Crackthewhip

Police Raids

588 posts in this topic

1 hour ago, Gruff said:

Everyone who walks the earth knows or knew that harness Racing is full of thieves,it’s well documented and many have seen it at the track, it’s not rocket science . It’s time this industry is shut down, I really enjoyed the theatre and given my time again I probably wouldn’t change a thing regardless ,but there are far to many variables even without factoring in the  cheating to keep this viable. RIP Thieves on wheels. One things for sure if there’s pearly gates we won’t be seeing to many getting through from this mob:rcfe-happy-2:

I just googled jockeys caught with drugs the first on was Galloping trainer bringing 20 million dollars worth in Fiji and hundreds of jockeys been caught I'm with you Gruff shut all horse racing and dog racing down and jail them all for life no more Melbourne Cups or Everests Nz Cups. And don't even worry about their livelihoods, the bastards with their Ring-Ins Cobalt, Milk shaking at the races,  Thank god no Kiwi jockeys have ever been caught on drugs.

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22 minutes ago, Sickopunter said:

Go back under your thoroughbred rock.

What Rock?  I wanted to be a Driver when James Stormont was wooing teenage girls in  Pukekohe. I was at Tony Perucichs when he had Stormy Morn witnessing the financial tension between him and his partner, but Tony wasn’t a betting man. I can’t blame these cheats for what they do sicko , all they are trying to do is feed their families, and when they’re not getting results what do you do?  Remove the temptation is the only answer you dumb sick bastard :rcf-laughing-2: just jokes :rcfe-money:

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1 hour ago, Gruff said:

Everyone who walks the earth knows or knew that harness Racing is full of thieves,it’s well documented and many have seen it at the track, it’s not rocket science . It’s time this industry is shut down, I really enjoyed the theatre and given my time again I probably wouldn’t change a thing regardless ,but there are far to many variables even without factoring in the  cheating to keep this viable. RIP Thieves on wheels. One things for sure if there’s pearly gates we won’t be seeing to many getting through from this mob:rcfe-happy-2:

Gruff there is no need for inflammatory stuff like that.

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Just now, scooby3051 said:

Gruff there is no need for inflammatory stuff like that.

I’ve got the utmost respect for most people on this site Scoob you included but let’s face the facts, inflammatory ? It’s what everyone’s been saying for decades . We all kept punting regardless due to the entertainment value.Great Racing when it was:rcf-in-love:

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Am not a lawyer so keen to understand which sides pay what sort of $$ and how long things can take in order to get to a final whistle result.

From a layman's perspective....

- initial charge(s) laid and one option is no plea entered, so further hearing day for this, then set.

- when appearing again, not guilty is a plea option. so the learned judge listens and accedes to a charge that will be heard by a jury. An estimated date for this case is then established.

- the jury decision, whatever way it goes, has the potential to then be appealed.

- to lodge an appeal, a hearing sits. The grounds to proceed for an appeal are based on evidence presented and whether there's legal doubt as to the way that facts were presented/the case ran. 

- so all of this will play out by [ dd/mm/yyyy ]

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1 hour ago, Lee270744 said:

I just googled jockeys caught with drugs the first on was Galloping trainer bringing 20 million dollars worth in Fiji and hundreds of jockeys been caught I'm with you Gruff shut all horse racing and dog racing down and jail them all for life no more Melbourne Cups or Everests Nz Cups. And don't even worry about their livelihoods, the bastards with their Ring-Ins Cobalt, Milk shaking at the races,  Thank god no Kiwi jockeys have ever been caught on drugs.

Why would you need to google that? You been living under a rock:rcfe-happy-2:  You ever worry about other people’s livelihoods?

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1 hour ago, Gruff said:

 

What Rock?  I wanted to be a Driver when James Stormont was wooing teenage girls in  Pukekohe. I was at Tony Perucichs when he had Stormy Morn witnessing the financial tension between him and his partner, but Tony wasn’t a betting man. I can’t blame these cheats for what they do sicko , all they are trying to do is feed their families, and when they’re not getting results what do you do?  Remove the temptation is the only answer you dumb sick bastard :rcf-laughing-2: just jokes :rcfe-money:

Come on now, I know you're kidding when you're saying James Stormont used to pull. All in fun here. No worries. Just sounded like the words of a thoroughbred fan.

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The police are bringing the charges so costs will be be on the taxpayers of NZ. The costs for the defendants are their own responsibilities and the longer they drag it out the more expensive for them. Drag it out as long as they want as far as I am concerned - this means the won't be on a racetrack for a longer time.

This is not an inquiry in the stewards room, these are criminal charges and the police must have concrete evidence to have pursued it thus far. This isn't about not trying in races - this is fraud and if proven will mean time inside. Aside from that their reputations are shattered now and will never be trusted again. And as a sideshow we have also got to see who is involved in supplying Class B drugs. 

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I note the 71 yr old business man is charged under Crimes Act for deception...pecuniary gain thru misuse of document or information.

I think I have this right but he seemed adamant he "done nothing wrong".I can imagine he will fight it to end  ,and its ONE charge.

But weird after 18 months of work they have ONE charge ,but are asking for information about any known others.

It doesn't sound too convincing but time will tell !

A couple of weeks ago the same Police squad were chasing up some basketballers who may have bet a smallish sum on a game they were playing in...against the rules....by the players reaction and the fact that one team winning easily played hard right to the final whistle and on the last play their facials turned from agony to ecstasy[not the pills] suggesting they had bet on the margin !

Weird the top police squad are caught up in these issues ,but are still seeking information !

Meanwhile in the Charitable trusts ,hospital boards , pokie trusts, and businesses around the country white collar frauds involving tens of thousands up to $million plus are part of the everyday landscape.

Will the police nail some Harness participants doing what has long been done ,playing silly buggers at some low-grade harness meeting...........whatever ,its already crippling for the Industry.

Of course the party pills side-show will provide extra momentum in the demise of the Industry......once the FACTS come out we will soon know but I guess the ones who rely on driving for their income will not want to be out of the game for long ! Especially if found not guilty.....they couldn't be could they ?

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5 hours ago, tasman man 11 said:

 

Meanwhile in the , pokie trusts  white collar frauds involving tens of thousands up to $million plus are part of the everyday landscape.

 

Very true--when I was a pokie trustee the threshold for a DIA investigation was $200K theft! This harness stuff certainly not desirable but in the greater scheme of things (including our miserable wagering pools) it is chicken-shit.

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13 hours ago, Eclipsed said:

- initial charge(s) laid and one option is no plea entered, so further hearing day for this, then set.

- when appearing again, not guilty is a plea option. so the learned judge listens and accedes to a charge that will be heard by a jury. An estimated date for this case is then established.

The process was streamlined about 5 years ago and goes roughly like this:

No plea is common at first appearance which will result in being remandsed over for 2 or 3 weeks at which time a plea would be expected. If no plea is entered (can't imagine why) a not guilty plea is entered on behalf.

From there the defence and the prosecution jointly file a “Case Management Memorandum” with the court, and the court registrar considers whether this memorandum raises issues that need to go before a judge before the trial.

This Memorandum will tell the court all the details that relate to the case and what the issues will be at the trial.

The Case Management Memorandum must be filed at least five working days before the case review date.

There are certain things the parties should discuss before filing the Memorandum, so that these can be addressed in the Memorandum if necessary.

Things like:

Whether the accused would like the judge to indicate what sentence you would receive if you pleaded guilty.

Whether the accused would consider pleading guilty to a lesser or different charge.

Whether the parties agree on any of the evidence that’s to be called, which might mean that a witness does not have to come to court or that the trial will be shorter.

Whether the accused objects to any of the evidence the prosecutor wants to call at the trial.

Whether the parties agree on how long the trial will take, and on a date for the trial.

 

If anyone is still awake let me know if you want me to continue

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15 hours ago, Lee270744 said:

I just googled jockeys caught with drugs the first on was Galloping trainer bringing 20 million dollars worth in Fiji and hundreds of jockeys been caught I'm with you Gruff shut all horse racing and dog racing down and jail them all for life no more Melbourne Cups or Everests Nz Cups. And don't even worry about their livelihoods, the bastards with their Ring-Ins Cobalt, Milk shaking at the races,  Thank god no Kiwi jockeys have ever been caught on drugs.

Lisa Cropp !!!

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10 hours ago, tasman man 11 said:

I note the 71 yr old business man is charged under Crimes Act for deception...pecuniary gain thru misuse of document or information.

I think I have this right but he seemed adamant he "done nothing wrong".I can imagine he will fight it to end  ,and its ONE charge.

But weird after 18 months of work they have ONE charge ,but are asking for information about any known others.

It doesn't sound too convincing but time will tell !

A couple of weeks ago the same Police squad were chasing up some basketballers who may have bet a smallish sum on a game they were playing in...against the rules....by the players reaction and the fact that one team winning easily played hard right to the final whistle and on the last play their facials turned from agony to ecstasy[not the pills] suggesting they had bet on the margin !

Weird the top police squad are caught up in these issues ,but are still seeking information !

Meanwhile in the Charitable trusts ,hospital boards , pokie trusts, and businesses around the country white collar frauds involving tens of thousands up to $million plus are part of the everyday landscape.

Will the police nail some Harness participants doing what has long been done ,playing silly buggers at some low-grade harness meeting...........whatever ,its already crippling for the Industry.

Of course the party pills side-show will provide extra momentum in the demise of the Industry......once the FACTS come out we will soon know but I guess the ones who rely on driving for their income will not want to be out of the game for long ! Especially if found not guilty.....they couldn't be could they ?

Match fixing is also classed as deception

1Title
  • This Act is the Crimes (Match-fixing) Amendment Act 2014.

2Commencement
  • This Act comes into force on 15 December 2014.

3Principal Act
4New section 240A inserted (Application of section 240 to match-fixing)
  • After section 240, insert:

    240AApplication of section 240 to match-fixing
    • (1)For the purposes of section 240, deception includes any act or omission that is done or omitted with intent to influence a betting outcome of an activity of a kind to which subsection (2) applies by manipulating—

      • (a)the overall result of the activity; or

      • (b)any event within the activity.

      (2)This subsection applies to activities of the following kinds:

      • (a)sporting competitions, games, matches, races, and rallies involving human participants (whether or not they also involve equipment, horses, vehicles, or vessels):

      • (b)dog races.

      (3)This section does not limit or affect the generality of section 240.

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10 hours ago, tasman man 11 said:

I note the 71 yr old business man is charged under Crimes Act for deception...pecuniary gain thru misuse of document or information.

I think I have this right but he seemed adamant he "done nothing wrong".I can imagine he will fight it to end  ,and its ONE charge.

But weird after 18 months of work they have ONE charge ,but are asking for information about any known others.

It doesn't sound too convincing but time will tell !

A couple of weeks ago the same Police squad were chasing up some basketballers who may have bet a smallish sum on a game they were playing in...against the rules....by the players reaction and the fact that one team winning easily played hard right to the final whistle and on the last play their facials turned from agony to ecstasy[not the pills] suggesting they had bet on the margin !

Weird the top police squad are caught up in these issues ,but are still seeking information !

Meanwhile in the Charitable trusts ,hospital boards , pokie trusts, and businesses around the country white collar frauds involving tens of thousands up to $million plus are part of the everyday landscape.

Will the police nail some Harness participants doing what has long been done ,playing silly buggers at some low-grade harness meeting...........whatever ,its already crippling for the Industry.

Of course the party pills side-show will provide extra momentum in the demise of the Industry......once the FACTS come out we will soon know but I guess the ones who rely on driving for their income will not want to be out of the game for long ! Especially if found not guilty.....they couldn't be could they ?

Not too sure it is that crippling at the moment

https://i.stuff.co.nz/southland-times/106936768/winton-betting-turnovers-up-in-wake-of-racefixing-allegations

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2 hours ago, GoHarness said:

Interesting the photo they show.....only a handful of people in it......I sense the whole article including the photo is taking the piss !

A bit early to get excited ,a low key meeting on a Saturday when not much else to bet on ...AB's paying $1.01.

Possibly Southland folk are a different breed ,in many ways not only rolling their R's.

Is the AKyle quoted related to the guy who a few years back was outed for moving his horse aside to let his stablemate thru to win !

If interest in Harness had an increase I'd guess it was from the 'widespread' advertising it had last week .....main item on Prime News...it may have awoke some old lapsed followers .

But looking ahead surely new customers and people with money will be sceptical and Government etc will be reluctant to support the industry !

Provincial Harness clubs have been struggling for years hence why Bluegrass Trust was established......folk jailed because of that.

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1 hour ago, tasman man 11 said:

Interesting the photo they show.....only a handful of people in it......I sense the whole article including the photo is taking the piss !

A bit early to get excited ,a low key meeting on a Saturday when not much else to bet on ...AB's paying $1.01.

Possibly Southland folk are a different breed ,in many ways not only rolling their R's.

Is the AKyle quoted related to the guy who a few years back was outed for moving his horse aside to let his stablemate thru to win !

If interest in Harness had an increase I'd guess it was from the 'widespread' advertising it had last week .....main item on Prime News...it may have awoke some old lapsed followers .

But looking ahead surely new customers and people with money will be sceptical and Government etc will be reluctant to support the industry !

Provincial Harness clubs have been struggling for years hence why Bluegrass Trust was established......folk jailed because of that.

Southerners  have little else to do in the weekend  and red hots have always had a strong  following  in the deep south.

As for the govt being reluctant to support  racing after this debacle don't give it a second thought. They  currently support all sorts of losers and non  performers.

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15 hours ago, tasman man 11 said:

I note the 71 yr old business man is charged under Crimes Act for deception...pecuniary gain thru misuse of document or information.

I think I have this right but he seemed adamant he "done nothing wrong".I can imagine he will fight it to end  ,and its ONE charge.

But weird after 18 months of work they have ONE charge ,but are asking for information about any known others.

It doesn't sound too convincing but time will tell !

A couple of weeks ago the same Police squad were chasing up some basketballers who may have bet a smallish sum on a game they were playing in...against the rules....by the players reaction and the fact that one team winning easily played hard right to the final whistle and on the last play their facials turned from agony to ecstasy[not the pills] suggesting they had bet on the margin !

Weird the top police squad are caught up in these issues ,but are still seeking information !

Meanwhile in the Charitable trusts ,hospital boards , pokie trusts, and businesses around the country white collar frauds involving tens of thousands up to $million plus are part of the everyday landscape.

Will the police nail some Harness participants doing what has long been done ,playing silly buggers at some low-grade harness meeting...........whatever ,its already crippling for the Industry.

Of course the party pills side-show will provide extra momentum in the demise of the Industry......once the FACTS come out we will soon know but I guess the ones who rely on driving for their income will not want to be out of the game for long ! Especially if found not guilty.....they couldn't be could they ?

Clearly the police investigation has upset the supporters of some of the high profile players. So often these supporters seem to live in a bubble,immune or deaf to the standards the great majority expect and want.

At one point you refer to behavior " that has long been done ,playing silly buggers at some low grade harness meeting' yet  you infer the police investigation is a bad thing.   

Going on your previous  posts on certain subjects, i'm guessing this investigation has come too close to home to those you support.. Whatever the final outcome is,i hope everyone reading racecafe notes the attitudes of many of those who participate in this sport,it really is an eye opener.

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21 hours ago, Lee270744 said:

I just googled jockeys caught with drugs the first on was Galloping trainer bringing 20 million dollars worth in Fiji and hundreds of jockeys been caught I'm with you Gruff shut all horse racing and dog racing down and jail them all for life no more Melbourne Cups or Everests Nz Cups. And don't even worry about their livelihoods, the bastards with their Ring-Ins Cobalt, Milk shaking at the races,  Thank god no Kiwi jockeys have ever been caught on drugs.

Leanne isherwood

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1979 NZ Cup. Cecil Devine driving Lord Module begins slowly and is tailed off. After about 800 metres he circles  the field. Cecil's son in law who  is driving  Sunseeker which is one out and one back, takes a very firm hold on his horse to let Lord Module in to assume the one out and one back. Problem is he carves up the field with a number of horses breaking and having their chances ruined.

Lord Module pulls out on the turn and wins the race. There are many upset punters in the crowd and then the hooter goes to signal an inquiry. A few minutes later the inquiry is dismissed because the video recording system taping the race was found not to be working.

It was very clear to all what happened they did not need any recording, it was team tactics but a blind eye was turned. That was the day I gave up the standard breds.

 

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Please correct me if I have this wrong but wasn't there something strange that happened previous to the Cup with Lord Module and Sunseeker   again  driven by his son and law .  Might be memory playing tricks but it was the night Sunseeker  needed a win to qualify for the Cup . Fog was as thick as pea soup and couldn't see a foot in front of you. Lord Module entered the murk in front and even commentator had to wait until horses emerged.   Suddenly Sunseeker emerges from the fog first and gets the win he needs. 

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30 minutes ago, Mr Spyro said:

Please correct me if I have this wrong but wasn't there something strange that happened previous to the Cup with Lord Module and Sunseeker   again  driven by his son and law .  Might be memory playing tricks but it was the night Sunseeker  needed a win to qualify for the Cup . Fog was as thick as pea soup and couldn't see a foot in front of you. Lord Module entered the murk in front and even commentator had to wait until horses emerged.   Suddenly Sunseeker emerges from the fog first and gets the win he needs. 

I think sunseeker won the kaikoura cup the year lord module  won the cup 

And i dont think he won a race for a very long time before hand

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Are we not getting a bit sidetracked here. These persons charged (or a number of them) are appearing in Christchurch court tomorrow. We know who a number of them are and to find out those not as yet named best place to be is court house Tuesday. The police do not arrest enmass as they have done without an air tight case. One maybe but the number they have I doubt it. Word is that media personnel are also being interviewed and investigated.  Some of those already named have had previous run ins with RIU and been found guilty and fined / disqualified etc. This time they need to be completely banned from the industry. It is hard enough to win a race but when you come up against cheating ....... it is harded to win. Rid the industry of them once and for all. Do the crime then do the time!!!!!

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