RaceCafe..#1...Tipsters Thread.... Share Your Fancies For Fun...Lets See Who The Best Tipsters Here Are.
We're Doomed

Kawi

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After all of the discussion about what is wrong with NZ racing and knocking of horses no one has mentioned Kawi's win. Pretty impressive I thought, did everything he had to do and won well. Didn't run away and hide as they say, but a win's a win. Very clever ride and possibly a horse that just does as much as he has to. No real excuse for the others all things considered.

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10 minutes ago, kakama said:

Good run alright, thought it might get run down 100m out, but was strong at the finish.

Yeah, those that dished the horse will be pretty quiet!

Funny thing, they asked trainer after race about negative feedback the horse got a few starts back, he said it wasn't the media, but others! 

Me thinks he gets on here!

I would have thought this was media, no? Perhaps a little more difficult to control and manipulate than the traditional forms?

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6 minutes ago, kakama said:

I think he meant it wasn't any trackside presenters or journalists.

If you think you are part of the media, good luck to you.

OK Kakama, maybe he and you need to recheck your dictionaries. This is the 21st century and I would consider social media to be media myself, whether or not that's what he meant. Frankly, I'd hardly consider Trackside presenters or most journalists to be media in any impartial sense anymore.

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Maybe I missed some posts, but I haven't seen many running the horse down on here.  Some negative comments about about the way he had been ridden.  Good performance today.

Trainers can get very emotional and sensitive when they get a really good horse.  It's quite normal.

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3 minutes ago, kakama said:

Your missing his point, he was saying it was not anyone in mainstream media dishing his horse, just outspoken types hiding behind a keyboard! Any idea who they where?

I don't think it matters if they were anonymous. Punters should be allowed to express negative opinions of horses when weighing up their bets.

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8 minutes ago, kakama said:

Your missing his point, he was saying it was not anyone in mainstream media dishing his horse, just outspoken types hiding behind a keyboard! Any idea who they where?

No, and who said they were hiding and so what? The word is dissing.

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I don't think anyone was really ever knocking the horse. It is more that some people with reasonable experience in racing get sick of those who over hype every promising type that comes along. It was never the horse that was being knocked, nor the connections. My policy has always been to let the horse go about its business and prove itself. I would say Kawi is doing just that. And the trainer will know when it is ready to take the next big step.

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Good win by Kawi but he can thank his lucky stars Turn Me Loose wasn't there. He has bigger fish to fry.

The stable mate Sports Illustrated was less than a length behind Kawi at the finish (and she was one run short) and she wouldn't get near Turn Me Loose. Kawi would have found out the second day at Hastings but the meeting was abandoned. Big Red can thank the fact that he got his bets refunded that day. They would have been losers otherwise  :)  

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4 minutes ago, rdytdy said:

Good win by Kawi but he can thank his lucky stars Turn Me Loose wasn't there. He has bigger fish to fry.

The stable mate Sports Illustrated was less than a length behind Kawi at the finish (and she was one run short) and she wouldn't get near Turn Me Loose. Kawi would have found out the second day at Hastings but the meeting was abandoned. Big Red can thank the fact that he got his bets refunded that day. They would have been losers otherwise  :)  

Excuses excuses , TML can thank the handicapper for getting a start in the race at Hastings would of ,could of ,should of . 

I recall the trainer of Kawi saying he wasn't screwed down for the 1st leg at Hastings but still was too good for them, he also mentioned yesterday that he was vulnerable and only really does what he has to to win a race so I wouldn't be taking too much notice of margins. 

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18 minutes ago, rdytdy said:

In what way vulnerable yesterday? The SW & P benefited him. He reckoned he was spot on, "He's terrific' 1600m is his best distance, Stepping down from 2000m not a problem. He's very well". etc etc.  

 

After the race he mentioned he would be spot on for the Herbie Dyke and that was the race yesterday he felt if he was going to get beat it was yesterday something along those lines.

Sports Illustrated was supposed to be flying yesterday as well according to Trainer and the horses jockey so can't see how you can claim she was under done but Kawi wasn't?

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24 minutes ago, rdytdy said:

In what way vulnerable yesterday? The SW & P benefited him. He reckoned he was spot on, "He's terrific' 1600m is his best distance, Stepping down from 2000m not a problem. He's very well". etc etc.  

 

Looked to me like SW&P benefited a lot of horses, yesterday Kawi had to give SD an extra 1.5kg on their last start, Addictive Habit a kilo so how did the SW&P race only benefit Kawi? 

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8 minutes ago, Huey said:

Looked to me like SW&P benefited a lot of horses, yesterday Kawi had to give SD an extra 1.5kg on their last start, Addictive Habit a kilo so how did the SW&P race only benefit Kawi? 

Kawi 112

Stolen Dance 102 ( sex adjusted 98 )

Sports Illustrated 98 ( sex adjusted 94 )

In a handicap Kawi gives SD 7 kilos, and SI 9 kilos.

Yesterday he gave them both 4 kilos, so he was 3 & 5 kg better off respectively under the SW&P conditions.

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1 minute ago, Midget said:

Kawi 112

Stolen Dance 102 ( sex adjusted 98 )

Sports Illustrated 98 ( sex adjusted 94 )

In a handicap Kawi gives SD 7 kilos, and SI 9 kilos.

Yesterday he gave them both 4 kilos, so he was 3 & 5 kg better off respectively under the SW&P conditions.

Yes but like the start before that was not the conditions of the race, I assume every trainer knew the race was a SW&P race before nominating their respective horses? I can't see the logic here is everyone surprised he was better off at SW&P and only want to compare it to how they would have been in  a Handicap race, cause in most cases he is worse off at SW&P than WFA  and from memory wasn't this race SW&P last year as well?

Perhaps its just good placement by the trainer who won the race?

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Start before was WFA, and you're correct in saying all trainers know the conditions of the race when they nominate.

SW&P races are becoming more common, arguably they attract the better horses because you don't usually get weighted on your rating, but rather on what black type races you've won in the last twelve months.

The inescapable fact is that SW&P suits him, from memory he's won a G3, G2, & three G1s now, and he's rated 112 so he's thrown in with 59kg, but that's racing, and just because someone says he was favoured by the conditions it doesn't mean they're insulting the horse does it ?

You're correct about the trainer's good placement of the horse.

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22 minutes ago, Midget said:

Start before was WFA, and you're correct in saying all trainers know the conditions of the race when they nominate.

SW&P races are becoming more common, arguably they attract the better horses because you don't usually get weighted on your rating, but rather on what black type races you've won in the last twelve months.

The inescapable fact is that SW&P suits him, from memory he's won a G3, G2, & three G1s now, and he's rated 112 so he's thrown in with 59kg, but that's racing, and just because someone says he was favoured by the conditions it doesn't mean they're insulting the horse does it ?

You're correct about the trainer's good placement of the horse.

No it doesn't mean they are insulting the horse ,but I never said that . But does surmising if so and so horse was in the race or if the race was run under certain conditions or on another planet show any respect to the winner?

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16 minutes ago, Huey said:

No it doesn't mean they are insulting the horse ,but I never said that . But does surmising if so and so horse was in the race or if the race was run under certain conditions or on another planet show any respect to the winner?

The answer is probably a pineapple with a side of vaseline

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On 23/01/2016 at 9:06 PM, We're Doomed said:

After all of the discussion about what is wrong with NZ racing and knocking of horses no one has mentioned Kawi's win. Pretty impressive I thought, did everything he had to do and won well. Didn't run away and hide as they say, but a win's a win. Very clever ride and possibly a horse that just does as much as he has to. No real excuse for the others all things considered.

Great win (and ride) by Kawi and the 2 best horses again first and second. In the Group 1's we want to see the best at the sharp end of the results. Just like Usain Bolt at the Olympics in the 100m & 200m, that is what the punters come out of trees to see, the Kawi's and Stolen Dance quinella's not much better to see in NZ. Can't wait for the next outing and clash of these two. 

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By Crickey, I got some stick...and deserved it!

The mates I went with, were all over Kawi, and expected a 2 horse war! and I ended up in the stolen dance camp sunday morning (saving face)

We have been exchanging banter for a long time now, since I took a shine to Addictive Habit, hoping he could emulate Roughy,s deeds...

As soon as Kawi swept on by roundind the turn and into the straight, I was left to admire and acknowledge the fact, they may well, be right

(We have a last bet, who between the two horses will have the most prize money, come Christmas (hoping for paddock spell and maybe Straddie win)

Thats about my only chance,but have to admit, I thought Kawi was vulnerable at distance and in that field (but the mates just kept laughing at me and saying

it would have won the Hastings triple crown, face it, its a champ...now they,ve just about got me ...1 race away!

Alan Sharrock a top bloke and trainer...that was a master plan and ride from leith, (and/or the pair) and stolen dance given a tough run, couldn,t make up

the lee-way,...Leith still had a bit of horse up his sleeve at the post (I was right there at ground level) in Georgies words, Herbie Dyke...lets bring it on!    

 

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Why is Sharrock so soft regarding public opinion? Better your horse be discussed than overlooked, Kawi is the best current horse racing in NZ and like all dominant horses at short odds the public can discuss his vulnerabilities at length, that is racing and that is sport. The guy is a sulker if you ask me and he wasn't outspoken about the dodgy Shez Sinsational ownership debacle a couple of years back..funny that. 

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I'm pretty sure he had his fair share to say over the Shez Sinsational incident so not sure your mail is on the lolly there.

Probably one of the most underrated trainers in the country and there is no doubting he knows a good horse have a look at what he has trained,also a fantastic talent at spotting up and coming jockeys have a look at his record there also, stable is on absolute fire this season - can't wait till Kawi gets to Aus!

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