RaceCafe..#1...Tipsters Thread.... Share Your Fancies For Fun...Lets See Who The Best Tipsters Here Are.
Mannix

Whats happened to the Stakemoney ??

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If Industry stakeholders are happy with the stake money on offer on Sunday at the Counties meeting then we all need shooting.

Are we going that bad that Maidens race for $6000 while the R80 horses race for $7000 !!!

Someone is having a laugh here surely !

It's not only Counties , this seems to be the norm at all Northern Clubs, Waipa today included.

How anyone can justify 2 and 3 win horses chasing 62.5% of a $7000 Stake is beyond me.

If this is where the Industry is at,then I don't hold out much hope for it.

It seems standard that R70 races provide a stake of $6500 and R80 races $7000.

If everyone is happy with this then Good Luck to you I say.

How hard is it to win ONE race, let alone go up a Grade and race for another $500.00 !!

Ludicrous

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If Industry stakeholders are happy with the stake money on offer on Sunday at the Counties meeting then we all need shooting.

Are we going that bad that Maidens race for $6000 while the R80 horses race for $7000 !!!

Someone is having a laugh here surely !

It's not only Counties , this seems to be the norm at all Northern Clubs, Waipa today included.

How anyone can justify 2 and 3 win horses chasing 62.5% of a $7000 Stake is beyond me.

If this is where the Industry is at,then I don't hold out much hope for it.

It seems standard that R70 races provide a stake of $6500 and R80 races $7000.

If everyone is happy with this then Good Luck to you I say.

How hard is it to win ONE race, let alone go up a Grade and race for another $500.00 !!

Ludicrous

i know its a sunday meeting

so here is sundays harness stakes.

$8000 Non winners

$9000, 1 TO 2 WINS

$10000, 2 OR MORE WINS

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We have a filly who has won a group 2 and placed in various group 3 and listed races and have slid back down the ratings band this season due to some poor luck in feature group 1's. The other day we raced in a 75 rating race which we won and the total stake on offer was 7k. Thats simply not good enough and has certainly confirmed by position that I wont race another horse in NZ. Having lived in Singapore and now in Sydney, I have seen how these racing models work and they put NZ's to shame. I cant quite understan how NZ will continue to attract serious racehorse owners

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:cool:

..you negative thing:tcheek:

turnovers will fall behind..having dropped relatively, eversince ch36 became wall-to-wall 2weeks ago., to exemplify and opitomise the usary And citizen disdain 'the tent', T.A.B. and TRACKSIDE designers...Have for their lifeblood clientel.,

..still Nothing!...about what's to become 'the outcome sum-total' of the televising of N.Z. or AUSTRALIS racing., obviously SKY'll be standing-on, but just what's to happen Here.? !!

..does Racing...even deserve punters., because these people will Not become Gamblers!

..clearly, the owning quotient is another liberty taken for granted.

All that chat on another thread about Clubs' treatment of people, depicts the sheer disrespect Entirely..for punters OFF-course! . .observe the massive gulf between the two as 'poles' or 'the polarity' !!

TentSpokesperson..shows the wanton usary hypocracy and 'elite deserving' that the business corporate tent-type thinks they're Owed!...and that's an industry permiation too. :rolleyes:

Watch the drop in turnover from ch36's bastardising..from wanton Liars, be put down to the economy Again! . .going forward

between the-Tent and NATIONAL, impending decimation and buy-out / bail-out..visa vi . .monopolyships..is what you all support and've mandated.

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Its elitist to say the least. You've got to have a lot of spare cash to race a horse in NZ. Try Singapore instead.

Does it cost to race a horse in Singapore then Juno?

Im getting more than a little weary of supplying NZTR with a product to bet on at my own expense.

Sorry Trainer, I realise you do as much as you can to keep costs down for your valuable and decreasing band of owners, but it is just becoming harder and harder to justify sitting at the table.

Did I hear GST is going up also...........Sheeezus, anyone want to buy a big yearling filly by Shinko King from a 4 win mare??

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Recently there has been a deal of discussion about the One Racing concept, which has been brought about by the need to streamline management and create greater efficiencies - so we must assume - and we must also be aware that the imminent loss of pokie money is going to hit the industry hard.

The recession that we were supposed to be in, that we are now apparently climbing out of, has also obviously had a negative impact on stakes.

Given that the three codes are funded by the NZRB, why,then, do Harness Racing NZ seem to manage the situation better?

Over all the chat about necessary savings and the problems facing the industry, desired governance changes etc., has anyone thought about looking at the Harness model and maybe implementing some of the practices?

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the Singapore racing website gives a great rundown on the prizemoney and how it works but is silent on costs. I can't imagine it's cheap but what do training and vet bills come to?

Thanks for that. Had a look on there at the prizemoney, and just for a maiden race, the stake money is 35k Singapore dollars (roughly 33k NZD), and it goes up from there.

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the only way to get stakes levels up is to have a good ONCOURSE turnover.

the club gets its best percentage that way so we all need to get ourselves and our mates back to the track and punt there rather than staring at a screen.

you can fire a gun thru the stand at most gallop or harness meets these days, particularly in the winter, and with the pokie trusts gone clubs cannot pay the same stakes as say 5 years ago.

support your club, get to the track!

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the only way to get stakes levels up is to have a good ONCOURSE turnover.

the club gets its best percentage that way so we all need to get ourselves and our mates back to the track and punt there rather than staring at a screen.

you can fire a gun thru the stand at most gallop or harness meets these days, particularly in the winter, and with the pokie trusts gone clubs cannot pay the same stakes as say 5 years ago.

support your club, get to the track!

Whether you go to the track or not makes little difference at the end of the day (F&B aside) considering it must all come from the finite TAB profit - no matter how it is split between higher on-course and lower off-course percentages.

Pretty much never have we had such high TAB turnover and such low stakes in relative terms.

And look at the pathetic offerings at the so-called Waikato "Premier" meeting this Sat.

Stakes for 80% of the 10 races are 20k or less (15k and 10k in two cases)!! How do such bush-meeting stakes levels equate with a Premier status meeting?? That does not equate with even mid-week racing in Aussie.

The number of horses who will win a Premier race are few, and yet even those lucky ones will still only clear $10,265 after Trainer and jockey commissions.

Then you can deduct GST on the deductions (a stupid arrangement if ever you have seen one, given it is compulsory prize pool splitting and not services rendered) and, less $2,000 or more again for the month's training, less a further sum for vets, transport and other bills.

A complete joke!!

Heavens knows why horse sales values were up this year. Their true value is probably negative in most cases - they are a liability based on our current stakes levels.

And to make it worse, the owner of a maiden horse who might look a winning chance can't even recoup any losses through a decent fixed odds bet as the TAB is too gutless most of the time to offer them.

Lets face it, if they only broke even on maiden races, at least they would be providing a necessary service and allowing some of the turnover to be returned directly to owners (rather than having owners starved of funding, awaiting profits after high TAB salaries and other costs have first been deducted).

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Here's the gen on foreign owners racing a horse in Singapore:

* You don't have to be a special member, as in HK.

*Training - $2,500 per month

*Vet - $300 per month (estimated)

*Spelling - $1,700 when necessary

*Quarantine Charges - $1,425 (2 weeks)

*Owner's fee - $570 p.a.

The estimated training fee is about $30K per annum.

However, for each start the horse makes, the jockey club puts $1000 towards your training fees!

Combine that with a minimum stake of $35,000, and if you have a decent horse, you're on to a winner. Also, comparative to the number of races available, the pool of horses is quite small, so winning a race isn't so hard.

You do need to be careful though that your trainer is trustworthy when racing a horse so far away from home.

Here's a contact for anyone wanting more info: shari_ho@turfclub.com.sg

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Whether you go to the track or not makes little difference at the end of the day (F&B aside) considering it must all come from the finite TAB profit - no matter how it is split between higher on-course and lower off-course percentages.

Pretty much never have we had such high TAB turnover and such low stakes in relative terms.

And look at the pathetic offerings at the so-called Waikato "Premier" meeting this Sat.

Stakes for 80% of the 10 races are 20k or less (15k and 10k in two cases)!! How do such bush-meeting stakes levels equate with a Premier status meeting?? That does not equate with even mid-week racing in Aussie.

The number of horses who will win a Premier race are few, and yet even those lucky ones will still only clear $10,265 after Trainer and jockey commissions.

Then you can deduct GST on the deductions (a stupid arrangement if ever you have seen one, given it is compulsory prize pool splitting and not services rendered) and, less $2,000 or more again for the month's training, less a further sum for vets, transport and other bills.

A complete joke!!

Heavens knows why horse sales values were up this year. Their true value is probably negative in most cases - they are a liability based on our current stakes levels.

And to make it worse, the owner of a maiden horse who might look a winning chance can't even recoup any losses through a decent fixed odds bet as the TAB is too gutless most of the time to offer them.

Lets face it, if they only broke even on maiden races, at least they would be providing a necessary service and allowing some of the turnover to be returned directly to owners (rather than having owners starved of funding, awaiting profits after high TAB salaries and other costs have first been deducted).

So true.

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And on top of this Don, there is a rumour going around that the additional $6 million that the NZ Racing board have allocated to all codes, $3 million which was going to go into galloping for stakemonies, a major chunk of this may be going to the Hawkes Bay JC to assist with their financial situation after their well known sponsors never fronted up for their share of their two major races!

Anybody got any info on this?

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I hear that Stoneybridge never paid from a couple of years ago. Would certainly explain why there has been no urgency shown with that money. Ironic really the stakes for those races are in large part funded by the owners and if you're a month late paying those fees you're straight on the black list in the NZTR monthly!

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And on top of this Don, there is a rumour going around that the additional $6 million that the NZ Racing board have allocated to all codes, $3 million which was going to go into galloping for stakemonies, a major chunk of this may be going to the Hawkes Bay JC to assist with their financial situation after their well known sponsors never fronted up for their share of their two major races!

Anybody got any info on this?

Heard something along those lines quite some time ago...

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And on top of this Don, there is a rumour going around that the additional $6 million that the NZ Racing board have allocated to all codes, $3 million which was going to go into galloping for stakemonies, a major chunk of this may be going to the Hawkes Bay JC to assist with their financial situation after their well known sponsors never fronted up for their share of their two major races!

Anybody got any info on this?

Thats all we need, heavens, lets hope its just a rumour.

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When it costs up to $2000 a month to have a racehorse in work why does can it feel like a nightmare?

Surely we are'nt racing for $6000 in stakes in the year 2110?:\

Why if supplying the product aren't race day starters payed?

Who else turns up for work for nothing or even worse leaves owing hundreds!

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This TAB of ours is now a complete joke in my eyes (concerned more about turnover, than stakes which feed everything).

Not only are owners being asked to race for peanuts on a Premier Day such as Waikato this Sat, but, on the very same day profits which owners have helped create are being squandered and throw into the punters quaddie purse!!

Reportedly, $100,000 is being thrown away as seed money.

Had these existing profits been attributed directly towards stakes (as rightfully should have happened) the 8 support races could all have been increased by $12,500 each. This would at least see a reasonable level of stakes for a Premier day.

While I understand the TAB needs to support a relatively new betting product, the TAB should instead guarantee the pool to $100,000 not seed it and thus lock in a loss of $100,000 of owner's stake money.

How much more of owner profits is going to be directed away from stakes in the hope of making a little more profit in the future (that might also be directed away from stakes even in the future - once the next hairbrain idea surfaces)?

Obviously profits for stakes have already been made through owner investments enough to fund a decent stakes level, so stop throwing that money away. Give it back to the owners now!!

My God, how this racing Act needs a shake up with code-specific governance and revenue streams being an absolute must (along with leadership KPIs tied to stakes increases as opposed to TAB turnover).

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Guest Bruce M

Don .the $100,00 is jackpotted punters money from quaddies which weren't struck in January.

As a punter I want this money to be returned to punters not transferred into stakes.

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Don .the $100,00 is jackpotted punters money from quaddies which weren't struck in January.

As a punter I want this money to be returned to punters not transferred into stakes.

Listen Bruce, you don't understand the terms of reference regarding this issue and the actual wording of the debate. Don't even suggest Don has his facts wrong here, we all know now, he is the self declared winner of all racing debates and the fountain of knowledge on all things punting along with his intellectual teammates.

Just watch, the Team A cheerleader will be on soon, once the bell goes for play time and he's finished his packet of raisuns, to back up Don on this matter.

Consider yourself told off Bruce!

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