Anyone know?

[We're Doomed 4,855]

I have asked this before and no one has answered. I note that at Invercargill tomorrow maidens race for $10,000 and up to rating 57 winners race for $9,000. Why do maidens in harness racing race for more than winners, and how can winning horses be rated lower than maidens? All seems a bit weird to me.

[Overcheck 190]

10 hours ago, We're Doomed said:

I have asked this before and no one has answered. I note that at Invercargill tomorrow maidens race for $10,000 and up to rating 57 winners race for $9,000. Why do maidens in harness racing race for more than winners, and how can winning horses be rated lower than maidens? All seems a bit weird to me.

I don't really know but it may be because maidens could be rated higher through getting placings in races, and conversely winners could have their ratings reduced because of losing runs. I think the $10.000 for maidens was brought in to encourage more people to race horses, but I may be wrong.

[We're Doomed 4,855]

7 hours ago, Overcheck said:

I don't really know but it may be because maidens could be rated higher through getting placings in races, and conversely winners could have their ratings reduced because of losing runs. I think the $10.000 for maidens was brought in to encourage more people to race horses, but I may be wrong.

Thank you for that Overcheck. It is amazing how hardly anyone knows how it all works and no one seems to understand the bizarre handicapping and stakes system.

[Taku Umanga 194]

The maiden stake will include the HRNZ $1500 bonus payment for a horse's first win. 

[westview 155]

The stake should not include the 1500.00 dollars bonus payment, when we suggested it to , that is the owners sub committee we were very clear that clubs did not simply add it into there winning stakes to make them seem better. I'm hoping that isn't the case here.

 

[We're Doomed 4,855]

I notice that at Invercargill this coming weekend the same thing happens again: maidens race for more than winners. Is this a perculiary Southland thing or is it a Harness thing?  No one seems to know. In most races they don't even appear to pay out the full stake. As they pay $200 to all starters and most races don't have full fields they seem to save $1,000 per race. Interestingly the $20,000 race follows the old approach of the winner getting 65% of the total stake whereas in the other races the winner only gets about 55%. I notice also that in the $10,000 races the 2nd and 3rd placegetters are only getting 14% and 7% of the total stake respectively. Previously it would have been 20% and 10%. So really, under the traditional way of paying out stakes these are only $7,000 races with a participation fee being paid to those runners who can't keep up. Seems strange that they do it this way and even stranger that no one seems to know how the system works. I would have thought someone involved with a club or HRNZ would read these threads and be able to shed some light on such things.

[what a post 811]

1 hour ago, We're Doomed said:

It notice that at Invercargill this coming weekend the same thing happens again: maidens race for more than winners. Is this a perculiary Southland thing or is it a Harness thing?  No one seems to know. In most races they don't even appear to pay out the full stake. As they pay $200 to all starters and most races don't have full fields they seem to save $1,000 per race. Interestingly the $20,000 race follows the old approach of the winner getting 65% of the total stake whereas in the other races the winner only gets about 55%. I notice also that in the $10,000 races the 2nd and 3rd placegetters are only getting 14% and 7% of the total stake respectively. Previously it would have been 20% and 10%. So really, under the traditional way of paying out stakes these are only $7,000 races with a participation fee being paid to those runners who can't keep up. Seems strange that they do it this way and even stranger that no one seems to know how the system works. I would have thought someone involved with a club or HRNZ would read these threads and be able to shed some light on such things.

Its a southland harness racing initiative. They've been doing it since January.  Is designed to give owners a greater return for their horses first win,. They haven't cut other stakes,just increased the first win stake. The owners get the $1500 hrnz bonus for their first win on top of the programmed stake.  The hrnz bonus is  included when looking at the results,but not included in the pre race advertised stake.At least that's my take on it.

Any races pre race advertised stake is based on having a full field. When a full field does not participate the payment to those not finishing in the first 4 is obviously reduced, in number of payments.  For example a 10 horse race with a stake payment of $200 to non placegetters,on a track which caters for a 14 horse field, will reduce by 4 X $200 from that officially advertised pre race..