Stud Fees - 2015

[mr_gee 417]

New stallion for White Robe LodgeMon, 25 May 2015

 

NZ Racing Desk

Well-bred Group Two winner Ghibellines is the new addition to White Robe Lodge's stallion roster.

 

A lengthy search for the ideal addition to the White Robe Lodge stallion roster has ended successfully.

The leading South Island farm’s patience has been rewarded with their dream signing of the well-related Group Two winner Ghibellines.

The rising four-year-old is a lightly-raced son of the international Group One winner and producer Shamardal, sire of the Hong Kong champion Able Friend, in a deal brokered by the respected Auckland bloodstock agent Michael Otto.

“We’ve been looking for a horse like this for a long time,” studmaster Wayne Stewart said.

“He was secured for us by Michael, who also got Yamanin Vital for the stud many years ago.

“Ghibellines is a magnificent looking type out of one of Australia’s best families and he’s got the race record as well.”

His dam is the Gr. 1 AJC Sires’ Produce Stakes winner Camarilla, a daughter of Elusive Quality, who has a perfect record at stud with all four of her foals to race have having been successful.

Ghibellines is a half-brother to the crack filly Guelph, the Group One winner of the ATC Sires’ Produce Stakes, Champagne Stakes, Flight Stakes and the 1000 Guineas, and the winners Dazzler and Inner Circle, also a Group performer.

Out of the Gr. 1 Queensland Derby winner Camarena, Camarilla is a sister to the Listed Geelong Classic winner and Gr. 1 VRC Derby runner-up Induna and a blood sister to the former champion two and three-year-old colt Sepoy. 

Sepoy has made a sensational start to his stud career and created history at this year’s Sydney Easter Sale when his colt sold for A$1.6 million, a record price for a yearling by a first season sire sold at public auction in Australia. 

Also featuring in the family is the Gr. 1 Golden Slipper winner and influential stallion Canny Lad. 

“Ghibellines has got a fantastic pedigree and it’s a great opportunity for breeders to access a horse of his standing,” Stewart said.

Lightly tried with only eight starts, Ghibelline’s career best performance came in the Gr. 2 Todman Slipper Trial in which he defeated the Magic Millions Classic winner Unencumbered.

He was also placed at Listed level in the Canonbury Stakes and the Breeders’ Plate from Peter Snowden’s stable before he finished third in the Gr. 2 Danehill Stakes after joining John O’Shea.  

Ghibellines will stand at an introductory fee in 2015 of $5,000 plus GST at the Anderton family’s successful Mosgiel operation alongside Gallant Guru and Raise The Flag.

[Swynford 121]

Congratulations to these guys for bringing in a stallion. So much goes in to it and lots of risk for all concerned.

 

Love to see him crossed with Redoute's Choice mares or mares by a stallion who is a son of Redoute's, Choice

 

Creates a double of Danehill and also this stallions female line right in he middle of the pedigree. 

[Swynford 121]

I believe that line breeding in this area of the pedigree is the most productive

[Swynford 121]

nice pedigree

[nek minute 296]

nice pedigree

how does the average joe get these pedigree pages??

[mr_gee 417]

 

Totara Park Stud   has  got pure  champion  5k  

[Swynford 121]

how does the average joe get these pedigree pages??

 

    nek minute.....plenty of free stuff here http://www.championsbydesign.com.au  

[Swynford 121]

Will try again http://www.championsbydesign.com.au

[Huey 2,037]

$7.5k for El Roca

[fitzy 143]

^{El Roca is a quality horse very unlucky not to wine a group1 or two.}

^{Looks good value at $7,5k, Aussies will rate his stock i think.}

[ADM 225]

Where is El Roca going to stand?

[Huey 2,037]

Where is El Roca going to stand?

Westbury Stud

[Huey 2,037]

Appears a good way to get support:

 

Westbury Stud have announced a special deal for breeders looking to support recently retired Group I performer El Roca. 
 

El Roca

The son of Fastnet Rock stands at $7500 plus GST with a Live Foal Guarantee and payment is not required until 1 June 2016.

Those that breed to El Roca in year one can look forward to a half price service fee in year two and a free service in years three and four respectively.

"The aim of this scheme is to offer breeders some relief if they breed a filly and to allow them the chance to breed a couple of colts at an economical cost," Westbury Stud's Sales Manager Gareth Smith said. -  NZ Racing Desk

[fitzy 143]

Thats an exceptional deal for someone looking to breed to race.

[puha 2,177]

In year two do you have to send Two mares and the second one us half the fee or is it send one mare and she's half the fee?

[Huey 2,037]

In year two do you have to send Two mares and the second one us half the fee or is it send one mare and she's half the fee?

Reads to me like youre only sending one which is half price in Y2 as the deal is based on one per year.

[Irishbay 18]

Congratulations to these guys for bringing in a stallion. So much goes in to it and lots of risk for all concerned.

 

Love to see him crossed with Redoute's Choice mares or mares by a stallion who is a son of Redoute's, Choice

 

Creates a double of Danehill and also this stallions female line right in he middle of the pedigree. 

Those Fast n Famous mares may suit ;-)

[Irishbay 18]

.

[classic one 12]

I enjoy reading this forum and others.

Thoroughbred Village Fourm on breeding has the following stats on inbreeding to Danehill as at May 2015

2,881 Foals of racing age

1,245 Starters

546 Winners

28 Stakes winners

That is a poor 1% SW to foals of racing age.

So could someone explain why they think this proven poor cross is a good cross.

We have a large amount of data rather than a small one to make our analysis on.

I have also checked other various sites and they show the same poor result.

While we can point out the success of a particular cross we must also look at a 99% that are not.

Let's see what some breeders think.

[Swynford 121]

Totally agree with those stats Classic One, was the same when people discussed inbreeding to Sir Tristram. To me its more about the structure of the pedigree and the position in the pedigree where these duplications occur.

 

After twenty odd years of research I still believe that the stallions and his sire have a bias or soft spot to their female side and the mares are the opposite and have a bias or soft spot to their male side.

 

The pedigree below is by far the best horse that this stallion sired, had a full brother that may not of preformed for some reason but great odds

 

[Swynford 121]

[classic one 12]

I agree on the power of the sex balanced cross and have enjoyed reading expert Ken Mclean's "Designing Speed in the racehorse".

 

Sometimes a comment on a particular cross must be expanded fully rather than a brief comment as to not confuse the beginner breeder and I agree with Swynford on his expanded comments.

 

Progeny from Danehill sire line stallions over Danehill sireline mares clearly has not worked.

 

This is not the same as Danehill through a son and Danehill through a daughter, a sex balanced cross which Synford has shown in the two pedigrees examples above.

 

Shootoff,the first one has Sir T through a son and daughter,  and Nijinsky through a son and daughter. 

 

Astaire, the second example has Danehill through a son and daughter, and Kahyasi through two daughters.

[optical 41]

Hi Classic One, Just reading your post there about Danehill cross. It obviously is a very poor ratio of SW to starters it is even alarming the winners to foals ratio and winners to starters as poor comparing to a modern day successful stallion in Pins. Maybe i'm not comparing apples with apples. Would you have other data available like the Danehill over Zabeel? or other crosses?

Obviously, we get told how good crosses are and what stakes winners they bring but are there tangible figures to go with this that are available on the internet like the ones you have produced about the Danehill inbreeding? 

[optical 41]

Has anyone seen any of the new stallions, in particular Prosir and has Charm Spirit arrived? Be interested to get intel on what type they are. 

[Huey 2,037]

Has anyone seen any of the new stallions, in particular Prosir and has Charm Spirit arrived? Be interested to get intel on what type they are. 

I haven't seen Charm Spirit , but did see Proisir at the stallion parade and he was a bit bigger than I expected, I'm not going to string you along with confirmation related adjectives about him being athletic or him looking like he could sire early maturing stock etc ,but he looks every show to me.