NZ Racing & Queensland Racing

[Trump 2,741]

Are they in a similar situation? Prizemoney in Qld is much higher than NZ but it is way behind NSW and Vic. So it's interesting to read an article by Qld racing scribe, Nathan Exelby, in which he says the following. " Qld punters bet just 59% of what is bet in Victoria. That is reflected in returns to owners, with the Qld figure of $114.3m being 58.6% of what Victoria returned. Yet Qld runs 26% more race meetings than Victoria, incl 273 non-TAB meetings (compared to 42). The mathematics for a sustainable Qld Industry under that scenario do not add up." Does that ring any bells in NZ?

[MrBigStuff 398]

Yes, they race on the main tracks eg Eagle Farm, Doomben, Sunshine Coast, Gold Coast, Ipswich, Toowoomba and all the other goat tracks are non-tab meetings. 

A model we should follow. Keep those country tracks open (for all those stalwarts that do not want change) let them have non tab meetings, same crowd will still turn up be it a tab meeting or not at the goat tracks.

[Trump 2,741]

Not quite accurate Mr Bigstuff. Rockhampton and Townsville have new tracks also and have a strong racing precinct. But I see you get the point. NZ (like Qld) cannot survive under their respective current models. Too many tracks, too many Clubs etc to carve the pie amongst. 

[MrBigStuff 398]

Sorry, I forgot about those two venues. But they are considered as populated places up in North QLD. Rocky has a proper airport and also Townsville, cannot remember the last time I was able to catch a commercial flight to Gore or Thames?

[MrBigStuff 398]

35 minutes ago, Trump said:

Are they in a similar situation? Prizemoney in Qld is much higher than NZ but it is way behind NSW and Vic. So it's interesting to read an article by Qld racing scribe, Nathan Exelby, in which he says the following. " Qld punters bet just 59% of what is bet in Victoria. That is reflected in returns to owners, with the Qld figure of $114.3m being 58.6% of what Victoria returned. Yet Qld runs 26% more race meetings than Victoria, incl 273 non-TAB meetings (compared to 42). The mathematics for a sustainable Qld Industry under that scenario do not add up." Does that ring any bells in NZ?

I presume this is the article you refer to?

http://www.harnesslink.com/News/Racing-Queensland-denies-industry-in-crisis

[gary1 361]

10 minutes ago, MrBigStuff said:

Sorry, I forgot about those two venues. But they are considered as populated places up in North QLD. Rocky has a proper airport and also Townsville, cannot remember the last time I was able to catch a commercial flight to Gore or Thames?

what about beaudesert and gatton plus dalby

 

[MrBigStuff 398]

3 minutes ago, gary1 said:

what about beaudesert and gatton plus dalby

 

Goat tracks 

[MrBigStuff 398]

3 minutes ago, MrBigStuff said:

Goat tracks 

And yet what do they do

http://www.racingandsports.com.au/iphone/news.asp?NID=399575&story=More_country_TAB_meetings_for_Queensland

[puha 2,177]

1 hour ago, MrBigStuff said:

Yes, they race on the main tracks eg Eagle Farm, Doomben, Sunshine Coast, Gold Coast, Ipswich, Toowoomba and all the other goat tracks are non-tab meetings. 

A model we should follow. Keep those country tracks open (for all those stalwarts that do not want change) let them have non tab meetings, same crowd will still turn up be it a tab meeting or not at the goat tracks.

Your starting to sound like a broken record. What would you classify Avondale  since it's in a major city ?

[TOM(the other Molloy) 1,774]

28 minutes ago, puha said:

Your starting to sound like a broken record. What would you classify Avondale  since it's in a major city ?

He's not that sharp Puha. He would shut down all the decent surfaces and run all the meetings on the dunger tracks like Ellerslie, Trentham, Awapuni and Riccarton. Every one with major major problems once more that a couple of mil of rain arrives.

[Huey 2,037]

2 hours ago, MrBigStuff said:

Yes, they race on the main tracks eg Eagle Farm, Doomben, Sunshine Coast, Gold Coast, Ipswich, Toowoomba and all the other goat tracks are non-tab meetings. 

A model we should follow. Keep those country tracks open (for all those stalwarts that do not want change) let them have non tab meetings, same crowd will still turn up be it a tab meeting or not at the goat tracks.

Yeah shutdown all the tracks that generate superior income and put on a better show with less than many of the other venues you advocate for, yes I know you're being a Troll cause you have absolutely zero substance in anything you say but even trolls have to make the odd substantive point some time.

So what's your point?

[MrBigStuff 398]

1 hour ago, puha said:

Your starting to sound like a broken record. What would you classify Avondale  since it's in a major city ?

Have you been there recently? There are country tracks in like Victoria that have better facilities. Ok racing surface but the venue is tired. More people turn up for the pigeon racing/housie

[MrBigStuff 398]

6 minutes ago, Huey said:

Yeah shutdown all the tracks that generate superior income and put on a better show with less than many of the other venues you advocate for, yes I know you're being a Troll cause you have absolutely zero substance in anything you say but even trolls have to make the odd substantive point some time.

So what's your point?

Not trolling, something needs to happen. People who are that stuck in their ways and cannot see that this has to happen for the greater industry not just your own backyard politics kind of stuff

[Trump 2,741]

This was not meant to be a bashing thread or an Ellerslie v Avondale argument. My original comment was that there seems to be a lot of similarity between the racing scene in NZ and that of Qld. The prizemoney being thinly spread across so many venues and race days. On top of that, the Qld Racing Minister is a dead duck called "Grace Grace". About the same knowledge or interest in racing as the NZ Racing Minister. There has been a lot of money spent on new tracks but the big problem is the low prizemoney. What funds they distribute is spread thin due to the huge number of race meeting, whilst the betting is not growing sufficiently to allow increases in stakes. Sound familiar?

[rdytdy 5,343]

What I find interesting is with the state of wet weather that Sydney gets and with the last good track being on 4th February that they don't have an AW track.

The 11 February was an abandonment and since then slow and heavy tracks. I would have thought that they would have the finances to put one in.  

[skelly 53]

Was thinking about the excess of courses we have in NZ, so did a little experiment calculating population for meshblocks within 20km of the course. The theory being that less population means less viable.

Fairly easy to draw a line through a few at the bottom and just let them run as non-TAB meetings if they still want to exist.

Course	Population
Ellerslie	1107441
Avondale	924807
Riccarton	365235
Trentham	343935
Te Rapa	175671
Motukarara	137316
Pukekohe	133632
Tauranga	128922
Cambridge	127452
Hastings	124215
Wingatui	110499
Awapuni	99681
New Plymouth	70005
Arawa Park	61011
Te Awamutu	54870
Ascot Park	54510
Wanganui	42183
Timaru	38751
Gisborne	36795
Waterlea	34458
Otaki	32862
Foxton	29373
Taupo	26586
Ashburton	23361
Ruakaka	20220
Te Aroha	18774
Hawera	18690
Matamata	18315
Tauherenikau	16776
Oamaru	16566
Te Teko	15699
Stratford	15396
Kumara	15252
Thames	15012
Woodville	13254
Gore	12759
Omoto	12522
Waipukurau	11187
Dargaville	9225
Cromwell	7524
Winton	7392
Waimate	6216
Wairoa	5883
Hokitika	5700
Wyndham	5481
Waikouaiti	5061
Riverton	4113
Waverley	3813
Reefton	1656
Omakau	1536
Kurow	891

[rdytdy 5,343]

And have you looked at it on a turnover basis as some of those smaller clubs perform better than bigger population based clubs?

[skelly 53]

15 minutes ago, rdytdy said:

And have you looked at it on a turnover basis as some of those smaller clubs perform better than bigger population based clubs?

Which smaller clubs?

[Turny 1,224]

Trump - over here we just don't get it - many times I have advanced reducing tracks - It really is simple - a maximum of 10 - 6 north 4 south - make the game potentially profitable for investors - NZ is in noddy land thinking what we have can survive - I have given up - sadly even those involved don't see it and that is the real worry - there really is no hope here - they have invited the sword and NZRB are reacting - Allen and co have played them and will win

 

[MrBigStuff 398]

Love your work turny!!

people are just to dumb to look at the bigger picture, I am ready to throw my ownership interests away. Its not viable. Nobody listens and you are all just protecting your own patch. I want to race my horse on good tracks and be able to sit in comfortable facilities rather than birdshit covered open grandstands. 

Put proper surfaces in at the main tracks so we can race once a week, or twice if we had to.

I shake my head I really do

[barryb 2,064]

23 minutes ago, turny said:

Trump - over here we just don't get it - many times I have advanced reducing tracks - It really is simple - a maximum of 10 - 6 north 4 south - make the game potentially profitable for investors - NZ is in noddy land thinking what we have can survive - I have given up - sadly even those involved don't see it and that is the real worry - there really is no hope here - they have invited the sword and NZRB are reacting - Allen and co have played them and will win

 

You are the one in dream land turny if you think that South Island racing should keep 4 of the 10 tracks you propose, based purely on Population numbers Riccarton would be it and thats all.

Yet again this idea rears its head from people who have no idea about the economics behind what they think is the way forward. 

 

 

[barryb 2,064]

12 minutes ago, MrBigStuff said:

Love your work turny!!

people are just to dump do look at the bigger picture, I am ready to throw my ownership interests away. Its not viable. Nobody listens and you are all just protecting your own patch. I want to race my horse on good tracks and be able to sit in comfortable facilities rather than birdshit covered open grandstands. 

Put proper surfaces in at the main tracks so we can race once a week, or twice if we had to.

I shake my head I really do

Not sure its anything to do with protection their own patch Mr BS, its more about your failure to understand how racing currently operates and that it is not owned by one corporate identity. Selling off a few assets or closing down a few facilities would do little or nothing to advance racing at other centres & provide no capital for re-investment. Small centres would just give the bird salute and turn their back on racing full stop, pocket the money and run.

The concept for sorting racing's woes are not as simple as shutting a few doors, in fact it would hasten the demise as it currently stands.

[puha 2,177]

1 hour ago, skelly said:

Which smaller clubs?

Compare Waipuk and Avondale recently on turnover on course. Also Waipuk was up 100k off course this year compared to last. What's better having a population of close to 1 million and 200 people turn up or a population of 20 thousand and 800 people turn up? 

[TOM(the other Molloy) 1,774]

2 hours ago, skelly said:

Which smaller clubs?

Which smaller Clubs?????

Virtually every effing one has a superior turnover

Didn't they say on another recent thread that Riccarton turned over $15000 on course one recent day?  How does Mr Big Stuff and his cronies explain that?

19 days out of 20 nobody goes to these prestige tracks you lot are flogging as the be all and end all and every one of them has major issues with its surface.

In an ideal world yes but as it stands they are not up to taking on all that extra racing.

If this theory worked Ellerslie should be turning over approximately $56m oncourse on any given day to keep up with Reefton.  

Otherwise cut it loose I say! 

 

 

 

[Trump 2,741]

Please read my opening post. No mention of small v large clubs etc. It was about the similarity of the problem/s facing NZ and Qld racing. The remedy is debatable. It's amazing when you compare Vic with Qld. One is fucked and the other is moving forward. Why has Qld got less money for stakes yet has more race clubs, more race meetings and non-TAB meetings? NZ seems to be in a similar state to Qld. So what's the answer ? I think that NZ has to bite the bullet and undergo some radical surgery. It'll put a few noses out of joint but what's the alternative?