

GOOD TRAINERS AND JOCKEYS INVOLVED GIVE EM A CHANCE !

You get the odd breaker.

I was raised on a diet of Nelson trots where many horses head to the birdcage midrace ,and are allowed to repeat two days later.

Watch the start , watch the last 300m ..4 of 7 in contention.

And a close finish.

Great divis !

Keep doing the same in harness and get same result !

Anything worth doing ,worth doing poorly at first.....Spokeshave

 

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I don't doubt the ability or good intentions of the participants, but for now their "product" is only half built, and being showcased at one of our major tracks is not an option.

The club need to take a fair chunk of responsibility for the shambles that unfolded with the poorly thought out conditions of eligibility.

By all means let them "do it poorly at first", but please not on the big stage and definitely not offered up as an example of what we expect people to bet on.

They need to go back and do some beta testing at the trials before re-releasing their program to the public!

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Jack you have said it all .A disgrace at many levels. I live in a galloping district and all the grizzlies who jump at any opportunity to rubbish our fine sport have had a field day with the great Monte race !!!! This time (pos only time )I cannot defend the indefensible and can only laugh with them .(i hope Tim Is right and "gawn' the word) what could they be replaced with..... mmm     dual sulky races say Butchers v Abernethies  , arna and nicky v amanda and samantha. wow betting on them great . what about the kids carts , thats exciting esp with the huge handicaps.!what about senior horses over 9 years with over 150 starts each and for drivers over 60...  now I am being stupid but !!!!!!!!!:rcf-happy-7:

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On 6/29/2019 at 9:00 AM, john legend said:

Jack you have said it all .A disgrace at many levels. I live in a galloping district and all the grizzlies who jump at any opportunity to rubbish our fine sport have had a field day with the great Monte race !!!! This time (pos only time )I cannot defend the indefensible and can only laugh with them .(i hope Tim Is right and "gawn' the word) what could they be replaced with..... mmm     dual sulky races say Butchers v Abernethies  , arna and nicky v amanda and samantha. wow betting on them great . what about the kids carts , thats exciting esp with the huge handicaps.!what about senior horses over 9 years with over 150 starts each and for drivers over 60...  now I am being stupid but !!!!!!!!!:rcf-happy-7:

Good to see you now looking for solutions for our fading industry John.

Dunno if galloping grizzlies can help much though I impressed they were watching 'harness' but maybe thats because most of the participants are strong in galloping......Rogerson ,Northcott ,Wenn ,Cameron ,Medcalfe to name a few !I used to live in a galloping district too but then they woke up one year and most had left.

Dunno if that code is travelling so well these days either .......many cynics had a field day with  recent happenings like tracks ,postponements ,lack of jockeys and the jumping races fuel that fire...had to roll the eyes in a recent jumps race at Wingatui when two of the field just slipped on the track at Puddle Alley corner ,apparently never to be seen again !

Any way, Harness in the North faces greater challenges...the two big ones are the solvency of the ATC and the lack of horses to even hold the races ! Had the South Island horses not arrived of late ,meetings would have been canned at ATC. The ongoing stench of INCA and the Government's [and public's] growing dislike of 'gambling on horses' not helping .

I'm sure Jack was pleased ATC held a 'proper' meeting on Friday with 5 of the eight races being won by $1.20 to $1.50 favourites  and two at $3.- something,  races being processions of 6 horse fields !

Then there's the small issue of only a few senior drivers getting a handful of drives with DButcher,JDickie and Poutama getting one each while only 4 x juniors got a drive [ 1 got 2].Then who will be training in the North in a few years with some of the big breeders/syndicators asking if its worth continuing.

Keep those ideas coming John.

But don't pay too much attention to the galloping grizzlies !

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Only 56 starters on Friday night - hard to comprehend how ATC can continue to function with that level of participation.  

Some further thinking may need to be done outside the square ..... why not hold day time meetings every Sunday this time of year?

Twas quite pleasant at Cambridge yesterday.

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5 hours ago, Taku Umanga said:

Only 56 starters on Friday night - hard to comprehend how ATC can continue to function with that level of participation.  

Some further thinking may need to be done outside the square ..... why not hold day time meetings every Sunday this time of year?

Twas quite pleasant at Cambridge yesterday.

Stop being sensible :rcfe-nerd-1:

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Cambridge was great. Better than a freezing Thursday night.atc a bit unlucky 2 major stables out 9f business. Monte th8s week programmed.word hasn't filtered through from hrnz or some has decided riu don't run racing.if they have it is better than last week's.

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2 hours ago, tim vince said:

Cambridge was great. Better than a freezing Thursday night.atc a bit unlucky 2 major stables out 9f business. Monte th8s week programmed.word hasn't filtered through from hrnz or some has decided riu don't run racing.if they have it is better than last week's.

Nice win at Cambridge Tim !

I note this weeks Monte a stand start from handicaps...seems sensible as several of the trials have been a stand.

The monte race will only be held if nominations for other races don't stand up which seems somewhat uncertain for all concerned !

Noms this week have the numbers ,some over subscribed ,yet disappointing only 7 x noms for the non-winners trot !

Then a couple of horses who have won twice earning less than $16k entered in 2200m mobile may be transferred to Discretionary Pace ,a stand over 2700 where the spread over 25 points. Not exactly like v like  and totally discouraging IMO.

The ATC doing well to fill worthwhile betting fields but the trainers etc need to do their collective bit as well !

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Only redeeming feature this week is last race. only 3 trainers and masochists left in the stands at Alex. Can our industry handle another disgrace esp with another 600mtrs for jockeys to A. hold on and B. to maintain gait... why not just have them all galloping , much fairer.Off to bed at 10 pm.....zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

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Tasman Man , you seem a reasonable type. but simple volume does not necessarily win an argument. You go on about all horses paying a dividend first 4s etc. but as all horses outside the first 3 ie. the next 4 were all disqualified a first 4 was not declared ie. the TAb I assume didnot refund punters. Another matter to ponder is all horses this week have deafeners,most removable ! How many hands do the jockeys have ???? and how safe is it. Do we need a crash for ATC, HRNZ, NZRIU. RITA. to ban this type of farce .(Ihope not)

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Mr godber on trackside radio today continues to oppose.boss of hrnz seems uncommitted.wait and see what happens this week.6th best race for turnover last week race 1.last race Friday.not a good spot for them.lets hope a competitive race ensures Moe of them. A bad one  could be a nail in the coffin.

Peter early against 

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