We don't help[ ourselves

[shaneMcAlister 1,425]

Lat night (radio station 1080) was dedicating a couple of hours to speak about horse racing, they just segway into it.  The radio presenters were very enthusiastic about horse racing.  Got Tony Veitch on the phone to  discuss his horse with Te Akau and he did so in his usual exciting way.  The radio presenters said they wanted to hear good stories about why people love the game and the enjoyment they get from it etc.

Third call in Bill (he said he belongs to some association) rings up and starts a 10 minute moan about how the game does not care about the little punter, how 50 years ago there were crowds of 50,000.....on and on about everything negative about the game.  Talked politics etc.  The radio presenters could not get rid of him quickly enough.  It was embarrassing. 

We have to understand the good old days were that Bill, because you were not old and you felt good!!!

Anyone listening would be thinking I can do without a day at the races if people like Bill are there moaning all day.

[MrBigStuff 394]

Same people on here sound like Bill who do not want to move on from the good old days - that we can keep going on the same path we always have with the same old rubbish venues. Sound familiar?

[Trump 2,741]

As Mr T himself would have said , " THERE HAS TO BE PAAAAAIN!"

[TOM(the other Molloy) 1,774]

On 4/3/2017 at 0:04 PM, MrBigStuff said:

Same people on here sound like Bill who do not want to move on from the good old days - that we can keep going on the same path we always have with the same old rubbish venues. Sound familiar?

Rubbish venues?  Ellerslie Riccarton Trentham and Te Rapa you mean?

The ones that have always had their hands out for industry funds to prop up their little empires(and then inevitably waste the huge subsidies they have traditionally received)?  The ones that produce consistently shit surfaces for racing?  The ones that attract frankly dismal attendances at their meetings(given the population bases they operate from)?  the ones that spend enormous amounts of industry money on administration staff and expenses for no measurable benefit to the industry?

Are those the rubbish venues you are talking about?

  

 

[Dopey 214]

2 hours ago, TOM(the other Molloy) said:

Rubbish venues?  Ellerslie Riccarton Trentham and Te Rapa you mean?

The ones that have always had their hands out for industry funds to prop up their little empires(and then inevitably waste the huge subsidies they have traditionally received)?  The ones that produce consistently shit surfaces for racing?  The ones that attract frankly dismal attendances at their meetings(given the population bases they operate from)?  the ones that spend enormous amounts of industry money on administration staff and expenses for no measurable benefit to the industry?

Are those the rubbish venues you are talking about?

  

 

Ooo Tom, so provocative. You are so brave - I love that about you.

[TOM(the other Molloy) 1,774]

16 hours ago, Dopey said:

Ooo Tom, so provocative. You are so brave - I love that about you.

Don't know whether you are taking the p there but I have no particular axe to grind with the big clubs.  The prosperity of the Ellerslie and Riccarton's is vital to the future of NZ racing and to presenting a quality product to the world.

What I get sick or hearing is halfwits bleating about closing tracks.  First those tracks cost virtually nil to run(using the dedication of the local committee), second NZ racing needs all the tracks it can get given the disasters that so many of the current surfaces represent and third the only real enthusiasm - save for half a dozen days per year - for raceday attendance is on those 'country' courses.

Shutting them down will not transfer that local committee dedication to the retained venues nor will it incline those local people to travel two or three hours to attend a metropolitan venue (especially when you never know if the meeting will even go ahead).

From a pure business decision making perspective yes you would rationalise but the whole issue here is that the powers that be(and the halfwits advocating for track closure) fail to realise racing - for the vast majority of its participants - is not a business.  It is a sport (and to be fair a fairly fragile one in terms of enthusiasm)

Besides which from a pure business point of view the industry would be vastly better served by selling up the expensive real estate those city tracks represent and investing in new venues further out (as has been mooted here a few weeks back).

 

 

[Trump 2,741]

Tom, on one hand you are against any track closures, whilst on the other hand, you say if we do close tracks, then "the Industry would be better served by selling up the expensive real estate those city tracks represent....". So really, you would be in favour of such a proposition? I'm not sure that anyone has done a proper study on how the landscape would look if you took an imaginary "clean no racetrack" situation and asked the question, "How many first class tracks can we have to comfortably sustain and thrive the Industry and where should they be placed?".  What would be the considerations? ( Horse population? Easy access for people, ie, public transport?).  I'd be interested in your comments. 

[We're Doomed 4,855]

2 hours ago, TOM(the other Molloy) said:

Don't know whether you are taking the p there but I have no particular axe to grind with the big clubs.  The prosperity of the Ellerslie and Riccarton's is vital to the future of NZ racing and to presenting a quality product to the world.

What I get sick or hearing is halfwits bleating about closing tracks.  First those tracks cost virtually nil to run(using the dedication of the local committee), second NZ racing needs all the tracks it can get given the disasters that so many of the current surfaces represent and third the only real enthusiasm - save for half a dozen days per year - for raceday attendance is on those 'country' courses.

Shutting them down will not transfer that local committee dedication to the retained venues nor will it incline those local people to travel two or three hours to attend a metropolitan venue (especially when you never know if the meeting will even go ahead).

From a pure business decision making perspective yes you would rationalise but the whole issue here is that the powers that be(and the halfwits advocating for track closure) fail to realise racing - for the vast majority of its participants - is not a business.  It is a sport (and to be fair a fairly fragile one in terms of enthusiasm)

Besides which from a pure business point of view the industry would be vastly better served by selling up the expensive real estate those city tracks represent and investing in new venues further out (as has been mooted here a few weeks back).

 

 

I think this statement above should be required reading for all of those who think the closing of smaller tracks would someone benefit the NZ Racing Industry

[We're Doomed 4,855]

1 hour ago, Trump said:

Tom, on one hand you are against any track closures, whilst on the other hand, you say if we do close tracks, then "the Industry would be better served by selling up the expensive real estate those city tracks represent....". So really, you would be in favour of such a proposition? I'm not sure that anyone has done a proper study on how the landscape would look if you took an imaginary "clean no racetrack" situation and asked the question, "How many first class tracks can we have to comfortably sustain and thrive the Industry and where should they be placed?".  What would be the considerations? ( Horse population? Easy access for people, ie, public transport?).  I'd be interested in your comments. 

Trump, I don't think any number of tracks you care to think of would "sustain and thrive the industry". It is a twilight industry, and we have to make the best of what we have. It goes against all logic, but we have to accept that the large number of tracks we have is actually a positive. Sadly, racing is much stronger supported in the provinces as those tracks aren't competing with 20/20 cricket, super rugby, the warriors, casinos, rock concerts etc etc.

As Tom and others keep saying, the smaller tracks aren't the problem, the major metropolitan tracks are the worst performers. Closing Te Aroha wouldn't help any other track. No benefit has come from closing down Nelson, Westport, Opaki etc etc. Tracks have closed down over the years generally  because of the lack of local interest. They haven't been closed down because that would somehow help other tracks nearby.

[Diver Dan 187]

A complete no brainer - bring in virtual racing FFS.

The TAB should have implemented this years ago, compete on a global scale.

A portion back to racing - no cost to the industry.

It's not the answer but an extra revenue stream.

[TOM(the other Molloy) 1,774]

6 hours ago, Trump said:

Tom, on one hand you are against any track closures, whilst on the other hand, you say if we do close tracks, then "the Industry would be better served by selling up the expensive real estate those city tracks represent....". So really, you would be in favour of such a proposition? I'm not sure that anyone has done a proper study on how the landscape would look if you took an imaginary "clean no racetrack" situation and asked the question, "How many first class tracks can we have to comfortably sustain and thrive the Industry and where should they be placed?".  What would be the considerations? ( Horse population? Easy access for people, ie, public transport?).  I'd be interested in your comments. 

No I'm not contradicting myself Trump

I am most definitely NOT in favour of track closures but merely said if you applied a strictly business case to NZ racing I can see where they are coming from but equally on a strictly business case you would close and sell off all those valuable assets and indeed probably not have any racing in NZ at all (if you went to the nth degree)

I am most certainly in favour of selling off the valuable assets or at least using them to generate a much steadier income stream (a la Alexandra Park and Ellerslie - leasing all that ground).  But for the same reasons I say Reefton's assets belong to Reefton's people the valuable Ellerslie or Riccarton or Te Rapa asset belongs to the ARC CJC or WRC as the case may be so any income they get should be poured into their own enterprises. 

The massive potential income streams available would allow them to really develop outstanding facilities with all weather tracks, good transport options, nighttime racing and top class stands etc and provide stakes high enough to really bring racing back to the sporting forefront in NZ(though no doubt if it regained its mojo the do-gooders and fun police would be out to tear it down like they do with anyone who is getting ahead).

But as it stands it ain't happening and in any case someone who knows how the Auckland City Council works told me that (for instance) if you went to develop the Ellerslie asset the neighbours would scream blue murder about destroying the greenbelt.  Makes you wonder  who owns the bloody thing but that is the world we live in I suppose.  The same goes for the Riccarton asset I guess having to get an act of parliament to allow then to sort out their own property(albeit held on perpetual lease of course).  The CJC could find themselves a superb piece of ground out Darfield way right beside the railway line and build a great facility.  Though no doubt the old grandstand's historical significance would have the do gooders screaming about retaining that as well. 

Oh for an ideal world.......

 

[We're Doomed 4,855]

I must say, despite Riccarton being an appalling bad performer I think the Riccarton track is an incredible asset to SI racing and I would hate to see it go. It would be nice if they could fix the racing surface.