Street Cry - et al.

[HH88 23]

Street Cry’s’ linebreeding is particularly difficult to decipher with Machiavellians ancestry largely American and Helen Streets predominately European.

Mr. Prospector found success when his linebreeding to Domino was carried forward through an opposite strain in the mares he was mated with. (Raise a Native has seven balanced lines of Domino and Gold Digger carries a line of Correction – Dominos full sister)

 

One of Mr. Prospectors lines of Domino comes through a female strain of Ultimus who is himself inbred 2 x 2 to Domino.

This linebreeding carries forward in turn, with Afleet, Gulch, Miswaki, Machiavellian Seeking the Gold, Gone West, Rhythm, It’s in the Air, Conquistador Cielo, Ravinella, and Gold Beauty all carrying a male strain of Ultimus in their dams.

The dams of Fappiano and Tanks Prospect carry male strains of Correction to balance Mr. Prospectors female strain.

This tends to lend support to a couple of breeding principles:

(1) A stallion can be particularly strong to certain lines in his pedigree and responds to mares who carry the opposite strain.

(2) That ancestor may reside well back in the pedigree but can still be effective if present in sufficiently high numbers

(Domino was Champion American juvenile unbeaten in 9 starts at 2 with a record of 25 runs for 19 wins 2 seconds and 1 third)

As for Street Cry - the answer will lie deep in his pedigree, Nature hides her secrets well.

[Nasrullah 180]

Domino            Winnings: 25 Starts: 19 - 2 - 1, $193,550

Great Eclipse Stakes, Belmont Futurity, Great American Stakes, Great Trial Stakes, Hyde Park Stakes, Matron Stakes, Produce Stakes, Withers Stakes, Flying Stakes, Culver Stakes, Ocean Handicap, Third Special, Coney Island Handicap, Sheepshead Bay Stakes.

Nickname: THE BLACK WHIRLWIND.
Champion 2-year-old. (There was no 2yo filly champion that year.)
Unbeaten in nine starts at two, Domino set an earnings record that stood for 38 years.
In July 1897, Domino was turned out in his paddock in apparently good health. Found a short while later, unable to rise and almost completely paralyzed. Domino died a few hours later (from meningitis).
HOF 1955
 

(CLOSE)

[Nasrullah 180]

Correction       Winnings: 122 Starts: 38 - 35 - 22, $45,600

At 2:
1st: Clover S.
2nd: Great American S.
3rd: Dash S., Tremont S.

At At 4:
3rd: Culver H.

At 5:
2nd: Culver Cap

At 6:
1st: Toboggan Slide H.
2nd: Fall H.

The best sprint mare of her day. The Correction Handicap (G3) at Aqueduct is named in her honor.
Tail-female ancestor of family 23b that includes Affirmed, Baby Zip, and many more. Full sister to Domino.
 

[HH88 23]

The importance of Correction in this context is she provides a female strain of Himyar and Mannie Grey to balance Dominos male strains. 

[HH88 23]

And so to Street Cry - and the link between Machiavellian and Helen Street ?

Machiavellian has five female strains of Derby winner Minoru who is out of Mother Siegel by Friars Balsam.

He also has three female strains of Voter, also by Friars Balsam.

Thus eight balanced lines of Friars Balsam.

Helen Streets line of Hornbeam has as his third damsire Derby winner Grand Parade.

His second dam Grand Marnier is a full sister to Mother Siegel dam of Minoru.

So with Machiavellians five male strains of Mother Siegel and Helen Streets female strain of her full sister Grand Marnier we may have the linebreeding link.

If this analysis is valid, and the foregoing breeding principles sound, it should be possible to see this linebreeding carried forward (through an opposite strain) in Street Cry’s best progeny.

[HH88 23]

On to his best progeny - and the linebreeding link supporting the breeding principles illustrated in the earlier posts.

                       Bull Lea appears to be the key

 

The dams of:  

Zenyatta

Winx

Street Sense

Shocking

Whobegotyou

Per Incanto

Street Boss

All carry one or more lines of Bull Lea. (It matters not that the Bull Lea presence in these pedigrees is through a male or female strain because the linebreeding is to Voter) To summarize Street Cry has 13 balanced lines of Friars Balsam (through Minoru, Grand Marnier and Voter. His lines of Voter are all female. Bull Leas damsire Ballot is a son of Voter - thus the link balancing the four female strains in Street Cry.

Also of note, Ballots second dam Merry Dance is a full sister to Pretty Dance the third dam of Ultimus and a ¾ sister to Saraband.

[HH88 23]

Whilst Bull Lea is a significant factor in the above pedigrees, other balanced linebreeding present should be considered and may have continued influence when they breed on.

In addition to Bull Lea these other lines follow - and in all cases Street Cry has the opposite strain.

Zenyatta: Male strain of Foxlaw and female strain of Lady Juror

Winx: Female strain of Aloe (full sister to Foxlaw)

Street Sense: Male strain of John P Grier. (Second dam by Voter)

Whobegotyou: Male strain of Foxlaw.

Shocking: Fighting Fox. (Carries a female strain of Mavoureen dam of Voter)

Per Incanto: Female strain of Fair Trial and a male strain of Grand Parade.

Street Boss: Female strain of Lady Juror.

 

 

[HH88 23]

Apart from Bull Lea there is line breeding to Foxlaw, Aloe, and Lady Juror (all by Son-in-Law) in Street Cry’s progeny as exampled in the previous post. To further validate the breeding principles described earlier we should see these lines carried forward to the succeeding generation through an opposite strain - and yes they are.

Per Incanto

Dal Cielo                      2 x M  Foxlaw, 1x F Aloe.

Rocanto                       1 x M Foxlaw, 1x F Aloe.

Saracino                      2 x M Foxlaw, 3 x F Aloe, 1 x F Lady juror.

Magnum                     1 x M Foxlaw, 1 x F Aloe.

Tennessee                   3 x F Aloe.

(Per Incanto has a female strain of Foxlaw)

Shocking

Fanatic                         1 x M Bull Lea, 2 x F Aloe, 1 x F Lady Juror.

Camino Rocoso           1 x M Foxlaw, 1 x M Grand Parade.

Antonio Giuseppe       1 x M Foxlaw, 1 x F Aloe, 2 x F Lady Juror.

Shocking Luck             1 M Bull Lea, 1 x M Grand Parade, 1 x F Lady Juror.

Chocante                     1 x M Bull Lea, 3 x F Aloe, 1 M Grand Parade.

(Shocking has female strains of Bull Lea, Foxlaw, and Grand Parade)

 To conclude, the purpose of these posts has been to demonstrate with some clarity there are principles (rather than theories) at work, which may be influencing performance, and may be of assistance to those with an interest in pedigrees who are endeavoring to breed a good horse. 

[TBL 32]

1 hour ago, HH88 said:

 

Apart from Bull Lea there is line breeding to Foxlaw, Aloe, and Lady Juror (all by Son-in-Law) in Street Cry’s progeny as exampled in the previous post. To further validate the breeding principles described earlier we should see these lines carried forward to the succeeding generation through an opposite strain - and yes they are.

 

 

Per Incanto

 

 

Dal Cielo                      2 x M  Foxlaw, 1x F Aloe.

 

Rocanto                       1 x M Foxlaw, 1x F Aloe.

 

Saracino                      2 x M Foxlaw, 3 x F Aloe, 1 x F Lady juror.

 

Magnum                     1 x M Foxlaw, 1 x F Aloe.

 

Tennessee                   3 x F Aloe.

 

(Per Incanto has a female strain of Foxlaw)

 

Shocking

 

Fanatic                         1 x M Bull Lea, 2 x F Aloe, 1 x F Lady Juror.

 

Camino Rocoso           1 x M Foxlaw, 1 x M Grand Parade.

 

Antonio Giuseppe       1 x M Foxlaw, 1 x F Aloe, 2 x F Lady Juror.

 

Shocking Luck             1 M Bull Lea, 1 x M Grand Parade, 1 x F Lady Juror.

 

Chocante                     1 x M Bull Lea, 3 x F Aloe, 1 M Grand Parade.

 

(Shocking has female strains of Bull Lea, Foxlaw, and Grand Parade)

 

 To conclude, the purpose of these posts has been to demonstrate with some clarity there are principles (rather than theories) at work, which may be influencing performance, and may be of assistance to those with an interest in pedigrees who are endeavoring to breed a good horse. 

 

 

Good work - keep it up, keep posting.

I came across an old self-published book by John Gibson (then of Cambridge, born Picton 1918) A Guide to handling Horses. Basically it is all his old-school knowledge of horses, horse-days, skills, tactics and observations. What a wise old gentleman he is/was..... He won the 1991 Waikato Gold Cup with Dealers Charm - his 1st attempt at training a race horse.

He dabbled in breeding both horses and dogs (over decades of experience/observation)

Quotes:

"It is difficult to convince breeder's that it is possible to over egg the pudding by concentrating too many influences for high quality in a pedigree as the results tend to be the production of too much nervous energy with horse's very excitable, nervous or constitution weakness.

Wealthy business man who come into racing and breeding without any knowledge or understanding of it often seem unable to grasp that, breeding the best, with the best, does not necessarily result in the best.

If you breed to out cross sire's with every mating of your mare instead of mating to a stallion that is rich in her own genes, this is the quickest and surest way to ruin, that a breeder of horses can follow.

Out Cross matings occasionally can work but the success rate in relation is below the luck of Line bred matings to which the selected parents pass on a network of similar superior ability to the foal.

The breeding horses by out crossing completely different blood lines and genes result in full brothers and sisters being so unlike each other, where the line bred parents leave stock very uniform in type and ability with the same temperament which will co-operate that makes the training and handling of them more of a pleasure.

It has been my experience during my sixty years with horses that far more cross bed horses were more difficult to handle than others that were of the same blood line." END.

 

 

[Nasrullah 180]

Thank you for your postings HH88.

 

I am one who does look further back but places more emphasis on the what there is in the first 6 generations rather than 6 to 12 generations back which can be very diluted.

 

Keeping it simple Machiavellian not only carries the blood of Mr. Prospector, but also has two strains (through his broodmare sire Halo, as well as his direct tail female line) of Northern Dancer’s family, without carrying any of Northern Dancer’s own male line specifically.

 

What makes Machiavellian of particular interest to many breeders is the fact that his dam Coup de Folie (out of Natalma's daughter Raise The Standard) a two year old Group winner was inbred 3X3 to Almahmoud.

Almahmoud only had three daughters, but each of the three became the dam of a Champion sire, with Cosmah being responsible for Halo, Natalma for Northern Dancer and Babbling Beauty for the French champion Artic Tern.

 

As Machiavellian was himself inbred 3X4 to Native Dancer, he had two lines each of Natalma's parents.

The two lines of Native Dancer and Almahmound in Machiavellian's pedigree encourage the idea of coupling his descendents with those of Danehill, a stallion inbred 3X3 to Natalma.

 

Machiavellian gives us Natalma through her daughter Raise The Standard. Northern Dancer is a son of Natalma. A sex balanced cross.

 

So the key factor in Machiavellian line stallions is that they suit the majority of the broodmare band that has an abundance of Northern Dancer in it.