Huey 2,037 Report post Posted May 6, 2016 I feared the success of the recent yearling sales might see some crazy pricing of stud fees in NZ. Can anyone see any value? Makfi to $25k seems crazy (that's the same price as Pins) Dalghar off the back of 1 stakeswinning 2yo goes to $8k , thats seems a bit rich Swiss Ace to $13.5k has probably earned his increase Tavistock to $65k , what can you say Battle Paint comes down to $5k Ill Cavalo starts off at $3k Complacent at $5k is nicely priced Contributer at $15k thought he might have been kicked off at a more accessible fee Darci Brahma down to $15k, no doubting he has done well in NZ , but maybe now a hard sell? Iffraaj to $17.5k seems fair Showcasing at $15k doing a job with his 2yos Sweynesse at $6k seems a bit for a non G1 winner whose form compares a bit to Complacent Any other fees out there or new stallions? Any thoughts on others? Ashoka, Canelo and ADM 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nasrullah 180 Report post Posted May 7, 2016 Any Australian Group One form in Sydney or Melbourne at a mile is good form. El Roca by Fastnet Rock second in the Group One Randwick Guineas 7,500 Proisir by Choisir second in the Group One Randwick Guineas 7,000 Sweynesse by Lonhro second in the Group One Randwick Guineas $6,000 Any of the above depending on the bloodlines of your mare are good chances at stud. They are all good value. Cubes 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insider 3,942 Report post Posted May 7, 2016 Zacinto......The phone will be ringing hot tonight at 5K and why not. Wonderful for the South Island and great to see. Canelo, Breeder, gubellini and 3 others 6 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gubellini 3,993 Report post Posted May 7, 2016 Civics at $2,000 would have to be the best priced sire in N.Z. Two runners today. Irish Call easily won the first at Riccarton and stablemate Call Me Royal ran a very close second in the Great Autumn at the same venue. Ashoka and Cubes 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazach 133 Report post Posted May 8, 2016 When you go through catalogues and see how many foals mares have, how many winners, and then how many stakes winners, you would have to ask yourself "why breed from my own mare?" - at least to race. In my opinion, most stud fees are too high. I guess they are market driven, and if Asia keep buying, then all is good. It would be interesting to have some statistical analysis done (maybe it has already) based on the number of foals born each year in NZ, and how many would pay their way using average rearing and training fees over a 3-4 year period of racing. I guess this would be difficult to assess because of the number heading off shore. But my observations tell me it would less than 3% or 4% who stay in NZ. Getting back to the thread, unless your mare is a K1 mare, why would you even want to pay 5k for most stallions, when you don't know how crooked the foal's legs will be, and what other issues it may have. Cubes and Swynford 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canelo 459 Report post Posted May 8, 2016 So what you are saying bazach is leave the breeding to the stallion owners and buy to race as opposed to breed to race, let the stallion owners absorb the risk while the buyer may pay more for a good product but he is more or less in control of what his investment will cost him, at least for the first 18 months. Would that make the breeding landscape stronger or would it leave it open to price fixing and inflated values? Swoopa and Cubes 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey 2,037 Report post Posted May 8, 2016 3 hours ago, bazach said: When you go through catalogues and see how many foals mares have, how many winners, and then how many stakes winners, you would have to ask yourself "why breed from my own mare?" - at least to race. In my opinion, most stud fees are too high. I guess they are market driven, and if Asia keep buying, then all is good. It would be interesting to have some statistical analysis done (maybe it has already) based on the number of foals born each year in NZ, and how many would pay their way using average rearing and training fees over a 3-4 year period of racing. I guess this would be difficult to assess because of the number heading off shore. But my observations tell me it would less than 3% or 4% who stay in NZ. Getting back to the thread, unless your mare is a K1 mare, why would you even want to pay 5k for most stallions, when you don't know how crooked the foal's legs will be, and what other issues it may have. Agree with your thoughts regarding Stud Fees , they seem to be high based on what the stock of a stallion does at best not based on probability. Take the Weanling sales for example there will be stock from stallions selling there from decent mares going for a small percentage of the quoted stud fee as we all know. Canelo 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swoopa 281 Report post Posted May 8, 2016 On Friday, May 06, 2016 at 9:43 PM, Huey said: I feared the success of the recent yearling sales might see some crazy pricing of stud fees in NZ. Can anyone see any value? Makfi to $25k seems crazy (that's the same price as Pins) Dalghar off the back of 1 stakeswinning 2yo goes to $8k , thats seems a bit rich Swiss Ace to $13.5k has probably earned his increase Tavistock to $65k , what can you say Battle Paint comes down to $5k Ill Cavalo starts off at $3k Complacent at $5k is nicely priced Contributer at $15k thought he might have been kicked off at a more accessible fee Darci Brahma down to $15k, no doubting he has done well in NZ , but maybe now a hard sell? Iffraaj to $17.5k seems fair Showcasing at $15k doing a job with his 2yos Sweynesse at $6k seems a bit for a non G1 winner whose form compares a bit to Complacent Any other fees out there or new stallions? Any thoughts on others? Huey,agree with your list although I think Dalghar is still reasonably well priced at 8k. Canelo, great win in Vegas last night. "Keep the gloves up". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canelo 459 Report post Posted May 8, 2016 13 hours ago, Swoopa said: Huey,agree with your list although I think Dalghar is still reasonably well priced at 8k. Canelo, great win in Vegas last night. "Keep the gloves up". Yeah possibly a bit of ring rust, first fight in 6 months but a good win and a step closer to a fight with Gennady Golovkin-both are exceptional. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey 2,037 Report post Posted May 18, 2016 All the Linwood fees stay the same, I thought Echoes of Heaven may have dropped but compared with Rubick he is well priced. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breeder 607 Report post Posted May 19, 2016 Has anything been announced about where Mongolian Khan and Vesper will stand at stud ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey 2,037 Report post Posted May 19, 2016 16 hours ago, Breeder said: Has anything been announced about where Mongolian Khan and Vesper will stand at stud ? or The Bold One? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibbles 65 Report post Posted May 20, 2016 On 5/7/2016 at 5:14 PM, Insider said: Zacinto......The phone will be ringing hot tonight at 5K and why not. Wonderful for the South Island and great to see. Ingelwood Stud have announced that Zacinto will go from $4,500 (2015) to $10k (2016) Canelo 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insider 3,942 Report post Posted May 20, 2016 7 hours ago, Dibbles said: Ingelwood Stud have announced that Zacinto will go from $4,500 (2015) to $10k (2016) He is worth that for sure. If he was in the N.I. no problem as there are enough mares well enough bred to go to him and have every chance of coming out on top. The problem that I see is the possible lack of similar mares in the S.I. I don't want to be patronising, I simply hope that they do have the mares available to take advantage of the situation and drive it forward. It's interesting that the two Stakes Winners have been bred by two of three of the partners in the horse. Likewise Kevin Hickman and Inglewood Stud have sold the best yearlings too. I am wondering where the other partner, Winsor Park are fitting in as their results have not to been seen either on the race track or in the sale ring other than the number of weanlings they put through the ring the first time around? This horse has a hell of a future given a bit of luck and good management. Canelo 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canelo 459 Report post Posted May 20, 2016 Exceptional post Insider. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibbles 65 Report post Posted May 20, 2016 There are numerous South Island breeders who send their mares up to the North Island every season to support the North Island stallions so I am sure if they wanted their mares to stay closer to home they would. Also on the other hand there is nothing stopping North Island breeders sending mares to the South Island (not the end of the world) and the agistment costs would be a lot more reasonable!! Swynford and Tapu 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_gee 416 Report post Posted June 9, 2016 http://www.theinformant.co.nz/racing/EX52771/Vespa-to-stand-at-Wellfield-Lodge Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey 2,037 Report post Posted June 9, 2016 1 hour ago, mr_gee said: http://www.theinformant.co.nz/racing/EX52771/Vespa-to-stand-at-Wellfield-Lodge Any ideas on fee? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_gee 416 Report post Posted June 10, 2016 no i think its annouced next week Huey 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insider 3,942 Report post Posted June 10, 2016 My guess, 5k. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey 2,037 Report post Posted June 10, 2016 4 hours ago, Insider said: My guess, 5k. I think youre right , but if they are clever they will pitch him at $2k, Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...