Mattski

Messara Racing Review Full Report and 17 Key points

417 posts in this topic

5 hours ago, poundforpound said:

They’ve managed their affairs well ( real estate ) for a long time 

Curiously, it's the clubs that have managed their affairs well that would be at the greatest risk from this being effected, Ellerslie in particular. I'm assuming that some consultation occurred with the larger clubs like Ellerslie, Te Rapa etc. for this to be in the report since they carry the bulk of the voting power at NZTR level? It would be interesting to know if those clubs actually support this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, poundforpound said:

... and the likes of MIA / PAM Jackson will now control ALL the industries assets.!!!

If this report's recommendations are effected, or largely so, we may have to reconsider the MIA / PAM label (I note here that I have not been a big fan either). However, this report's recommendations align quite closely with Jackson's preferred direction announced following the Deloitte report last year and the NZTR intent to discuss with the minister that direction which was in disagreement with NZRB strategy and still is, so, will give some traction to that.

At that time Jackson's Address to the AGM was reported as follows:

In his address to the NZTR Annual General Meeting on Thursday, Board chairman Dr Alan Jackson outlined the major racing issues which needed to be addressed over the next three years. NZTR will ask that the Government: 

  •  Finalise and enact the Racefields legislation in a manner which ensures NZTR can charge commercially competitive fees, to encourage overseas operators to offer betting on New Zealand racing. 
  • Support NZTR to modernise key racetrack infrastructure, to deliver a sustainable programme for thoroughbred racing.  
  • Consider reinvesting totalisator and gaming duty into transformational projects such as infrastructure and racing showcases.  
  • Ensure that the operations and costs of the NZ Racing Board (NZRB), and its business model, are at scale and internationally competitive in a global wagering world.  
  • Provide financial and regulatory support for a key racing showcase between November and February that creates tourism through a racing carnival that will focus on increasing participation in wagering and customer activity from Australia and Asia.  
  • Review and update the structure of the Racing Act, to clarify the accountability, roles and responsibilities and performance expectations between the New Zealand Racing Board and the codes.

 

It seems to me that the recommendations in the Messara report are a pretty solid advance on that and indeed go further, no?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Leggy said:

Curiously, it's the clubs that have managed their affairs well that would be at the greatest risk from this being effected, Ellerslie in particular. I'm assuming that some consultation occurred with the larger clubs like Ellerslie, Te Rapa etc. for this to be in the report since they carry the bulk of the voting power at NZTR level? It would be interesting to know if those clubs actually support this.

Ironically many of the clubs that are doing well and have assets in land as well as in the bank has become the noose over their necks. This whole plan is flawed as one of the main keys to the success of this plan is the confiscation all all the assets of these proud community Racing clubs. Sounds like we are back in the 1800’s and the land wars.Im hoping all those intended for slaughter band together and shut the concept down . They have no right to change the law to pillage honest hardworking clubs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Leggy, Ellerslie is well aware of their vulnerability but they seem ( incredibly ) to believe this is the way forward.

I’m only quoting two of the committee though but there seems to be a consensus ( nice horse that ).

As for MIA / PAM and NZTR wish list aligning itself with Messarra’s report...yep.....hence my ongoing references to JM gathering tired ideas from old pale stale males who’ve dragged us to our knees already.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't really follow the industry a lot, just a casual observer but there are a few questions/points I had with the whole thing....

Why is an Australian having such a say in this? Is it that hard to find a Kiwi with no vested interests?

Why cull Gore, but keep Waikouaiti? Gore is dual code and the track, from what I'm told, has pretty good drainage. Not to mention it is a lot handier for trainers further north. I was told Messara didn't even spend 5 minutes at Gore and didn't even look at the track.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, poundforpound said:

Leggy, Ellerslie is well aware of their vulnerability but they seem ( incredibly ) to believe this is the way forward.

I’m only quoting two of the committee though but there seems to be a consensus ( nice horse that ).

Maybe because they also have the voting power to ensure control over how and where the heist is effected?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, puha said:

Ironically many of the clubs that are doing well and have assets in land as well as in the bank has become the noose over their necks. This whole plan is flawed as one of the main keys to the success of this plan is the confiscation all all the assets of these proud community Racing clubs. Sounds like we are back in the 1800’s and the land wars.Im hoping all those intended for slaughter band together and shut the concept down . They have no right to change the law to pillage honest hardworking clubs.

Yep , it'll also send many of the horsemen and horsewomen and the real base of the game out of the industry the impact of that will be felt over the coming years, I know of several at our track who will be lost from the game forever. It's terribly disappointing to hear the lack of empathy for these people from all of the trainers that have been interviewed on trackside etc that aren't really impacted, too naive to realise this could happen to them and the impact it will have of them in the future.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, brenrox said:

I don't really follow the industry a lot, just a casual observer but there are a few questions/points I had with the whole thing....

Why is an Australian having such a say in this? Is it that hard to find a Kiwi with no vested interests?

Why cull Gore, but keep Waikouaiti? Gore is dual code and the track, from what I'm told, has pretty good drainage. Not to mention it is a lot handier for trainers further north. I was told Messara didn't even spend 5 minutes at Gore and didn't even look at the track.

Basically it's the easiest way of getting change through have someone do it who doesn't have to put up with the backlash and the end result of it all and can cop the blame for what the leaders of the industry didn't have the guts or expertise to see through in the first place.

There is no logic to the track closures , apart from perhaps is the track Freehold? , but I think both of those venues are Freehold you mention is there a large trainer there perhaps? Does the facility have flash stands cause horses race really well where there are flash stands never mind the track. Never mind the stands can come and go but as we have seen over the past years if your track is poked is probably always going to be that way.

You'd be right about the 5 mins , that appeared to be the case at most of the venues visited.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, puha said:

Yep they seem only to be interviewing the ones to gain. Let’s here the toothless trainers association stand up for their members ,.Yeah right

Absolutely. I think we all agree, there needs to be a complete overhaul. BUT, when I see articles quoting  Murray Baker, David Ellis, Tony Pike and especially Alan Jackson, I get very, very angry.  They are luckier than most in the industry as they have influence...and yet they couldn’t speak up or make a stand. As I said to Arrowfield on Friday, they’re all waiting for someone else to speak up and devise a plan.  Oh well, why would they want to speak up?  Life’s been good to these people now speaking up...if we need to pay a bill, just sell another horse.....

Alan Jackson...? Now says NZTR supports the reform?  P,ease correct me if I’m wrong but has he not been in a position where he could have provoked change? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Had a mate up from the South Island for the Tarzino, over a few beers he agreed, things need to change...and when looking at the cull list, he also mentioned duel code race-courses that could be saved to stop long travel times...  and the obvious ones for the chop (eg.Waipukarau) where there are too many courses (as sad as it may be) they will need to be ruthless and rustle a few feathers i suppose e.g Ellerslie V Avondale. 

Expect they are (or should be) basing changes on location, population and local trainers operating there, / dual-tri code viability, and finally financial return possibility to racing.

 

BUT WHEN THE JOB IS SEEN TO HAVE BEEN ACHIEVED AND THE POOR RURAL RACE-GOER ROBBED OF THEIR FIX, AND STAKES DOUBLED  SHORT TERM, FROM THE PROCEEDS OF SALES, AND WINSTON RETIRES A HAPPY MAN...WHATS THE LONG TERM PLAN MR ACCOUNTANT?...(NO SILVERWARE LEFT IN THE CUPBOARD.)

GET SOME BUMS ON SEATS AT THE RACES AND MAKE IT A FUN DAY OUT...YESTERDAY WAS A GOOD DAY...WELL DONE HASTINGS.

21 hours ago, dock leaf said:

The economics of closing at least some of New Zealand's 48 thoroughbred tracks is indisputable, the major problem being nobody wants it to be their club.

Although those behind the jewel in the crown of racetrack closure, Avondale, won't officially comment on the proposed sale of their track with the money to go into industry coffers, they have raged against the dying of the light for decades so don't look likely to sell up and give up.

Others such as Rotorua and Timaru, who between them have 18 meetings this season, are simply against closure and believe their local communities will be too.

"We have a meeting to discuss the report, and obviously our recommended closure, next week," said Rotorua chairman Andrew Bryant.

"But I am absolutely certain we will make our case to stay open. We are disappointed because we were never consulted about any of this.

"And even if the about 50 per cent of the track we own outright was ever closed and sold, I am sure the local community would want that money staying in Rotorua, not going to meetings in Tauranga.

Timaru president Noel Walker says their track is the best racing surface in the South Island and the industry wouldn't be getting any of the club's money.

Although the track closures were a key recommendation of the Messara report, NZTR boss Bernard Saundry says the 20 tracks suggested are not all certain to close. "Obviously we can't survive with 48 tracks, we can't afford to run them all and I think everybody in the industry agrees on that," says Saundry.

"But the minister was very open about the fact there would be room for consultation and we will listen to what clubs have to say, of course we will.

"Some clubs may want to sell and then restructure and we will listen to their ideas."

While Messara's list is a starting point and the majority of the tracks mooted for closure will almost certainly do so, few people at even the highest levels of New Zealand racing have yet got their heads around how the acquisition of any funds from those sales will go.

 

  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Talking to some well connected Aussies about this and this was one response...

"Daylight robbery," highway robbery or pick your pocket. A typical method used by the controlling body to gain complete power over factions within the body is to hire an independent consultant who's results ratify what the controlling body want, {"While our board has yet to consider the report in detail, the major recommendations are in line with NZTR's views and it is reassuring to have those policies verified by an independent and expert voice",} then present the findings to the powers that be, Government, as gospel to amend the law, thus removing any disapproving voices or opposition to attain their target. 
At first my take was for a few individual country bush clubs to close & revert to community use,"sorry has to happen," however page 66 of the Messara report indicates this could possibly be a surreptitious grab for valuable land & assets owned by the individual Race Clubs. 
Once the recommendations have been legitimised & rubber stamped by the Minister, NZTR will then do as they please, when they want with the acquired land & assets, more than likely converting them into cash on the promise of using some of the cash for raising stake money of races. I would then guess money would be spent on infrastructure at the principal clubs. - Centralised power can breed contempt for those on the periphery that have little, with them withering on the vine while the more powerful clubs continue to suckle on the teat of milk & honey. - 
Without knowing what the other recommendations are, it seems to me NZTR want things to happen quickly at the expense of the less fortunate when they should be taking baby steps instead of long strides. By all means alter the system but it would be self-destructive & sad to destroy what has been built up over a 100 years or more by selling off land & assets to the tune of what is 100's of millions of dollars to get the solutions: borrow against those assets from the banks or Government, but if NZTR needs that sort of money to survive then you're really in the crapper with no choice but to sell off."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IF (and not happened, yet) N.Z.R.B. assumes ownership of courses, why would it not fund all-weather tracks from proceeds rather than the government? If the general public resents government investment in racing, not likely to be a popular move if the board gets its way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Leggy, I hope you are proved correct with this   "It would be a heist alright if they can pull it off. I doubt it though and it will certainly take years if it happens and the clubs will then just walk away and de-register so they are not bound by the Act."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Phar Lap Fan said:

IF (and not happened, yet) N.Z.R.B. assumes ownership of courses, why would it not fund all-weather tracks from proceeds rather than the government? If the general public resents government investment in racing, not likely to be a popular move if the board gets its way.

NZTR assume ownership I think not NZRB who also may not be around to assume ownership of anything in the future.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Phar Lap Fan said:

Huey - made a point but will you make a difference focusing on trivialities? Serving the same product will not revive racing in N.Z.

No absolutely not, but closing down courses in the manner in which they are proposing to isn't a great way of doing things either.

#doublestakesyeahright

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We've all had a few days to reflect on this and it just looks more and more remarkable to me. Blind leading the blind.

They call John Key "the smiling assassin"? Hello, it's Winston.

If anyone else had called in an Aussie who gives recommendations to flog off half our venues in the greatest land grab since the treaty of Waitangi while suggesting giving the keys to the till to the Aussie TABCorp - this report would go down like a ton of bricks.

Would we take the ride if it was someone from the green party standing up with this exact same message?

For example, Gareth Hughes says we are going to cut the number of venues in half, and give up the huge amount of intellectual capital that's gone into the Kiwi IT and infrastructure side of things, the jobs there, and let the show be run from Aussie.  

Same message, different messenger.

It could be a masterstroke from Labour greens. Get Mr Trusted to sell them the worst deal ever and they'll buy it. 

For the short term Winston just needs next election's votes.
Will he even run in the next election?

Perhaps WP doesn't even know he's the fall guy. There could be some other political trade off?? NZfirst done very well so far.

It peeves me no end the NZRB corporate bureaucracy and there is stupid money lost there but as much as you will no doubt disagree, I think John Allen did put losses on the forecast before they happened, with a plan to lift the financial nose pretty much about right now. Instead of being patient a bit longer and sticking to the plan, and then deciding once we really know if it's worked as planned, we are jumping the gun just before payday and a nasty little bait-and-switch is going on, and we're all going to get stiffed instead, and racing will end up with no choice next time around. 

Too much wagered on a dark horse with this report he needs to hear from the provinces where our tracks and clubs actually are that he's talking about closing down, because that's where the heart of racing is, not Melboune or Petone

No point writing a letter here send it to Winston and National now not later

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I HAVE A MASSIVE IDEA AROUND THESE ONCE A YEAR CLUBS WHO RACE AROUND THE XMAS/NY PERIOD WHO ARE GETTING CLOSED FOR ALSORTS OF REASONS WITH THIS REPORT THAT COME OUT THURSDAY.

WHO HAVE ALL READY MADE NOISE THAT THEY DON'T WON'T CLOSED AND SOME OF THESE CLUBS HAVE VERY LONG AND PROUD HISTORY SO I CAN UNDERSTAND THERE POINT OF THINGS  BUT NEW ZEALAND NEEDS TO DO WHAT IS BEST FOR RACING GOING FOWARD AND HAVING 48 TRACKS IS SIMPLY NOT ONE OF THEM.

TO GO AND COPY SOMTHING ALONG THE LINES OF THE PICNIC RACING IN AUSTRALIA. IT MIGHT NOT BE WHAT THE CLUBS WON'T BUT AT LEAST THEY STILL GET TO KEEP THERE RACING CLUBS GOING AND I AM SURE TRAINERS WILL SUPPORT THIS IDEA BECAUSE NOT EVERY HORSE CAN WIN A BIG RACE AND MIGHT EVAN KEEP SOME HORSES RACING LONGER WHO NOS WHAT'S AROUND THE CORNER ALL I NO IS THAT SOMTHING NEEDS TO COME OF THE REPORT.

Edited by Allovertheform
There was an issue with the spelling

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What are the chances of this legislation getting though. Land confiscation act basically . Surely this is  going  to spark huge parliamentary debate considering precedents . If say NZ footy codes get strapped for cash can they take the local kids field and turn it into luxury flats when they want with no compo by pushing though a similar act.I suppose it's how much individual MPs tow partly line and vote as instructed. Surely National MPs would be against it , greens are against government walking over people's rights are they not ? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

According to Google News NZ First held a meeting at the Tauranga club on Wednesday for those who are racing donors and obviously party donors..Chitty,Ellis,Schick,Bax,Lindsay and Taylor were all present at the $600 dollars a head dinner.

From that list you can assume they are all for it.

I stayed home and had my $6 dollar meal deal but kept a lot better company.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, crustyngrizzly said:

According to Google News NZ First held a meeting at the Tauranga club on Wednesday for those who are racing donors and obviously party donors..Chitty,Ellis,Schick,Bax,Lindsay and Taylor were all present at the $600 dollars a head dinner.

From that list you can assume they are all for it.

I stayed home and had my $6 dollar meal deal but kept a lot better company.

 

 

Three guesses what that lot have in common...?:rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don’t worry about track closures, ALL tracks and ALL net assets are potentially being siezed .... you’re all in the same boat, you’re all about to raped .... enjoy it you dummies, and don’t come back here bleating in ten years time when the money’s wasted and the Australians completely ignore / ruin the domestic NZ racing industry 

I’ve heard all this “saviour of racing” shit before, remember 2003 when Chittick, Acklin and Geoffrey Palmer saved racing with the new NZRB and Racing Act ?

They completely fucked it then and if this goes ahead as described they’ll completely fuck it again.

Enjoy it ya mugs 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now