Te Rapa Group 1s

[We're Doomed]

Once again the Te Rapa sprint has better quality noms than the Dyke, as it does most years.

I always find it strange that the 2,000m race runs for $700,000, whereas the sprint goes for $500,000. For several years the International Stakes, as it was originally called, has had a $200,000 higher stake.

The Lion Brown sprint, as many of us know it, has had numerous high class winners over the years, from March Legend, Courier Bay, Poetic Prince, Veandercross, Sunline, Tavistock and in more recent times Imperatriz, even the high class Southern mare Final Touch.

The International stakes has also had many fine winners, notably Commissionaire three times and Bonecrusher.

However the disparity in stakes has always seemed to be a real anomaly.

Currently NZTR puts $545,000 into the Dyke and $490,000 into the sprint. The club puts $155,000 into the Dyke and $10,000 into the sprint. Presumably Herbie left them some money to fund this.

Surely it would make some sense for NZTR to take $100,000 of their money and put it into the sprint and run both races for $600,000. 

It does make you wonder whether owners of high class sprinters feel disadvantaged with anomalies such as this.

[PKR]

2 hours ago, We're Doomed said:

Once again the Te Rapa sprint has better quality noms than the Dyke, as it does most years.

I always find it strange that the 2,000m race runs for $700,000, whereas the sprint goes for $500,000. For several years the International Stakes, as it was originally called, has had a $200,000 higher stake.

The Lion Brown sprint, as many of us know it, has had numerous high class winners over the years, from March Legend, Courier Bay, Poetic Prince, Veandercross, Sunline, Tavistock and in more recent times Imperatriz, even the high class Southern mare Final Touch.

The International stakes has also had many fine winners, notably Commissionaire three times and Bonecrusher.

However the disparity in stakes has always seemed to be a real anomaly.

Currently NZTR puts $545,000 into the Dyke and $490,000 into the sprint. The club puts $155,000 into the Dyke and $10,000 into the sprint. Presumably Herbie left them some money to fund this.

Surely it would make some sense for NZTR to take $100,000 of their money and put it into the sprint and run both races for $600,000. 

It does make you wonder whether owners of high class sprinters feel disadvantaged with anomalies such as this.

Tradition? Legacy? Maybe not handing any increased pot to the Aussie raiders.  We'll see.

[nomates]

This just shows how entrenched NZTR are in their narrow thinking , they haven't got an original idea in the building , this imbalance has been stuck in place for years and no one at NZTR has the intellectual fortitude to ask why and think to change things up .

To be honest that field for the HD is embarrassing for the 700k stake , thank God Australia has loaned us the 2 favorites , saying that how the F@#K can a horse that has only run in benchmark races in Aus be 2nd fav , WTF does that say about our horses ???

Wake the fuck up NZTR , and all those smart boys on the board and the special panel of racing experts , you are making a mockery of NZ racing by standing by and twiddling your thumbs . C'mon guys start earning your dough .

NZ racing needs a RESET !!

[nomates]

9 minutes ago, PKR said:

Tradition? Legacy? Maybe not handing any increased pot to the Aussie raiders.  We'll see.

Well they're likely to take the increased pot in the HD so six of one , six of the other .

Very good chance that the raiders take the thick end of both races home .

But our industry leaders will consider that a success .

[We're Doomed]

And it is a very good example that the actual stake has only limited impact on the quality of the field. Based on the field for the sprint you would have to assume that the Dyke would have attracted exactly the same field for $500,000.

[We're Doomed]

19 minutes ago, nomates said:

This just shows how entrenched NZTR are in their narrow thinking , they haven't got an original idea in the building , this imbalance has been stuck in place for years and no one at NZTR has the intellectual fortitude to ask why and think to change things up .

To be honest that field for the HD is embarrassing for the 700k stake , thank God Australia has loaned us the 2 favorites , saying that how the F@#K can a horse that has only run in benchmark races in Aus be 2nd fav , WTF does that say about our horses ???

Wake the fuck up NZTR , and all those smart boys on the board and the special panel of racing experts , you are making a mockery of NZ racing by standing by and twiddling your thumbs . C'mon guys start earning your dough .

NZ racing needs a RESET !!

Too hard basket?

[nomates]

44 minutes ago, We're Doomed said:

Too hard basket?

That's the thing WD , it's fucken not , it takes will and imagination , plus a willing to work with a wider group of industry participants .

But if you live in the shadows you will never see the sun .

[uncleremus]

4 hours ago, We're Doomed said:

The International stakes has also had many fine winners, notably Commissionaire three times and Bonecrusher.

Couldn’t resist a bit of nostalgia checking on a bleak Wellington afternoon!

Horlicks ran 2^nd to Regal City (trained by Jim Gibbs) in the International Stakes on 14 February 1989, as a 5 yo mare, before going on to win the first of her two $1 million DB Draught Classics at Ellerslie on 4 March 1989.

Incredibly, she won the second DB Draught Classic on 3 March 1990 in her fresh up run, after winning both the Mackinnon Stakes and then the Japan Cup in November 1989!

If you want a real memory shot, go back a year to the late summer of 1988, when she finished 2^nd to Bonecrusher in a WFA 2000m at Ellerslie on 27 February 1988, won a 2000m WFA at Awapuni and then beat Bonecrusher at Ellerslie over 2000m again on 9 April 1988!  Not a bad 6 weeks of work!

As WD points out, Bonecrusher himself won the International Stakes in 1986 as a 3 yo, in a time of 1:59.59.

What do you think Horlicks and Bonecrusher would be paying on Saturday??

[nomates]

10 minutes ago, uncleremus said:

Couldn’t resist a bit of nostalgia checking on a bleak Wellington afternoon!

Horlicks ran 2^nd to Regal City (trained by Jim Gibbs) in the International Stakes on 14 February 1989, as a 5 yo mare, before going on to win the first of her two $1 million DB Draught Classics at Ellerslie on 4 March 1989.

Incredibly, she won the second DB Draught Classic on 3 March 1990 in her fresh up run, after winning both the Mackinnon Stakes and then the Japan Cup in November 1989!

If you want a real memory shot, go back a year to the late summer of 1988, when she finished 2^nd to Bonecrusher in a WFA 2000m at Ellerslie on 27 February 1988, won a 2000m WFA at Awapuni and then beat Bonecrusher at Ellerslie over 2000m again on 9 April 1988!  Not a bad 6 weeks of work!

As WD points out, Bonecrusher himself won the International Stakes in 1986 as a 3 yo, in a time of 1:59.59.

What do you think Horlicks and Bonecrusher would be paying on Saturday??

It would be a walk over , nobody else would turn up .

[elo]

42 minutes ago, nomates said:

 it takes will and imagination 

 

They tried that - - remember 'no commentators at the trials' 

[PKR]

1 hour ago, nomates said:

Well they're likely to take the increased pot in the HD so six of one , six of the other .

Very good chance that the raiders take the thick end of both races home .

But our industry leaders will consider that a success .

Looks likely - and far from the best in Australia! A month ago Kingsman was a evidently just a third rater. And the other one? Placed on Karaka night but I can't recall where. But let's not put the cart before the horse. We'll see.

[We're Doomed]

14 minutes ago, elo said:

They tried that - - remember 'no commentators at the trials' 

You can't blame them for trying. Not all ideas will work. Although to be honest, that is probably the first of their ideas that they have acknowledged may not have worked.

It might be worth getting George to call this week's meeting from home over the phone. Save a few dollars in travel costs, and no need to provide lunch.

[Demophon]

The pattern committee will be looking at group 1 status for Herbie Dyke. Not group 1 quality in my view.

[We're Doomed]

4 minutes ago, Demophon said:

The pattern committee will be looking at group 1 status for Herbie Dyke. Not group 1 quality in my view.

I think it is one of the protected ones.

Back in the day these two were probably NZ's top two WFA races, along with the Air NZ stakes. Not sure what that latter one is these days, either the Zabeel or the Bonecrusher.

[We're Doomed]

I'm surprised there hasn't been more discussion over that sprint at Te Rapa. At the moment it looks like possibly being the race of the season so far. Probably at least six genuine chances. It will be fascinating to see the return of Savaglee and Pier.

For the sake of NZ racing it is important the NZ horses stand up against the Aussie visitors.

[nomates]

42 minutes ago, We're Doomed said:

For the sake of NZ racing it is important the NZ horses stand up against the Aussie visitors.

We have been saying that for a couple of years now since the money went up for the big races and Aussies started sending their 2nd stringers , and winning with them .

Only one group doesn't find the correlation and continues to fund the pension fund for the owners of those horses .

We keep saying they need to start funding the lower grade races much better , but beware what we ask for , the Aussies would start sending their better country performed horses over to plunder our lower rated races , then everybody would be pissed .

[Demophon]

2 hours ago, We're Doomed said:

I'm surprised there hasn't been more discussion over that sprint at Te Rapa. At the moment it looks like possibly being the race of the season so far. Probably at least six genuine chances. It will be fascinating to see the return of Savaglee and Pier.

For the sake of NZ racing it is important the NZ horses stand up against the Aussie visitors.

Great race. Pier based on Australia performances in top company should be winning

 

[scooby3051]

17 minutes ago, Demophon said:

Great race. Pier based on Australia performances in top company should be winning

 

That will depend on the ride he gets...its no certainty.

[We're Doomed]

51 minutes ago, Demophon said:

Great race. Pier based on Australia performances in top company should be winning

 

Savaglee didn't do too bad in Australia in top company either. Pier wouldn't want to give Savaglee too big a head start at Te Rapa.

[Zakhu]

Personally I feel that Here to Shock went up too short. I thought Arkansaw Kid ran really well in the Railway, should settle in the first 3 or 4 and I'm expecting it to be leaderish at Te Rapa. Not sold about 1400m but I am with the rider. Don't think Here to Shock ran that at Pakenham last start when he won it in 2024.