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NeilD

Race Times Thread

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I disagreed with the official times at Te Aroha. Below are the times I got from when the gates were triggered.

The sectionals and review can be seen here: http://formpro.co.nz/2016/03/17/march-17th-2016-te-aroha-sectional-review/

Race 1 2.19.88/2.19.30 

Race 2 1.37.04/ 1.36.19

Race 3 1.36.92/1.35.97

Race 4 1.25.16/ 1.24.43

Race 5 1.11.28/ 1.10.45

Race 6  1.10.80/1.10.15

Race 7  1.38.40/ 1.37.65

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I have no idea why certain timekeepers trigger their times differently, but hopefully we will find out next Wednesday. For the integrity of NZ racing we need to ensure the times are triggered from the starters button. Just last Saturday, one of the best backed runners in the Diamond Stakes at Ellerslie was Midnight Gossip based on her good win at Te Aroha. Those who use times and speed ratings  to assess how good that win was would have seen it was one of the fastest times recorded there of 57.41, but after double checking it, the time from when the gates were triggered, was actually 58.48, around six lengths slower! She had every chance in the race and didn't kick on. The chap Peter Earley was interviewing about them this week, said he was looking into why this happens and was going to report back next Wednesday on his show. I really hope they can get all times triggered from the starters button as it does take a fair bit of time double checking all race times, and I would much rather spend that time watching the Chase. Anyone see that chap win $60k this morning flying solo!

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9 minutes ago, Leggy said:

Yeahh, I did Neal :) Never watched it before but was in the hospital with my Mum endlessly waiting her appointment. Almost more exciting than the Derby was!

I reckon it was that fiery shirt he was wearing. I might get one for the Oaks on Saturday to make sure Sofia gets home.

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I wondered about the reefton times in jan, with maidens running fast times for the 2000m races ,but was assured they were correct.was abit dubious myself, i know the  track was in top order and a credit to the club.Shame these days that track records are not printed in the books at the small meetings, we seem to miss these important facts, guess the general public not to fussed but for me im very interested, wonder why anyone shed any light.

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3 hours ago, Shad said:

I wondered about the reefton times in jan, with maidens running fast times for the 2000m races ,but was assured they were correct.was abit dubious myself, i know the  track was in top order and a credit to the club.Shame these days that track records are not printed in the books at the small meetings, we seem to miss these important facts, guess the general public not to fussed but for me im very interested, wonder why anyone shed any light.

I'm bloody dubious about the Reefton times myself but every time I bring the topic up am assured that the track has been measured and is correct.

A thing went 56 sec for 1020m there a few years ago.  That is Black Caviar pace and she did it in a dead straight line at Flemington!

 

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Sorry Tom, I don't check the Reefton times. Just be warned that at Trentham tomorrow, in race 2, Sealed By A Dance and Flying Ibis both come out of the same race at Taranaki where the race time is shown as 1.33.93. They did have trouble with the timing of some races there that day and the time from when the gates were triggered was 1.35.92 with the last 600m off the front of 36.12.

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Timaru times

There have been a few questions asked about the Timaru times today on Trackside TV.

Below are the times I got from the first movement of the gates.

Race 1

1.10.76 ( Official 1.10.03) Last 600m 35.72

Race 2

1.10.96 ( Official 1.10.30) Last 600m 35.12

Race 3

 1.10.56  ( Official Time 1.09.47) Last 600m 35.44

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I have never figured out why its so hard for Trackside to superimpose a clock over the pictures. If its technically hard doing live then I suggest the overnight replays just have a clock running with accuracy down to say 0.1 of a sec. Granted videos have frame rates and all that adding to margin of error however one could stop the video at the start and finish then workout the difference for the time. So much for all the great improvements Trackside were going to implement.

One could have their own clock running on a screen doing the same thing but then that brings in another margin of error. 

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2 hours ago, NeilD said:

Sorry Tom, I don't check the Reefton times. Just be warned that at Trentham tomorrow, in race 2, Sealed By A Dance and Flying Ibis both come out of the same race at Taranaki where the race time is shown as 1.33.93. They did have trouble with the timing of some races there that day and the time from when the gates were triggered was 1.35.92 with the last 600m off the front of 36.12.

Neil

I have always had misgivings about the times at Reefton though it is a very very quick track which is remarkable for how small it is.  It doesn't have a back straight just a continuous curve(ie a D shape) so is not as tight as might be expected.

I am not too concerned about that but can you tell us, with your knowledge,why the times in NZ racing are generally faster that the Aussie equivalents.  Is it because the measuring is done differently(my understanding is that NZ distances are measured one metre off the rail - though I could be wrong) or maybe the point when timing commences is different.  As you say the activation of the starting gates will produce a different time to if the timing commences when they are fully open.

Thanks

Brian Molloy

    

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8 hours ago, NeilD said:

Sorry Tom, I don't check the Reefton times. Just be warned that at Trentham tomorrow, in race 2, Sealed By A Dance and Flying Ibis both come out of the same race at Taranaki where the race time is shown as 1.33.93. They did have trouble with the timing of some races there that day and the time from when the gates were triggered was 1.35.92 with the last 600m off the front of 36.12.

Reeftons times are fast maiden went 2.02.7  sum of the open class horses can't go that quick. I think you need to get down there next meeting for sum of that good coast hospitality.

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You got that wrong Kakama. I got it for half that price. Interesting to note that the stipes queried the times there and the explanation was that the timer was manually triggered which explains why you can be at least a second out.

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There are currently three different formats for timing in New Zealand. They are

1. From the pressing of the starters button;

2. From the time the gate is open; and

3. An arbitrary start by the judge who presses the start button when he sees the gates open.

we also had a problem with synchronising the official start times and the actual distances the races were being run over. The official distance and the actual distance are in many cases quite different. 

When you you take into account the changing of the running rail position, these differences are exacerbated.

when trying to introduce a timing system into NZ nearly 18 months ago, these factors made the accurate automation nearly impossible to implement

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On 3/17/2016 at 8:33 AM, TOM(the other Molloy) said:

I'm bloody dubious about the Reefton times myself but every time I bring the topic up am assured that the track has been measured and is correct.

A thing went 56 sec for 1020m there a few years ago.  That is Black Caviar pace and she did it in a dead straight line at Flemington!

 

There was a maiden mare called quality street ran 57.7 for the 1020 was trained by kelly burne i think, was that the horse you were referring to, for me the times seemed to improved since the the shifting of the winning post, which i thought was a shame given the jockey that run off there and went over the outside fence was caused by not steering her round the corner and drifting to the outside fence, the post had been there for a long time with not to many other issues over the years, must have come at a cost for the club. Certainly glad to her you are racing for another year as its a great day out.

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7 hours ago, Shad said:

There was a maiden mare called quality street ran 57.7 for the 1020 was trained by kelly burne i think, was that the horse you were referring to, for me the times seemed to improved since the the shifting of the winning post, which i thought was a shame given the jockey that run off there and went over the outside fence was caused by not steering her round the corner and drifting to the outside fence, the post had been there for a long time with not to many other issues over the years, must have come at a cost for the club. Certainly glad to her you are racing for another year as its a great day out.

That was it.  I thought it was 56 but obviously the memory is not too sharp.

Still bloody quick round Reefton

The winning post alteration was no problem - it was previously on the bend so we cannot argue about that.  Wouldn't matter where it was though that girl would have let her horse run off

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50 minutes ago, TOM(the other Molloy) said:

That was it.  I thought it was 56 but obviously the memory is not too sharp.

Still bloody quick round Reefton

The winning post alteration was no problem - it was previously on the bend so we cannot argue about that.  Wouldn't matter where it was though that girl would have let her horse run off

Have to agree with that just couldn't understand them asking for the shift given no other problems over all those years of racing with it in the original place. Have you any idea of the track records of all distances, be interested to know.i may have to go through my archives to see if i can find them.

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