dock leaf

waimate

49 posts in this topic

You can argue that the small industry days / clubs  are doing better than the big days , arguably  true but that's like accepting the booby prise as the big prise , there is no possible future in that . It's like saying the owning the corner dairy is better than owning the super market  because the corner dairy made $80k for the year and the under performing super market only made 100k . Fix the supermarket and make a million a year , something the corner dairy will never do .

Racing must fix Saturday racing to have any chance of rebuilding the industry and it will only be done by upgrading facility's and creating a great day out , that's impossible to do at many of the aged , middle of nowhere tracks .

And the future is not here , have a look at the photo in the first post , very similar to the recent photos and history of Winton and Gore , those involved in these clubs are mostly old people  who remember the 50s .

The problem with the Messara report is the time it will take to implement , how many people involved in racing today will be involved in  5/10 years , I suspect very few .

 

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5 hours ago, Huey said:

Let me gets this right, you think the bottom i.e. Industry days etc are being propped up by Saturday racing or Group Racing or are you saying the bigger clubs are propping up the smaller clubs?

You can argue that the small industry days / clubs  are doing better than the big days , arguably  true but that's like accepting the booby prise as the big prise , there is no possible future in that . It's like saying the owning the corner dairy is better than owning the super market  because the corner dairy made $80k for the year and the under performing super market only made 100k . Fix the supermarket and make a million a year , something the corner dairy will never do .

Racing must fix Saturday racing to have any chance of rebuilding the industry and it will only be done by upgrading facility's and creating a great day out , that's impossible to do at many of the aged , middle of nowhere tracks .

And the future is not here , have a look at the photo in the first post , very similar to the recent photos and history of Winton and Gore , those involved in these clubs are mostly old people  who remember the 50s .

The problem with the Messara report is the time it will take to implement , how many people involved in racing today will be involved in  5/10 years , I suspect very few

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12 hours ago, tripple alliance said:

How much more proof do you need that restructuring is imperative , one of the reasons stakes have fallen is the bottom has been propped up at the expense of the better grades , money down the drain .

Racing must change , it's in a similar position to where movie theatres were when home video were all the rage , they restructured , went upmarket , comfortable seats , coffee and food delivered to your seat , they turned going to the movies into a desirable experience and have never looked back , it can be done but not with crap facility's in the middle of nowhere , it's time to wipe the board clean and rebuild . Do nothing and failure is guaranteed 

I'm a bit busy to comment on this right now, but obviously it is something I have an opinion on, so I will get back to it later. I do like your movies analogy. In the meantime, let's assume Waimate gives up altogether and next year this licence is held at Riccarton on the same day, which obviously would be your preferred option. Could you list some of the "significant " advantages this would have for the industry. Obviously we can all work out that there will be a few savings with TAB staff, stipes and a few other odds and sods not having to travel all the way to Waimate. Easier for some trainers and jockeys as well, but not all. But I assume these minor "savings" aren't enough to turn the industry around, and there must be a bigger picture thing that many of us miss.

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Reading these comments I cant help wondering if some of you are missing the point. Punting pays for racing - no betting = no income = low stakes.

Unfortunately for clubs like Waimate as a result of only having 1 or 2 days a year its hard to punt with confidence when you dont have a good understanding of track conditions. Yesterday was rated as a Good 3 but they were running close to 1.13 + for 1200 m - really ? Even allowing for the class of horse going around that seems off.

If we want to grow turnover then we need to provide punters with racing surfaces they can bet on with confidence. Clubs like Waimate will always struggle in that regard. Inconsistent racing surfaces when you cant follow the form must end up being a turnoff for punters. Eventually they give up and spend their money on something else. This is a major issue with the problems of NZ racing, and in my view is the major factor which suggests racecourse rationalisation is essential.

That said the big clubs are not exactly showing the way forward on this issue, and need to improve dramatically. 

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You make good points re. track consistency, form was certainly not easy to follow yesterday,  but how does that equate to some of the country Aus tracks.?

...and how about UK tracks which are variable in the extreme?

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46 minutes ago, We're Doomed said:

I'm a bit busy to comment on this right now, but obviously it is something I have an opinion on, so I will get back to it later. I do like your movies analogy. In the meantime, let's assume Waimate gives up altogether and next year this licence is held at Riccarton on the same day, which obviously would be your preferred option. Could you list some of the "significant " advantages this would have for the industry. Obviously we can all work out that there will be a few savings with TAB staff, stipes and a few other odds and sods not having to travel all the way to Waimate. Easier for some trainers and jockeys as well, but not all. But I assume these minor "savings" aren't enough to turn the industry around, and there must be a bigger picture thing that many of us miss.

Think they have been directed to run at Oamaru

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3 hours ago, We're Doomed said:

I'm a bit busy to comment on this right now, but obviously it is something I have an opinion on, so I will get back to it later. I do like your movies analogy. In the meantime, let's assume Waimate gives up altogether and next year this licence is held at Riccarton on the same day, which obviously would be your preferred option. Could you list some of the "significant " advantages this would have for the industry. Obviously we can all work out that there will be a few savings with TAB staff, stipes and a few other odds and sods not having to travel all the way to Waimate. Easier for some trainers and jockeys as well, but not all. But I assume these minor "savings" aren't enough to turn the industry around, and there must be a bigger picture thing that many of us miss.

You will get the advantage of a Heavy 10 at Riccarton! Oamaru a better option

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6 hours ago, fitzy said:

Reading these comments I cant help wondering if some of you are missing the point. Punting pays for racing - no betting = no income = low stakes.

Unfortunately for clubs like Waimate as a result of only having 1 or 2 days a year its hard to punt with confidence when you dont have a good understanding of track conditions. Yesterday was rated as a Good 3 but they were running close to 1.13 + for 1200 m - really ? Even allowing for the class of horse going around that seems off.

If we want to grow turnover then we need to provide punters with racing surfaces they can bet on with confidence. Clubs like Waimate will always struggle in that regard. Inconsistent racing surfaces when you cant follow the form must end up being a turnoff for punters. Eventually they give up and spend their money on something else. This is a major issue with the problems of NZ racing, and in my view is the major factor which suggests racecourse rationalisation is essential.

That said the big clubs are not exactly showing the way forward on this issue, and need to improve dramatically. 

Very sound points. I would be so much happier betting on a heavy 11 at Trentham at this time of year.

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6 hours ago, Pam Robson said:

Think they have been directed to run at Oamaru

How exactly will the industry benefit from that? It is further from Riccarton, so probably even less Canty horses than Waimate got. Closer to Wingatui, but they didn't seem very interested in Waimate so probably not that keen on Oamaru either.

Will the club bother to continue racing? And if so will all of their local sponsors want to support Oamaru? I see it even looks like they boosted the better class sprint by $4,000 this year.

Bit strange making a South Canty club race in Otago when there is a perfectly good racecourse with better facilities in Timaru.

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6 minutes ago, We're Doomed said:

How exactly will the industry benefit from that? It is further from Riccarton, so probably even less Canty horses than Waimate got. Closer to Wingatui, but they didn't seem very interested in Waimate so probably not that keen on Oamaru either.

Will the club bother to continue racing? And if so will all of their local sponsors want to support Oamaru? I see it even looks like they boosted the better class sprint by $4,000 this year.

Bit strange making a South Canty club race in Otago when there is a perfectly good racecourse with better facilities in Timaru.

I think it's odd too....Timaru a far better option for mine.

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Just as a matter of interest  - given that the three codes are funded from the same 'bank'  how is stopping a galloping club from racing on a particular course,  but allowing harness to maintain its involvement going to 'save money' ?

Harness will still have to attend to track surfaces,  stabling,  tie-ups etc - as well as have the 'fixed costs'  of TAB staff,  doctors/veterinary etc....

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I just had a look at the final 400s from Waimate. People and cars lined up the entire length of the straight, and well past the finish post as well. And from the first race until the last race. I bet Trentham and Riccarton would love to see a crowd like that. I wonder what the official attendance and turnover was.

Does anyone know if a representative from the NZRB and NZTR attended the meeting and gave a small talk thanking them for their efforts over the years and reassuring them that them falling on their swords was for the greater good of the whole industry and the whole industry would be much better off without them?

I am quite serious there, does a delegation of Racings "leadership" and big picture thinkers attend "final meetings" like that just to let the locals know people are thinking of them. Was Glenda there? Does she know where Waimate is? NZ's best shot-putter does come from Timaru so I imagine she does know where Waimate is.

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2 hours ago, We're Doomed said:

I just had a look at the final 400s from Waimate. People and cars lined up the entire length of the straight, and well past the finish post as well. And from the first race until the last race. I bet Trentham and Riccarton would love to see a crowd like that. I wonder what the official attendance and turnover was.

Does anyone know if a representative from the NZRB and NZTR attended the meeting and gave a small talk thanking them for their efforts over the years and reassuring them that them falling on their swords was for the greater good of the whole industry and the whole industry would be much better off without them?

I am quite serious there, does a delegation of Racings "leadership" and big picture thinkers attend "final meetings" like that just to let the locals know people are thinking of them. Was Glenda there? Does she know where Waimate is? NZ's best shot-putter does come from Timaru so I imagine she does know where Waimate is.

I don't think we have too many ' big picture thinkers ' .....

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21 hours ago, Huey said:

Are there many horses trained at Waimate?

There are a few trotters - not sure of numbers, and very few gallopers.

Stephen Blair-Eddie owns a property near the track and bases himself there in the winter. 

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can you tell me via the mess report how stratford got the push 13000 people at their last race meeting do ellerslie get that many no but stratford is still going just as normal without a race meeting sponsors of yesteryear are putting their money into non racing a good look for thoroughbred racing to say the least

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5 hours ago, We're Doomed said:

I just had a look at the final 400s from Waimate. People and cars lined up the entire length of the straight, and well past the finish post as well. And from the first race until the last race. I bet Trentham and Riccarton would love to see a crowd like that. I wonder what the official attendance and turnover was.

Does anyone know if a representative from the NZRB and NZTR attended the meeting and gave a small talk thanking them for their efforts over the years and reassuring them that them falling on their swords was for the greater good of the whole industry and the whole industry would be much better off without them?

I am quite serious there, does a delegation of Racings "leadership" and big picture thinkers attend "final meetings" like that just to let the locals know people are thinking of them. Was Glenda there? Does she know where Waimate is? NZ's best shot-putter does come from Timaru so I imagine she does know where Waimate is

Who cares if a handful attended , cars are the only possible way to get there , have you ever been to Waimate , there's nothing there , zilch ., seriously zero .

Those who attended will be  from Timaru or Oamaru so moving will be a good saving for motorists . Racing today has very little to do with on course attendance .

If the club works with Omaru it will be a positive for the few members that belong to Waimate , it will be a win win .

Nobody has said the industry will be better off without them but to survive they need to move on which they have . 

No need for any reps from NZRB OR NZTR to attend , can you imagine  cafer's going hysterical  at the cost  , they can watch on TV just like the rest of us .

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1 hour ago, tripple alliance said:

Who cares if a handful attended , cars are the only possible way to get there , have you ever been to Waimate , there's nothing there , zilch ., seriously zero .

Those who attended will be  from Timaru or Oamaru so moving will be a good saving for motorists . Racing today has very little to do with on course attendance .

If the club works with Omaru it will be a positive for the few members that belong to Waimate , it will be a win win .

Nobody has said the industry will be better off without them but to survive they need to move on which they have . 

No need for any reps from NZRB OR NZTR to attend , can you imagine  cafer's going hysterical  at the cost  , they can watch on TV just like the rest of us .

Interesting logic. It is about the same distance from Oamaru and Timaru to Waimate as it is from Wellington to Trentham. And the fact they probably got as a big a crowd as Riccarton and Trentham could manage does show that there is a bit of a niche for country meetings in centres where nothing else happens. And remember this is in the middle of June; not too many clubs rushing to race on those dates.

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3 hours ago, edor said:

can you tell me via the mess report how stratford got the push 13000 people at their last race meeting do ellerslie get that many no but stratford is still going just as normal without a race meeting sponsors of yesteryear are putting their money into non racing a good look for thoroughbred racing to say the least

What meeting was that? Would have lucky to have been 2000 people.

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17 hours ago, We're Doomed said:

I just had a look at the final 400s from Waimate. People and cars lined up the entire length of the straight, and well past the finish post as well. And from the first race until the last race. I bet Trentham and Riccarton would love to see a crowd like that. I wonder what the official attendance and turnover was.

Does anyone know if a representative from the NZRB and NZTR attended the meeting and gave a small talk thanking them for their efforts over the years and reassuring them that them falling on their swords was for the greater good of the whole industry and the whole industry would be much better off without them?

I am quite serious there, does a delegation of Racings "leadership" and big picture thinkers attend "final meetings" like that just to let the locals know people are thinking of them. Was Glenda there? Does she know where Waimate is? NZ's best shot-putter does come from Timaru so I imagine she does know where Waimate is.

Glenda was probably too busy packing her bags for a 30 June departure and/or negotiating her 'exit package' and holiday destination.

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