Bimbo 732 Report post Posted February 21, 2016 Some funny things happen in New Zealand racing, but a relegation due to a bit of movement nearly a kilometre from the finish line? I thought it was a bad decision. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trump 2,741 Report post Posted February 21, 2016 Our Poetic Prince, eased down to win Caulfield Guineas by 4 lengths (could have been 10 if Harry rode him out to the line) but lost on protest to Marwong for interference about 1000m from the WP. Then there's He's Remarkable in Perth ! The Stipes in the CS Hayes protest had no other option. Lloyd Vivian 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shad 1,540 Report post Posted February 21, 2016 Whats with brugell late scratched again yesterday at winton. Second time in last 2 starts.Bad luck or otherwise.Any opinions. Mainland Rookie 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdytdy 5,335 Report post Posted February 21, 2016 7 hours ago, Trump said: Our Poetic Prince, eased down to win Caulfield Guineas by 4 lengths (could have been 10 if Harry rode him out to the line) but lost on protest to Marwong for interference about 1000m from the WP. Then there's He's Remarkable in Perth ! The Stipes in the CS Hayes protest had no other option. I know it was nearly 30 years ago, 1987 to be precise but the alleged interference was on the turn and he won by a length from Marwong with NGH easing Poetic Prince down. The relegation was an out and out rort by the Aussies stipes and a total injustice. Memphis2, Lloyd Vivian, We're Doomed and 1 other 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
We're Doomed 4,824 Report post Posted February 21, 2016 26 minutes ago, kakama said: I backed the winner before it was relegated. If you look at stripes report, fair enough. Cost the horse a win. I have never felt ripped off by a relegation in Aussie. Not the case in nz racing, decisions terrible. The Jewel in the Queensland Oaks! Lloyd Vivian, elbow and pogo(aus) 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chelseacol 2,488 Report post Posted February 21, 2016 37 minutes ago, kakama said: I backed the winner before it was relegated. If you look at stripes report, fair enough. Cost the horse a win. I have never felt ripped off by a relegation in Aussie. Not the case in nz racing, decisions terrible. I know you aussies love all things aussie - but not everything over there is better. Been some shocking decisions at inquirys, tracks with bias or overwatered, lots of cheats, etc etc - both sides of the tasman. the cheats probably more in Aussie as that is their culture Memphis2 and biff 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chelseacol 2,488 Report post Posted February 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, kakama said: Bloody hell, that's a bit harsh! Has someone hacked your account! I am getting a bit of shit for being an Aussie! Just going to make a pavlova, one of my ancestors gave me a great recipe, I think he invented it! Go the cricket. Haha - I will pop round for morning tea then Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdytdy 5,335 Report post Posted February 21, 2016 1 hour ago, kakama said: I backed the winner before it was relegated. If you look at stripes report, fair enough. Cost the horse a win. I have never felt ripped off by a relegation in Aussie. Not the case in nz racing, decisions terrible. Three of the worst decisions in Australia, all going against the Kiwi's. Poetic Prince, The Jewel and He's Remarkable. Tauhei Notts, Memphis2, elbow and 3 others 6 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bimbo 732 Report post Posted February 21, 2016 2 hours ago, kakama said: I backed the winner before it was relegated. If you look at stripes report, fair enough. Must have been a very small bet. Might be better to look at the race not the stipes report. If you start doing things like this race placings would have to change all over the place. We all see things differently, but I thought Saturdays decision was ridiculous. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bimbo 732 Report post Posted February 21, 2016 Have you watched the race or just going by what you read? Palentino moved out to avoid a horse in front. What was he supposed to do? Clip heels and take a fall? He didn't push Tivaci out to get a run in the final furlong. Maybe as a steward you could argue that he should have gone inside only. That's easy to say when you haven't been on a horse going over 30 miles per hour and another horse is coming back on you. It wasn't halfway through the race. The race was 1400 and it happened around 900 out. I missed the win price I wanted, but had it and Chautauqua (great win at a good price) anchored in a quaddie. Didn't have the winner of the last leg. Jefferson 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
biff 2,158 Report post Posted February 21, 2016 3 hours ago, chelseacol said: I know you aussies love all things aussie - but not everything over there is better. Been some shocking decisions at inquirys, tracks with bias or overwatered, lots of cheats, etc etc - both sides of the tasman. the cheats probably more in Aussie as that is their culture Cobalt anyone? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chelseacol 2,488 Report post Posted February 22, 2016 34 minutes ago, kakama said: Watched race a few times, a bit hard to tell that far out what actually happens, those that made the decision obviously had better footage. But, I still have no problem with the decision. I have no problem with relegations early in races, that should be the case. The reason that nz race riding has become some demolition derby joke, is the fact that no one gets charged for dodgy riding in the early stages of a race. If they did get charged, racing here would be far cleaner ever watched the Slipper mate ? kakama 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bimbo 732 Report post Posted February 22, 2016 25 minutes ago, kakama said: The reason that nz race riding has become some demolition derby joke, is the fact that no one gets charged for dodgy riding in the early stages of a race. If they did get charged, racing here would be far cleaner i agree that the standard of riding in New Zealand has become very poor. Either the stewards are blind, don't care or more likely know that they can't afford to charge jockeys in New Zealand. There aren't enough of them and most would be hard pressed to earn a reasonable living, especially in the South Island. How could you possibly fine the poor buggers when most would have nothing. In Australia they can send them to an apprentice skills panel and a psychologist. We can't do that here, as amongst other things we don't have any money. biff and Ashoka 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruff 2,778 Report post Posted February 22, 2016 21 hours ago, Trump said: Our Poetic Prince, eased down to win Caulfield Guineas by 4 lengths (could have been 10 if Harry rode him out to the line) but lost on protest to Marwong for interference about 1000m from the WP. Then there's He's Remarkable in Perth ! The Stipes in the CS Hayes protest had no other option. Perth no other option Trumpy,good decision Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pogo(aus) 828 Report post Posted February 22, 2016 11 hours ago, rdytdy said: Three of the worst decisions in Australia, all going against the Kiwi's. Poetic Prince, The Jewel and He's Remarkable. veandercross? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruff 2,778 Report post Posted February 22, 2016 Maurita flattened one right in front of me at around the 200m at Ellerslie,the horses nose scraped the ground and the jockey did a great job staying on. Enquiry lasted 5 min. Well connected from Memory? But memorys a touch dicey that far back Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trump 2,741 Report post Posted February 22, 2016 I was standing around 100m from the winning post the day Poetic P win the Guineas. Fair dinkum, Noël Harris was a mile in front and nearly standing up in the irons. He eased him down so quickly, the winning margin flattered Marwong. I reckon if Harris had ridden the ears of poetic, he would have won by 10 lengths. They would never have overturned that decision if that had happened. The fact that the margin was less than that of the interference, the Stewards upheld the protest. It was a disgrace. But no more than that of Manikato v Karaman in the Caul Guineas. They bumped on the turn and Manikato was just too strong for Karaman. A protest was lodged and the Owner of Karaman was the Chairman of the Race Club. It was dismissed but poor old Gary Willitts got (I think) 6 months suspension ! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdytdy 5,335 Report post Posted February 22, 2016 Turning in, Gary Murphy on Karaman had Manikato and Gary Willets trapped in a pocket on the fence behind the two leaders and to get out Gary Willetts was going to have to ease back and come to the outside of Karaman which meant giving Karaman a start. Manikato was 16.3 hands and built like a brick shithouse and Gary Willetts just came out and pushed Karaman sideways and off balance and took off. Karaman balanced up and took ground off Manikato but was two lengths behind at the line. Murphy lodged a protest which was dismissed , however Gary Willetts was given a three month disqualification for foul riding. He appealed and was given a three month suspension for improper riding. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jefferson 207 Report post Posted February 22, 2016 23 hours ago, rdytdy said: Three of the worst decisions in Australia, all going against the Kiwi's. Poetic Prince, The Jewel and He's Remarkable. Don't forget the Melbourne Cup scratching of Kiwi, Jimmy's book out later this year will cover that travisty. The He's Remarkable decision was fraud at best. Decisions like that need to go to a panel in say the UK where country of residence doesn't come in to it. He's Remarkable would be a Group 1 winner and may have stood for more money. Speaking of Saturday's decision, I don't care where interference happens, if it costs then overturn. However if there is no choice, because they slam the brakes on (which I would outlaw for safety reasons by the way), then no protest. If stewards think that in a split second going 40 kms an hour on 530 kgs of animal when you have to take evasion action, going in not out is logical (yeah right), then I would suggest we put stewards on a horse and see how good they are. Another bad decision Saturday. Lloyd Vivian 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trump 2,741 Report post Posted February 22, 2016 Your knowledge is impeccable Ted. I was there that day and the best horse retained the race. But Willetts was treated a bit unfair with the foul riding bit. I think it may have been because Sir Maurice Nathan, the Chairman, was a bit peed off at not winning his Clubs premier 3yo race. Lloyd Vivian 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdytdy 5,335 Report post Posted February 22, 2016 Not as much as one former Chairman Lauchlan Kenneth Scobie Mackinnon whom the LKS Mackinnon Stakes is named after. He owned a very good 2yo colt called Carradale who won the 2yo Easter Stakes and among the beaten brigade in eleventh place was a horse called Phar Lap who was having his third unplaced start. MacKinnon of course had lofty thoughts for his colt as a 3yo especially in the Derbies. However, Phar Lap, a gelding came out and won the 1929 AJC Derby with Carradale finishing second and then Phar Lap won the VRC Derby with Carradale again finishing second. LKS MacKinnon obviously wasn't too pleased and talk quickly moved about geldings being able to take on colts in Derbies. With LKS a leading advocate but commencing in 1931 geldings were banned from racing in the VRC Derby against the colts and this went on until 1956 when geldings were allowed to compete again. biff, Jefferson and Lloyd Vivian 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trump 2,741 Report post Posted February 23, 2016 Isn't that still the case in the English Derby? No geldings or fillies allowed? I've always wondered why fillies are allowed to start in the NZ and Australian Derbies but colt can't start in the Oaks. If they are going to allow fillies to start why give them a weight advantage as well. It doesn't make sense Jefferson 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdytdy 5,335 Report post Posted February 23, 2016 1 hour ago, Trump said: Isn't that still the case in the English Derby? No geldings or fillies allowed? I've always wondered why fillies are allowed to start in the NZ and Australian Derbies but colt can't start in the Oaks. If they are going to allow fillies to start why give them a weight advantage as well. It doesn't make sense Geldings are excluded from the English derby but fillies are not. They get a 3lb allowance also. The last filly to win the Derby was Fifinella in 1916, 100 years ago. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOM(the other Molloy) 1,774 Report post Posted February 23, 2016 On 2/22/2016 at 10:00 PM, Gruff said: Maurita flattened one right in front of me at around the 200m at Ellerslie,the horses nose scraped the ground and the jockey did a great job staying on. Enquiry lasted 5 min. Well connected from Memory? But memorys a touch dicey that far back Buster O'Malley 'well connected'? He was a hell of a nice man(as were all his brothers) but I do not thing he had any inside lines or undue influence with the powers that be I think you might be exaggerating a bit there. Maybe a good judicial room operator may have made a difference but 'well connected'? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruff 2,778 Report post Posted February 24, 2016 7 hours ago, TOM(the other Molloy) said: Buster O'Malley 'well connected'? He was a hell of a nice man(as were all his brothers) but I do not thing he had any inside lines or undue influence with the powers that be I think you might be exaggerating a bit there. Maybe a good judicial room operator may have made a difference but 'well connected'? The Racecard showed 7 owners Tommy? Wrong horse? ...alzeihmers setting in by the look Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...