legs&lashes

Imports

69 posts in this topic

Had a conversation with Greg Kerr the other day as I was concerned about some ridiculous and worrying comments from a few on this site regarding ozzie dogs coming here to race.

The board are fully aware of the need for these greyhounds to come here to race for the sustainability and  betterment of our sport.

As long as the numbers stay at around what they are now there wont be (and shouldnt be) any increase in that thieving fee.

In my opinion the numbers will gradually diminish over the next 5 years so lets hope the breeding and rearing in NZ continues to improve cos its going to need to.

AC

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Theyre worried about imports affecting our numbers. But we arent going to import rubbish with the ever increasing transport costs.

 

The odd one is a flop. But generally imports go to c2/3 if not higher. 

The cost of purchasing a greyhound in new zealand now has gone up dramatically over the past few years so it makes it tough trying to find one for new owners. 

 

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My 5 cents worth . Selling pups to cheap won't get many takers and selling share need to be from a reliable source and have a background from breeder/ trainer. Imports have slowed down mainly in the south but not so much in the north I think they may have increased slightly and the cd is getting a fair share . The way I see it breeding has increased within the last few months after taking a break once costs increased. The number of imports will slowly start to increase within the next year as trainers won't have the pups they use to coming thru or will have to continue racing dogs they normally wouldn't be still racing. Will certainly be interesting to see how greyhound racing in NZ gets thru the next 12 months.

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I wouldn't say 1500 is too cheap, I would think people need to take a hard look at what they charge. Take these pup, natural serve from a sire charging 750nz. There is no way I would charge people 2.5-3k for these pups like some people do.

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thanks for enquiring, my ads in the classifieds, 25% left in the dog and 50% left in the bitch only.

back on topic, I see some cracking import bitches in nz too, that people should approach trainers about if they want to breed or even approach about pups in the future etc. Vegas Danny for example, v quick bitch and I think she is a sister to no donuts and out of top sire fabragas and a top class bottom line. Just one i put into gdata. These import bitches could bring some serious class, not just on the racetrack but in the breeding barn for the future.

 

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The legs and lashes post on imports is rather sad really because there is an obvious vested interest.      Legs and lashes in unwilling to see the big picture of supply and demand.     Imports totalled over 250 last year and previously GRNZ has stated this figure is acceptable and manageable.     If this is so why do we have hundreds of greyhounds  "missing" each year and a hundred plus waiting for rehoming?    Imported greyhounds have a place but not at the expense of other industry participants.   One solution is to return them to their place of origin but most importantly we need a sustainable policy.       GRNZ seems unable to address even the basic needs of its participants.     An urgent inquiry is needed.     Ray Amer

 

 

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I'm sorry ray but GAP are in need of cat friendly greyhound they will take them straight away no waiting list . The problem is a lot of greyhounds can not find homes because of this reason imports or not 

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1 hour ago, grandad47 said:

The legs and lashes post on imports is rather sad really because there is an obvious vested interest.      Legs and lashes in unwilling to see the big picture of supply and demand.     Imports totalled over 250 last year and previously GRNZ has stated this figure is acceptable and manageable.     If this is so why do we have hundreds of greyhounds  "missing" each year and a hundred plus waiting for rehoming?    Imported greyhounds have a place but not at the expense of other industry participants.   One solution is to return them to their place of origin but most importantly we need a sustainable policy.       GRNZ seems unable to address even the basic needs of its participants.     An urgent inquiry is needed.     Ray Amer

 

 

Ray i think you have a more vested intrest to get rid of imports so they wont get in your way with your breeding so you can win group races....we have done both and to tell you the truth if you want to eat you bring in imports......if you are retired like you with a income that dogs wins don't effect you then breed because at the end of the day there is no more satisfaction than winning a group race with your own breed...but don't bag imports....Kath and i are down $80000 in the last year with our breeding ( and i am not saying it is right or wrong as we have won 3 group ones and plenty of racing series with them )  but when you rear a whole litter and keep them we all know the cost...from last week i have stopped breeding ( maybe one litter a year , and i have some nice broodies ) and have 6 imports coming in the next two weeks to make sure we can eat and pay for the other dogs we have......i remember Jimmy lee from perth telling me 7 years ago you are either a breeder or a trainer and if you are a breeder you will go broke , so stay as a trainer and you will survive.......did i listen no.....

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3 hours ago, grandad47 said:

The legs and lashes post on imports is rather sad really because there is an obvious vested interest.      Legs and lashes in unwilling to see the big picture of supply and demand.     Imports totalled over 250 last year and previously GRNZ has stated this figure is acceptable and manageable.     If this is so why do we have hundreds of greyhounds  "missing" each year and a hundred plus waiting for rehoming?    Imported greyhounds have a place but not at the expense of other industry participants.   One solution is to return them to their place of origin but most importantly we need a sustainable policy.       GRNZ seems unable to address even the basic needs of its participants.     An urgent inquiry is needed.     Ray Amer

 

 

:) My boys Crouch and Nitro are comming home when retired just like Jet and Jessie and cooks, Boy have a home already when retiring Queen, Kristy, Eden all will be mums, I do not believe true animal lovers would do any different, Our trainers The Roberts have always done the right thing with all my dogs and they have all been imports, WB

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Ray you are a hard case.Firstly you tell me I have a vested interest to bring in the Ozzie dogs.I actually breed as well Ray but as Steve has tried to explain it is too hard to make a living out of breeding.

However you have a bigger vested interest because you ONLY breed. And you it is only a hobby for you.

I have been breeding since way before you were even in this industry Ray.The reason I started to import ,which you wouldn't be aware of cos you weren't around in those days,was because it was virtually impossible to buy NZ bred greyhounds and as a TRAINER I needed to supply owners with racedogs.It still is extremely hard to buy NZ bred racing stock.

Now some questions for you.......

1   If you are so concerned about NZ breeding why don't you support the local stud dogs???(maybe Dyna Vikkers instead of IMPORTING Dyna Double One)

2   Have you raced an Ozzie import?

3   Where did Swift Fantasy,Little Mother,Dream Collector,Dyna Vikkers come from?(these dogs lifted the profile of our sport more than any other form of marketing would have)

4   What is the "bigger Picture" im not seeing.

Now I must go and tend to my 4 week old pups I have just BRED!

AC

 

 

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Just now, grandad47 said:

Read my posts and you will get the bigger picture.     Yes I have used NZ based sires and have a lovely Piggy Bank pup that will get every chance.    DDO versus DV - both nice dogs but the former has outstanding race records and superior genetics in my view.    Ray

Are the Genetics not the same being Littermates???

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they race in in similar fashion too, bit slow but so quick, so strong, roll w the punches, show patience and power home. I think dyna vikkers offers kiwi breeders that complete package for a sprinting bitch.....if we breed from chasing shadows again she's going to vikkers. See his other bro quirk making c5 too.

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This is my opinion for what its worth. Ray is a successful breeder. He has been breeding animals all his life. Cows, horses, and now dogs. Ray matches his maternal bloodlines to only the best. He only uses his better bitches. His maternal line traces back to Mega Maxi. She won a NZ Oaks whilst in my care on behalf of her owner and trainer Adriane Charters in track record time at Addington. She then added the Canterbury Futurity, and the Auckland Cup. Out of this line came Funny Girl, winner of over $70,000. She left Ninas Girl, conqueror of Swift Fantasy in the Silver Collar. Ninas Girl looks like being brood bitch of the yr judging by the lead she has at present. So in short what i'm trying to point out is, Ray is an astute breeder, and only goe's to the best Sires suited to his bloodlines.

In litters of dogs, not all get the same genes, some are strong, some are weak, some are stupid, some are smart, etc. In the scheme of things, nature usually dictates that only the strongest dog becomes the Alpha dog. He will be the one that doe's all the dealing, in this fashion the breed can go forward and not backwards. This Alpha dog will be the prepotent one [ability to throw on right genes] not all have this ability. Its rare to find two dogs in a litter that are equal in the ability to thow on their strength.

In the Greyhound world when selecting a Sire, best track performance is usually the guide as to the Alpha dog, the one with the ability to lift the breed. And usually theres only one in the litter. So when the question is put to Ray over DDO as against DV, Rays assessment as breeder is, DDO is the Alpha dog in the litter. But time will tell.

I did try going to the brother of a famous dog once, it was a dog by the name of Doughtful Bill, he stood in Queensland and was a brother to the mighty Brother Fox. I got good dogs at the time, but really he just faded away in the breed, and you would be lucky to find him in any pedigrees today, whereas Brother Fox would be everywhere. Brother Fox was the ALPHA dog, and thats why he was so great. Until we see pups on the ground we won't conclusively know who's going to be the best Sire between DDO, and DV, but because DDO has by far the superior record, then he will get the best bitches and in all probability be the better sire and the Alpha in the litter. I hope i havn't ruffled to many feathers, only my opinion. DV has been a great dog in NZ.

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Unfortunately Ray, whilst there are a few decent breeders in NZ there are many who aren't. We barely have enough trainers let alone breeders and unfortunately I don't see a lot of young people knocking on the door to get into our industry. In my view if we relied on NZ breeding alone we would end up with 10 race cards and probably 9 of them being sprints with in a couple of years. Week in week out we struggle to get c5 middle distance races all over NZ if you take away the imported dogs you would be lucky to see a c2 middle distance race. On another note if it is the welfare side of things you are worried about do you think 100% of dogs bred in NZ make it to the races? there is a large percentage of dogs that don't and many have short careers because they aren't competitive. Are the Majority of these dogs finding homes? Be realistic if you enjoy having a industry in NZ the imports have to stay. 

Matt

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On 3/31/2016 at 10:20 AM, grandad47 said:

Read my posts and you will get the bigger picture.     Yes I have used NZ based sires and have a lovely Piggy Bank pup that will get every chance.    DDO versus DV - both nice dogs but the former has outstanding race records and superior genetics in my view.    Ray

Ray i think this has got a bit out off kilt as there is two sides to every story ....breeding is fine and to breed a group winner is special ...but to make a living trying to breed is not a winner....for trainers to survive they need imports ....i think as breeders if you paid training fees on all your dogs you would struggle to break even and the trainer would struggle more......I thought i could do it but it has been a disaster without imports to boost our income....i don't think you will ever see the day dave fahey does not have a import as they do make up 90% of group winners..sure gary cleeve has been super , but then he owns most of them himself.......that will never bring new owners in  to the sport the only way they can get involved is imports..as no one is going to sell them a nz bred dog with ability at the right price

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