Easter Cup day..and All Stars

[Alphonse-Gabriel 101]

As a young fella I really looked forward to the meeting. There were numerous feature races including the Group One NZ Welcome Stakes for Juveniles. We had a connection with the Royce Belcher trained and driven Local Light horse "Glide Time" who won it in 1977.  Won the Sapling Stakes the same year.   Local Light also sired Captain Harcourt and a host of other very nice horses.

This was obviously pre Trackside TV days but Television NZ broadcast the entire meeting as it was such a big day and stood out like dog's balls from other race days. Is the 2016 version of Easter Cup day better or worse than 39 years ago?

12 races.

The NZ Welcome Stakes has been transferred to April.

The two biggest support races are for two year olds.

Seven races worth around 10k? How is that any different to your average Addington meeting? I believe the support card on these big days should have a minimum stake of around 30 or 40k. Some will ask,where is that money coming from? I don't know. Chop it off the huge stakes offered to age group races etc. I'm so fed up with all the priority these days being on two and three year old races to the determent of all other races.  I grew up idolizing horses like Cardigan Bay and Lord Module etc etc. Not some 200k Juvenile race winner from the same stable who wins all these feature races and probably won't have a horse left to race as an open class horse.

Brings me to my second point. No wonder Mark Purdon targets these high value races. He does it beautifully. Now it's not just him winning it,he invariably quinella's the race and if he has three runners the chances are he will trifecta the race. Very good planning by the All Stars. If I had their resources, I'd do exactly the same thing. Silly not to...BUT these races are a snore-feast. The All Stars dominate in every possible way. He invariably has most of the runners engaged. Due to him being such a wonderful trainer,he has more resources than others so buys the best horses. So not only does he have most of the field,he has the best horses also. Nothing like a Franco Ice or The Bru Czar to threaten them apart from the rare exception such as Delightful Memphis and The Orange Agent.

One All Star goes to the front and then hands up to a stablemate. That stablemate will never in 20 seasons hand up to a non stablemate so the best two horses are in the prime position. If a stablemate is forced to sit parked it won't put pressure on the leader until the home straight if it's able. An outside stable horse has zero chance of beating the All Stars if it's forced to sit parked. Any outside stable horse further back than fourth turning for home has zero chance of beating the All Stars unless their horse is actually a Pegasus. End result is very very predictable A.B.C and does nothing for Harness Racing in my opinion especially when it happens week in week out. I hear people saying other trainers need to lift their game. Really? How? There are always only going to be 24 hours in each day. Mark Purdon has a magnificent eye for spotting young horses. He has the big owners to back that judgment. Who in NZ can compete with that? We have many wonderful trainers but a limit on the big owners. It can be done as The Orange Agent proved but she is a rare exception. I believe the best hope most have is to fluke an unfashionably bred champion that happens once in a blue moon. Even if you did snare one of those you still have to race against an All Star machine who can easily use their numerical advantage to have you fighting for scraps. Is this encouraging new owners into the game chasing glory? Is this helping to retain existing owners who are smart enough to know they have very little hope of beating the All Stars? You have more hope of winning lotto.

As things stand at present we have a tidal wave of balance. Almost all the cream on the cake in Harness Racing now is in two and three year old racing. That's just wrong. Almost every two and three year old race is dominated by one stable and their owners. Yes,those owners put a lot into the game but man oh man they take a lot out. Other owners put a lot in to it also including their dreams which have now become a fantasy.

We know Mark and Natalie are going to dominate with juvenile features etc. Good on them. They earn their success and also have horses like Have Faith In Me and Smolda squeezing out all the competition in the open class elite races. What's left? All the other owners and trainers are chasing the crumbs of a 10k supporting race on Easter Cup day. Yippee. 

If we don't get the balance right we are going to continue turning punters and owner off. Harness Racing is good....but it's not that good. 

 

[Overcheck 190]

And Alphonse-Gabriel they used to get a much greater crowd when it was a day meeting. Could do so today as the rugby is at night so no competition from them.

[Prodigious 111]

Quote

 

Very good post Alphonse. The imbalance in 2 and 3YO races is what the big owners want. And those big owners are all with the All Stars stable. A coincidence. I think not. The fact that these big owners are also big players in the industry, and it is no wonder it is in such big trouble. It is called vested interest.

It is impossible for new players to get into the game, either in breeding or training - or even ownership. The industry feeds only one tiny sector.  And it is dying on its feet. Throw in the demise of the dairy industry, which basically underpins harness racing in the south, and within five years we are going to be dead in the water.

Mark my words.

 

[Alphonse-Gabriel 101]

I'm not in any way jealous of the All Stars success. They are magnificent at what they do and are to be commended. I love harness racing. It's in my blood. We've owned a host of reasonable horses. No world beaters but several that have more than paid their way. We own no horses at this time and have no interest in doing so under the present set up. All the cream on our harness cake is in 2 and three year old races. Almost every single one of these races are dominated by one stable and their owners. Here's a fairytale for you. Once upon a time the cream on the cake was the Auckland / NZ Cup's,the Dominion Handicap / Rowe Cup and the Inter Dominion series. The later is now a farce and the two big cups and two big trots are just four races. How many sets of owners can win those four races? More chance of winning lotto.

I'd love to see the cream spread right across the harness racing cake. If that is not done sooner rather than later then the only people left on the track with be the All Stars and their owners. 

R.I.P NZ Harness Racing.

[Prodigious 111]

I'm not bagging the Purdon barn in the slightest. They are the best run stable in the country and have set new standards - akin to what I've seen around the world in terms of facilities and professionalism. But with the imbalance towards 2 and 3YO racing, you are right, y

they have no incentive to produce open class trotters or pacers because the funding isn't there. It is so out of kilter, and is a direct result of our infatuation with Northern American pacing. Their system is a basket case and is only viable because of massive cross-funding through their casinos.

The European model works very well in France and Sweden, and we have the TAB monopoly to make it work here. What idiot punters who keep banging on about bookmakers don't understand, is that everywhere that they rule, racing is in a terrible state. They are leeches on the industry. And don't even get me started on Betfair - that is a malignant growth.

 

[2Piper 408]

Best thing you can do with 2yo races and to encourage participation is have c0, c1 and c2+ classifications races for 2yo's and have a raceday for them every fortnight or so. Still have the listed races on the usual programmes.

I'm talking about having a day in January where all 8+ 2yo races are for maidens, next meeting 7 maiden races and 1 c1 race, following meeting 6 maiden races 1 c1 race, 1 open race with preferential draw. By the time you get to April you would have somewhere between 40-60 maiden 2yo winners, each meeting after would hold 5-6 maiden races, 2-3 c1 races and a c2 race and probably an open/c3+ race. 27 individual 2yos have qualified in Canterbury in March alone, 32 in Febuary, 14 in January.

In all 33 fillies have raced so far this season and 35 colts & geldings throughout the country. Its in HRNZ's interest to programme these races and to encourage all qualified horses to race , not get scared away from racing and only race against the Purdon lot once in a while and not all the time.

 

[2Piper 408]

Just to go back to last years jewels , the Purdon barn had 4 runners in the Colts & Geldings race and trained the TFA so there will be space to make good money with others if only HRNZ programme it so.

[LongOwner 217]

On ‎27‎/‎03‎/‎2016 at 10:45 AM, Alphonse-Gabriel said:

As a young fella I really looked forward to the meeting. There were numerous feature races including the Group One NZ Welcome Stakes for Juveniles. We had a connection with the Royce Belcher trained and driven Local Light horse "Glide Time" who won it in 1977.  Won the Sapling Stakes the same year.   Local Light also sired Captain Harcourt and a host of other very nice horses.

This was obviously pre Trackside TV days but Television NZ broadcast the entire meeting as it was such a big day and stood out like dog's balls from other race days. Is the 2016 version of Easter Cup day better or worse than 39 years ago?

12 races.

The NZ Welcome Stakes has been transferred to April.

The two biggest support races are for two year olds.

Seven races worth around 10k? How is that any different to your average Addington meeting? I believe the support card on these big days should have a minimum stake of around 30 or 40k. Some will ask,where is that money coming from? I don't know. Chop it off the huge stakes offered to age group races etc. I'm so fed up with all the priority these days being on two and three year old races to the determent of all other races.  I grew up idolizing horses like Cardigan Bay and Lord Module etc etc. Not some 200k Juvenile race winner from the same stable who wins all these feature races and probably won't have a horse left to race as an open class horse.

Brings me to my second point. No wonder Mark Purdon targets these high value races. He does it beautifully. Now it's not just him winning it,he invariably quinella's the race and if he has three runners the chances are he will trifecta the race. Very good planning by the All Stars. If I had their resources, I'd do exactly the same thing. Silly not to...BUT these races are a snore-feast. The All Stars dominate in every possible way. He invariably has most of the runners engaged. Due to him being such a wonderful trainer,he has more resources than others so buys the best horses. So not only does he have most of the field,he has the best horses also. Nothing like a Franco Ice or The Bru Czar to threaten them apart from the rare exception such as Delightful Memphis and The Orange Agent.

One All Star goes to the front and then hands up to a stablemate. That stablemate will never in 20 seasons hand up to a non stablemate so the best two horses are in the prime position. If a stablemate is forced to sit parked it won't put pressure on the leader until the home straight if it's able. An outside stable horse has zero chance of beating the All Stars if it's forced to sit parked. Any outside stable horse further back than fourth turning for home has zero chance of beating the All Stars unless their horse is actually a Pegasus. End result is very very predictable A.B.C and does nothing for Harness Racing in my opinion especially when it happens week in week out. I hear people saying other trainers need to lift their game. Really? How? There are always only going to be 24 hours in each day. Mark Purdon has a magnificent eye for spotting young horses. He has the big owners to back that judgment. Who in NZ can compete with that? We have many wonderful trainers but a limit on the big owners. It can be done as The Orange Agent proved but she is a rare exception. I believe the best hope most have is to fluke an unfashionably bred champion that happens once in a blue moon. Even if you did snare one of those you still have to race against an All Star machine who can easily use their numerical advantage to have you fighting for scraps. Is this encouraging new owners into the game chasing glory? Is this helping to retain existing owners who are smart enough to know they have very little hope of beating the All Stars? You have more hope of winning lotto.

As things stand at present we have a tidal wave of balance. Almost all the cream on the cake in Harness Racing now is in two and three year old racing. That's just wrong. Almost every two and three year old race is dominated by one stable and their owners. Yes,those owners put a lot into the game but man oh man they take a lot out. Other owners put a lot in to it also including their dreams which have now become a fantasy.

We know Mark and Natalie are going to dominate with juvenile features etc. Good on them. They earn their success and also have horses like Have Faith In Me and Smolda squeezing out all the competition in the open class elite races. What's left? All the other owners and trainers are chasing the crumbs of a 10k supporting race on Easter Cup day. Yippee. 

If we don't get the balance right we are going to continue turning punters and owner off. Harness Racing is good....but it's not that good. 

 

Excellent summary of the real situation - the frustration is the many who see it as not a problem. It is driving many out of the sport as the dream has been taken away !

[23Tank 33]

Race 1, C1 3.07???WTF

I don't believe it's all down to breeding improvements, training advances bla, bla bla.

"If somethings seems to good to be true, it usually is"

 

 

[GONSTA 1,148]

19 minutes ago, 23Tank said:

Race 1, C1 3.07???WTF

I don't believe it's all down to breeding improvements, training advances bla, bla bla.

"If somethings seems to good to be true, it usually is"

 

 

 

Who trains the horse? Why is it in this thread and who are you referring to in your statements?

[Thejanitor 1,228]

2 hours ago, 23Tank said:

Race 1, C1 3.07???WTF

I don't believe it's all down to breeding improvements, training advances bla, bla bla.

"If somethings seems to good to be true, it usually is"

 

 

I assume you are referring  to Captain Dolmio? I see nothing surprising about his win or his time. Matt Brinsdon is a good trainer and the horse has been racing well and won in a fast time at Winton on March 19, over 2400m in 2:56.2 last 800m 55.3!

[2Piper 408]

 

12 hours ago, Thejanitor said:

I assume you are referring  to Captain Dolmio? I see nothing surprising about his win or his time. Matt Brinsdon is a good trainer and the horse has been racing well and won in a fast time at Winton on March 19, over 2400m in 2:56.2 last 800m 55.3!

horses improve with experience and age, 

going by Captain Dolmio's recent form the trainer has got this horse physically and mentally ready to be a very exciting racehorse - all the best to them both

[what a post 811]

15 hours ago, Thejanitor said:

I assume you are referring  to Captain Dolmio? I see nothing surprising about his win or his time. Matt Brinsdon is a good trainer and the horse has been racing well and won in a fast time at Winton on March 19, over 2400m in 2:56.2 last 800m 55.3!

Amazing run.  Obviously a really nice horse ,but 3.07.7 has to be a surprise.  This would be in the top 4 or 5 winning times ever at addington for 2600m.  The horse was in the 1 win grade you know.     Similar to running  about 2.52 for 2400m.    Went from a $40,000 horse to a $200,000 horse in one run. Will be interesting to follow this horses form when it returns to the south.

[Guest]

13 minutes ago, what a post said:

Amazing run.  Obviously a really nice horse ,but 3.07.7 has to be a surprise.  This would be in the top 4 or 5 winning times ever at addington for 2600m.  The horse was in the 1 win grade you know.     Similar to running  about 2.52 for 2400m.    Went from a $40,000 horse to a $250,000 horse in one run. Will be interesting to follow this horses form when it returns to the south.

I think you will find that John Dunn who drove the horse has been putting the finishing touches on the horse recently.

The Dunns are extremely good trainers.

[what a post 811]

Just now, Brodie said:

I think you will find that John Dunn who drove the horse has been putting the finishing touches on the horse recently.

The Dunns are extremely good trainers.

Watching the race you had to think that would be the case,but there was no notification on hrnz website to that effect.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, what a post said:

Watching the race you had to think that would be the case,but there was no notification on hrnz website to that effect.

Happens all the time in NZ.

Not sure how many days or weeks they can have horse before notified.

Horses go to other areas still in trainers names all the time and obvious that the name in the book isn't gearing the horse up, but we don't know who it is until too late.

[what a post 811]

Last mile in 1.52.5 according to media reports.     He had already run 1000m.    And that's just a 1 win grade.  How good do you have to be these days just to run midfield in some of these races? 

[Sheeza 5]

On ‎1‎/‎04‎/‎2016 at 8:39 PM, Thejanitor said:

I assume you are referring  to Captain Dolmio? I see nothing surprising about his win or his time. Matt Brinsdon is a good trainer and the horse has been racing well and won in a fast time at Winton on March 19, over 2400m in 2:56.2 last 800m 55.3!

Thanks for that comment Matts wife here this is nice support for all the work and effort that has gone into him.  Not bad for amatures he is now staying at John Dunns and if all goes well he will be there a while.

[Kotare_Hunter 748]

3 hours ago, Sheeza said:

he is now staying at John Dunns and if all goes well he will be there a while.

And he wasn't there prior to last Fridays race Sheeza ?