poundforpound

How y’all looking now

116 posts in this topic

5 hours ago, Huey said:

Yeah wasn't Te Rapa supposed to sell up a while ago and contribute to a new facility near cambridge?

The three clubs Waikato/Cambridge and Waipa,to the best of my knowledge, are undertaking a feasibility study into the "Greenfields" project. You wouldn't expect any final decision to be made without due diligence being undertaken first. 

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5 hours ago, Red Rum said:

What's happening with that Cambridge AWT , is it under construction if so does anyone know dates of  first test meeting  ? Never ever are  those 3 AWT  going to get built . Riccarton got no show for one .

 

I believe that it is planned to be ready for winter next year. 

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11 hours ago, rdytdy said:

The three clubs Waikato/Cambridge and Waipa,to the best of my knowledge, are undertaking a feasibility study into the "Greenfields" project. You wouldn't expect any final decision to be made without due diligence being undertaken first. 

That's great that they get to engage in a feasibility study unlike the likes of Avondale who are just being told they are unwanted.

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They did their feasibility study, as only the racing community can do, and decided ( without asking the Te Rapa / Waikato committee ) that selling Te Rapa would largely fund this new facility.....but they forgot to ask Te Rapa if it was ok to cash up their valuable assets and take the proceeds first, and when they did finally ask Te Rapa if it was ok to grab their land sale proceeds it went to the vote, & it was unanimous ..... every member voted against it 

That’s racing politics for you, right there, in a nutshell 

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Nobody should sell any of the assets. They should be leveraged correctly and relationships with private enterprise should be promoted to make racing into an industry, entertainment, betting and real estate business. History says that if the members sell their real estate, the money gets pissed up the wall and the industry finds itself back at square one minus the land that they owned. As real estate is making every one with half a brain a fortune, why not look at this as a real estate play first and foremost, don't sell the land but leverage its current value, and produce a greenfields project that itself is another real estate play but with an equine bent to it. That way the club retains ownership of the asset that was gifted to it some time ago, the members have the benefit of an astutely managed business model and racing prospers due to the development of a cutting edge system that makes us all prosper.

 

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Nice work Berri Fruit......can you help us all understand what happened to the 35 million per annum the FairTax movement obtained ( through the endeavours of a precious few, and with considerable resistance from the NZRB ) for the industry......that was just cash coming in by virtue of a change ( thanks Winston ) in gambling duty.....but that money seems to have evaporated !!

Surely the industry morons wouldn’t fall for the same trap and waste precious cash on stakes again would they ?

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2 hours ago, Berri said:

Nobody should sell any of the assets. They should be leveraged correctly and relationships with private enterprise should be promoted to make racing into an industry, entertainment, betting and real estate business. History says that if the members sell their real estate, the money gets pissed up the wall and the industry finds itself back at square one minus the land that they owned. As real estate is making every one with half a brain a fortune, why not look at this as a real estate play first and foremost, don't sell the land but leverage its current value, and produce a greenfields project that itself is another real estate play but with an equine bent to it. That way the club retains ownership of the asset that was gifted to it some time ago, the members have the benefit of an astutely managed business model and racing prospers due to the development of a cutting edge system that makes us all prosper.

 

Not as simple as it sounds though Berri....ask the ATC.....:rolleyes:

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2 hours ago, poundforpound said:

Nice work Berri Fruit......can you help us all understand what happened to the 35 million per annum the FairTax movement obtained ( through the endeavours of a precious few, and with considerable resistance from the NZRB ) for the industry......that was just cash coming in by virtue of a change ( thanks Winston ) in gambling duty.....but that money seems to have evaporated !!

Surely the industry morons wouldn’t fall for the same trap and waste precious cash on stakes again would they ?

It was pissed up against the wall by a bunch of inept administrators that should not have been mandated to run racing. It's that simple. The problem that we have is that the current administration (not including MAC in this as they're a chance) have no idea. Despite many of them professing to be experienced racing administrators, most of them haven't been to Newmarket and understood the nuances of those training facilities and associated race tracks. Expecting them to have been to Lambourne or some of the major international training/ racing centres is once again bereft of actual experience. 

Small mindedness says that we should replace a Te Rapa with a newer version of Te Rapa. Inexperience says that we replace a Cambridge/ Matamata with another Cambridge/ Matamata. 

Here's something to consider...

“Here’s to the crazy ones

The misfits, the rebels

The troublemakers

The round pegs in the square holes

The ones who see things differently

They are not fond of rules

And they have no respect for the status quo

You can quote them

Disagree with them

Glorify or vilify them

About the only thing you can’t do is ignore them

Because they change things

They push the human race forward

And while some may see them as the crazy ones

Some will see genius

Because the people who are crazy to think they can change the World

Are the ones who do”

Steve Jobs – Apple Founder and CEO

 

So let's do something simple. Let's get rid of the dead wood in the racing industry. As a collective we simply say no more. It's time for a change and its time to embrace those that want to change. Nothing else will do. In respect of Greenfields, that's exactly what it should be...Greenfields.

We have a shortage of housing, especially affordable housing. We need new race tracks with dimensions that will be suited to future racing, with courses, topography and surfaces that are the envy of the World. We need training facilities for the next century and for the good of the horse. We need the appropriate level of revenue and steady income to support the growth of that. We need to build our capital base so that the participants and the horses can rely on the structure going forward. If betting is not the only thing we can do to rely on that revenue, then what else do we need to do to guarantee the result?

Let's build a new racing town.

 

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4 hours ago, poundforpound said:

They did their feasibility study, as only the racing community can do, and decided ( without asking the Te Rapa / Waikato committee ) that selling Te Rapa would largely fund this new facility.....but they forgot to ask Te Rapa if it was ok to cash up their valuable assets and take the proceeds first, and when they did finally ask Te Rapa if it was ok to grab their land sale proceeds it went to the vote, & it was unanimous ..... every member voted against it 

That’s racing politics for you, right there, in a nutshell 

My understanding is that a second one involving all three clubs in the process has been commissioned. 

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30 minutes ago, Berri said:

..........So let's do something simple. Let's get rid of the dead wood in the racing industry. As a collective we simply say no more. It's time for a change and its time to embrace those that want to change. Nothing else will do. In respect of Greenfields, that's exactly what it should be...Greenfields.

We have a shortage of housing, especially affordable housing. We need new race tracks with dimensions that will be suited to future racing, with courses, topography and surfaces that are the envy of the World. We need training facilities for the next century and for the good of the horse. We need the appropriate level of revenue and steady income to support the growth of that. We need to build our capital base so that the participants and the horses can rely on the structure going forward. If betting is not the only thing we can do to rely on that revenue, then what else do we need to do to guarantee the result?

Let's build a new racing town.

 

In theory great idea. Lets face it traditionally many involved in racing have capitilised on urban spread by selling up and moving further out. Not a bad formula. I have always believed Avondale would do best by moving out in line with population spread. 20 years ago Hobsonville would have been ideal now its the fastest growing area in New Zealand. However from just casual observation Parakai would seem to have suitable land. I believe the owner of the airport there was trying to sell it. Its crazy that given the population between Auckland-Orewa-Helensville there isn't any racecourse. Don't think the Waikato should have a monoploy on horse racing.

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You need 3000ha of land to do the job justice . Build 3500 houses, 3 racetracks, one equestrian centre, training gallops all over the place, including jumping and of course a town of approx 60ha. Quite simple really.

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1 hour ago, crustyngrizzly said:

How much land at Te Akau.?

 

1 hour ago, crustyngrizzly said:

How much land at Te Akau.?

Not the right topography or location. Properties able to produce 3 race tracks with 2 having 2000m straights is not easy to find. They do exist though. Have to add the town centre as well

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On 6/16/2019 at 12:15 PM, Huey said:

I think we have been down this road a few times before but anyway...why should clubs (most of which have been treated very poorly by the industry and in particular the governing body) have to sell up and invest in the Ponzi Scheme that is now NZracing for the sake of a few favoured clubs , to watch those funds be squandered by the same people that have taken racing in NZ to where it is now?

Anyone that takes the M report seriously with regards to the selling up of clubs assets needs to get some fresh air, there was absolutely no analysis done on venues it was yet another report to benefit a favoured few at the expense of many. I could see it generating some support if some decent analysis(with no emotion or typical NZracing style bias) with a plan for the future in mind was done , because if that was the case the recommendations of the M report as to which assets should be sold up or venues raced at would have been vastly different imo.

There are a number of racing clubs in NZ who have squandered away the better years of NZracing for their own selfish interests with no regard to the future that now want yet another leg up to continue to do the same for the foreseeable future.

I applaud the likes of Avondale for taking a stand , they have done nothing wrong and all they want to do is be a racing club but they are not part of the cool kids at the back of the NZ racing bus so they and some others are being exposed to  bullying and a total disregard for their efforts.

I applaud the likes of Avondale for taking a stand , they have done nothing wrong ...

REALLY? THE AJC HAVE SAT ON THEIR LAND/TRACK ASSET FOR DECADES AND FAILED TO INVEST IN THEIR FACILITIES, RETAINING THE BIGGEST EYESORE (IE GRANDSTAND) IN THE INDUSTRY. ..IT IS AN EMBARRASSMENT AND HAS BEEN FOR YEARS...I AGREE THAT THE CLUB CANNOT/SHOULD NOT HAVE THEIR ASSET GRABBED OFF THEM, BUT WHY HAVE THEY ALLOWED THIS TO HAPPEN? THE SMALL PARCEL OF LAND THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT SELLING NOW COULD HAVE BEEN SOLD YEARS AGO TO FUND A NEW GRANDSTAND ...

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On 6/15/2019 at 10:46 AM, arjay said:

So Avondale club say's no sale. fair enough, I think the track is needed, but they propose to build a new Grandstand, why? no one attends a meeting unless it's a glamour meet of fashion and whatever.  Smaller model perhaps required? Unless they incorporate it with the birdcage area and needed facilities? I doubt anyone will be able to force a sale in any case.

SO IF THERE IS NO VIABLE CASE TO BUILD NEW FACILITIES, SELL THE COURSE LOCK STOCK AND BARREL AND ALLOW THE PRIMO LAND TO BE USED FOR BETTER PURPOSES IE HOUSING.

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15 hours ago, weasel57 said:

SO IF THERE IS NO VIABLE CASE TO BUILD NEW FACILITIES, SELL THE COURSE LOCK STOCK AND BARREL AND ALLOW THE PRIMO LAND TO BE USED FOR BETTER PURPOSES IE HOUSING.

They don't want to sell the course because  all monies, assets,  now go to racing authorities as I understand it.  Before,  the constitution allowed the member's to decide where everything went  in event of club being dissolved, of course member's can't benefit,  but could give to charity if so desired.    Under pressure club's had to bow down and sign away that right, now on dissolution everything would be taken  out of their control.    I'm sure that is way it is now, but stand to be corrected. 

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15 hours ago, weasel57 said:

I applaud the likes of Avondale for taking a stand , they have done nothing wrong ...

REALLY? THE AJC HAVE SAT ON THEIR LAND/TRACK ASSET FOR DECADES AND FAILED TO INVEST IN THEIR FACILITIES, RETAINING THE BIGGEST EYESORE (IE GRANDSTAND) IN THE INDUSTRY. ..IT IS AN EMBARRASSMENT AND HAS BEEN FOR YEARS...I AGREE THAT THE CLUB CANNOT/SHOULD NOT HAVE THEIR ASSET GRABBED OFF THEM, BUT WHY HAVE THEY ALLOWED THIS TO HAPPEN? THE SMALL PARCEL OF LAND THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT SELLING NOW COULD HAVE BEEN SOLD YEARS AGO TO FUND A NEW GRANDSTAND ...

All very well in hindsight Weasel, they probably thought they'd get their own races back at their course as well. 

I don't get the thinking behind building the stand either.

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5 minutes ago, Huey said:

All very well in hindsight Weasel, they probably thought they'd get their own races back at their course as well. 

I don't get the thinking behind building the stand either.

I'm sure they thought they would get their feature races  back, the  Auckland Racing  Club offered them back, but authorities stepped in and said they didn't want the G2 races ? televised from there because  it didn't look good on television with the eyesore grandstand etc.  As a member I'm flummoxed if they are entertaining idea of new stand, just bowl the old one and leave it at that.    They  won't be selling, but that will almost certainly mean no more racing licences, so what the hell would a new grandstand achieve ?

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Take the Avondale Jockey Club. They had a crack at night racing and spent a lot on the lights etc. It was a good idea but then they didn't have a fit for purpose facility and employed people from West Auckland to do the catering. We went on the first night because we had runners (actually they scored a double). But the food was bad, the drinks were bad and the attitude was that it was a day race meeting with day race meeting service and it surprisingly (not) failed.

They got in such schook that they accumulated debt and then through some miracle sold off a parcel of land in a dubious transaction for a dubious sum of money. Move forward a decade and the club is once again in the schook and has remained in the schook ever since. So the next proposition is to sell another parcel of land with very little forward planning. The original land sold a decade ago is now worth 5 times more than it was and if it was still in the hands of the racing club, and had been utilised properly using astute property developers, then there would be enough income to run racing. 

Does this sound like a pattern in other racing locations? So why not get this lot together, sack most of the board members, restructure the racing clubs' bureaucracy and governance and manage the process centrally to maximise the efficiency of capital development that creates revenue and wealth, and stop pursuing the same failure model of years gone by.

Only idiots believe that doing the same thing will create change.

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On 6/17/2019 at 11:38 AM, Berri said:

Nobody should sell any of the assets. They should be leveraged correctly and relationships with private enterprise should be promoted to make racing into an industry, entertainment, betting and real estate business. History says that if the members sell their real estate, the money gets pissed up the wall and the industry finds itself back at square one minus the land that they owned. As real estate is making every one with half a brain a fortune, why not look at this as a real estate play first and foremost, don't sell the land but leverage its current value, and produce a greenfields project that itself is another real estate play but with an equine bent to it. That way the club retains ownership of the asset that was gifted to it some time ago, the members have the benefit of an astutely managed business model and racing prospers due to the development of a cutting edge system that makes us all prosper.

 

You should have advised the Auckland Trotting Club before their cock up

 

Greg

 

 

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Just now, Berri said:

Take the Avondale Jockey Club. They had a crack at night racing and spent a lot on the lights etc. It was a good idea but then they didn't have a fit for purpose facility and employed people from West Auckland to do the catering. We went on the first night because we had runners (actually they scored a double). But the food was bad, the drinks were bad and the attitude was that it was a day race meeting with day race meeting service and it surprisingly (not) failed.

They got in such schook that they accumulated debt and then through some miracle sold off a parcel of land in a dubious transaction for a dubious sum of money. Move forward a decade and the club is once again in the schook and has remained in the schook ever since. So the next proposition is to sell another parcel of land with very little forward planning. The original land sold a decade ago is now worth 5 times more than it was and if it was still in the hands of the racing club, and had been utilised properly using astute property developers, then there would be enough income to run racing. 

Does this sound like a pattern in other racing locations? So why not get this lot together, sack most of the board members, restructure the racing clubs' bureaucracy and governance and manage the process centrally to maximise the efficiency of capital development that creates revenue and wealth, and stop pursuing the same failure model of years gone by.

Only idiots believe that doing the same thing will create change.

The funny thing about the night racing was it worked in Summer. I remember being told by committee member's that the T / O's for night Summer racing  far exceeded the Summer daytime figures.  What absolutely killed them was the Winter night racing where you couldn't get two men and a dog out.    I remember one night getting free drinks as something like 3 member's turned up.  If you can't get more than 3 member's there how could you get the public stuck outside ? Maybe they could have stuck to Summer and dumped the Winter's.

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It wasn't the winter racing that stuffed it up, it was the facility and the service. Simple as that. If you have winter night racing, then make sure you don't have to wear Antarctic weather gear to prevent hypothermia. If you don't have women, you don't get men. If you have cold, you don't have women. What's so difficult?

If you don't have good quality meals, you don't get those that can afford race horses to be there. Same as drinks. So if you don't have them both, you don't get people with disposable income going there. Imagine if the Sky Casino only served cod chips, pies and sausage rolls, gave you average carbonated warm beer, and encased the entire floor in a refrigerator. How long do you think it would be for the droves to leave?

101 in hospitality I would have thought.

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