Days Between Runs

[chiknsmack 629]

I'm just looking over the results at New Plymouth today and spotted a couple of oddities.

It's not often you see a horse first up after more than a thousand days off, but former decent hurdler Master Courtsman popped up in a R75 mile 1072 days after last beeing seen in the 2021 Grand National Steeples. They were obviously too quick for him today, but it'll be interesting to see where he goes from here. He's still a maiden steeplechaser so losing that status before the end of winter may be the plan.

At the other end of the spectrum, it's also not often you see a horse back up on consecutive days. Even when you do see horses back up with two or three days between runs at various carnivals, the distance between the tracks tends to be considerably less than 260km. Polite Society finished 13th of 14 in the Maiden 2000m at Matamata on Wednesday, then showed up again with an improved effort to run 6th of 12 in the Maiden 2000m at New Plymouth. No, he's not nominated for Saturday.

[Pete Lane 1,372]

7 hours ago, chiknsmack said:

I'm just looking over the results at New Plymouth today and spotted a couple of oddities.

It's not often you see a horse first up after more than a thousand days off, but former decent hurdler Master Courtsman popped up in a R75 mile 1072 days after last beeing seen in the 2021 Grand National Steeples. They were obviously too quick for him today, but it'll be interesting to see where he goes from here. He's still a maiden steeplechaser so losing that status before the end of winter may be the plan.

At the other end of the spectrum, it's also not often you see a horse back up on consecutive days. Even when you do see horses back up with two or three days between runs at various carnivals, the distance between the tracks tends to be considerably less than 260km. Polite Society finished 13th of 14 in the Maiden 2000m at Matamata on Wednesday, then showed up again with an improved effort to run 6th of 12 in the Maiden 2000m at New Plymouth. No, he's not nominated for Saturday.

I note Polite Society finished further behind the winner in its second run.

I'm struggling with the logic behind running a horse at Matamata and then floating it to New Plymouth for a run the next day.

Having said that, oldtimers like me can remember horses being run twice on the same day back in the 60s. I seem to remember a horse called Bostock did that and i know there were others.

[stodge 2,544]

It happens up here quite regularly especially at two day meetings. If a horse wins on day one and comes out the race well they can be asked to run on the second day under a penalty. That's particularly true of sprinters.

As for horses returning off long breaks, some can run very well and then not back up. MONKFISH was off 713 days from April 2021 to April 2023 - he reappeared in a Grade 2 hurdle at Fairyhouse and ran a fine second but three weeks later he was well beaten at Punchestown.

[Pete Lane 1,372]

On a slightly different subject there's a really interesting runner at Otaki tomorrow called Sioux Princess. She won three races at Dundalk - the last one at the end of last year. Looks like someone knows something as she's currently equal favourite.

All racing in Ireland but according to the LoveRacing formline she's 'back from racing in England' !

[Pete Lane 1,372]

https://www.irishracing.com/news/Ryan-doubles-up-aboard-Sioux-Princess/244035

[stodge 2,544]

Well, it looks like the same mare. She hasn't run in England but Ireland on the all weather at Dundalk and a few turf runs at places like Naas and Down Royal.. 

She won three of her last four on the Dundalk Polytrack and went up to 63 after her final win over 2400m. Not much turf form it has to be said. 

She's down as being owned by Paul Callan over here but on the TAB Racebook it's a joint ownership with one Francis Finnegan and the mare is trained by Samantha Finnegan (wife? sister?)

2100m may be a good trip on slow ground but how she will perform not having run since last December I've no clue. 

Thanks for spotting that, Pete.

 

[gubellini 4,594]

Pete Lane the last horse to run twice in one day in NZ was Trifox at Waterlea on the 12/5/2000. He ran fourth in R2 over 1000m ridden by Bruce Herd then won R5 over 1400m ridden by Lance Robinson. Trained by Peter Rudkin at Cambridge. Immediately after that Stipendiary Stewards banned any horse from racing twice in one day.

[gubellini 4,594]

Pete Lane yes many horses used to race twice in one day years ago. Remarkably a horse called Clockwork ran three times in one day at Tauranga on the 21/3/ 25- almost 100 years ago! He ran second beaten a head in R1 over 5f. He then won R5 over 6f by 3l then won R7 over 7f by a neck carrying a 10lb penalty. He was ridden in all three races by Thames jockey EO Tuohey. He was owned by Tauranga publican Tom Floyd.

[nomates 5,555]

25 minutes ago, gubellini said:

Pete Lane yes many horses used to race twice in one day years ago. Remarkably a horse called Clockwork ran three times in one day at Tauranga on the 21/3/ 25- almost 100 years ago! He ran second beaten a head in R1 over 5f. He then won R5 over 6f by 3l then won R7 over 7f by a neck carrying a 10lb penalty. He was ridden in all three races by Thames jockey EO Tuohey. He was owned by Tauranga publican Tom Floyd.

God I'd be pissed off if I had a 3 leg multi on him .

[Leggy 4,195]

As a kid I certainly remember open class horses running in both legs of the double 2 races apart, and placing in both. Winning both may have been achieved. And we have the likes of the remarkable Showgate running 3 times in a week at Cup time, all in black type races, with great success.

[Sayer 237]

Pete Lane, I remember Bostok. pretty sure I used to be able to take him to win both legs of the on-course double at Te Rapa

[crustyngrizzly 1,730]

BOSTOCK was his name and from memory was trained by someone with the surname of HILL.Used to line up at the old Kensington Park 2 day meeting Friday and Saturday in the good old days.

Phil Kempton rode him a few times from memory

[gubellini 4,594]

crustyngrizzly Bostock was trained by Frank Hill at Pukekohe. He won 13 races from 173 starts. He won four races at Whangarei. On the 21/3/70 at Whangarei he won R5 over 1.25m and ran third in R8 over 6f. Phil Kempton won 6 on him and John Riordan and Gary Alexander 2 each and Keith Aitken, Terry Midwood and Ray Cleaver 1 each.

[Pam Robson 1,918]

4 hours ago, Leggy said:

As a kid I certainly remember open class horses running in both legs of the double 2 races apart, and placing in both. Winning both may have been achieved. And we have the likes of the remarkable Showgate running 3 times in a week at Cup time, all in black type races, with great success.

AND off nine days work.

Stewards [ 6 fur ]    Canterbury Gold Cup ] mile and a quarter ]  and the Churchill Stakes [ mile ].

[Nerula 1,554]

Story for you?  ex NZTROF Owners Bulletin. Neil M

EXTRACTS RACING DAYS IN OLD PATEA – LARAINE SOLE

PATEA MAIL 23 FEBRUARY 1878

“For the second hack race there were nine starters. George’s Rob Roy winning with Russell’s grey Retire second. The grey, quite a pony was much fancied and considering that it had carried the owner from New Plymouth the day before and had been ridden from Hawera the same morning proved that the pony had “go” in it.

And Laraine writes –

PATEA NOVEMBER 1879.

There is a wonderful story told about the jockey who rode Hailstorm to victory in
the Patea Cup. A belated letter reached renowned jockey and landowner Duncan Campion on the morning before the Patea meeting offering him a ride on the good horse Hailstorm. Campion left his home Carnarvon at Bulls at midday and rode to Alex Higgie’s Blink Bonny on the No 2 line where he changed horses. After stopping for two hours he rode on and a tired pair arrived at Patea at 6am. He won the Patea Cup on Hailstorm, got beaten in another race on him, saw the racing out that day and rode to Wanganui reaching there at 10pm. He changed horses

again and reached Carnarvon at 3am having ridden over 170 miles- the actual travelling just under 27 hours. If he slept it would have been in the saddle. They were tough in those days!

AND FROM PAGE 54-55

Not everyone was enamoured with racing as evidenced in part of a letter to the Patea Mail of 20 April 1906 which read, ...on the day following the great Christian festival, a day set apart for rejoicing, the racecourse in nearly every town is thronged with a huge crowd of men and women with excited passion-waved faces all striving to worship Mammon. There was a time when women were scarce on the racecourse: that day is gone. The home-loving woman is fast going, the lusts of excitement, of the delights of the world, are in her blood. She is an habitue of the racecourse today,

is well versed in its slang and may even, on occasion, be seen with the jockey hoping that her fascinating smile will get her the coveted “tip.” With mothers, who thus frequent the racecourse, can we wonder that the modern daughter is not gifted with modesty that she is no longer sought but seeks.

The high church
dignitary is there
too, who but the
previous day was
reading the church
services. The
church members,
in fact, of nearly all
denominations, are
well represented.
The scene on the
Patea racecourse on
Monday was similar to many others where all sorts of conditions of men and women gathered eager for gain and pleasure. What the Maories (sic) who flock in full force to our local racecourse and grow hilarious

on the waipiro of which there is always a plentiful supply, think of our religion and practice only the dusky native himself knows. One thing is certain, civilisation is not tending to raise the Maori. The drink flows, curses abound, money is lost and won and the greatest Christian festival of joy and mirth is turned into a use that can have no other influence on men and women save that of degradation.

SPRING 2023 9

[gubellini 4,594]

Nerula they ran 8 races that day at Patea- Monday April 16, 1906. 

Results:

R1 Hurdles 1.5m - Rangiwhenua ridden by Boyd first- 8 ran

R2- 6f- Showman and B.Dalton first- 6 ran

R3- WFA 1m- Mooshen first and Mr NA Brown- 4 ran

R4- 1.25m- Slavey and C Matthews first- 5 ran

R5- 4.5f Rotoiti and C Cochrane first- 12 ran

R6- 7f Miss Lancelot and Stevens won- 6 ran

R7- 1m Nero and R Barlow won- 3 ran

R8- 4.5f Bagatelle and C Matthews first- 12 ran

Totalisator Investments £4,611

[Leggy 4,195]

2 hours ago, Pam Robson said:

AND off nine days work.

Stewards [ 6 fur ]    Canterbury Gold Cup ] mile and a quarter ]  and the Churchill Stakes [ mile ].

Missed in one the next year didn't she?

[Leggy 4,195]

Oh no, it was 2 years later. Grey Way beat her in the Stewards. She won the Gold Cup and ran second to Tonic Time in the Churchill.

Went on to win the Thames Valley Stakes, Timaru and Dunedin Gold Cups and run second in the Avondale Cup over a 17 day period the next month.

[Pam Robson 1,918]

In those days the Timaru and Dunedin Cups were on two consecutive days ....and I think the Dunedin Cup was first although i stand to be corrected there.

A mile and a half back to a mile the next day.

I was at Oamaru when I saw a smallish bay horse sporting red and white colours streaking down the straight in a maiden race. 

Little did I know what I had just witnessed. 

[We're Doomed 5,999]

19 minutes ago, Pam Robson said:

In those days the Timaru and Dunedin Cups were on two consecutive days ....and I think the Dunedin Cup was first although i stand to be corrected there.

A mile and a half back to a mile the next day.

I was at Oamaru when I saw a smallish bay horse sporting red and white colours streaking down the straight in a maiden race. 

Little did I know what I had just witnessed. 

Yes, 2,400m Dunedin Cup one day, 1,600m WFA Timaru Cup the next day.

[gubellini 4,594]

Show Gate won the 1976 Dunedin Cup ridden by Chris Ramage and the 1976 Timaru Cup ridden by Nick Harnett.

[We're Doomed 5,999]

There was another southern filly or mare did a similar thing a year or so later. Not such high quality races though. I think it won at Gore one day and then stopped off to win at Timaru on the way back to Riccarton the next day. The name escapes me for the moment. May even have been a 3yo filly.

[Leggy 4,195]

1 hour ago, gubellini said:

Show Gate won the 1976 Dunedin Cup ridden by Chris Ramage and the 1976 Timaru Cup ridden by Nick Harnett.

The following month, an unlucky second in the Wellington Cup for Chris Ramage and of course the fateful Trentham Stakes a week later for Bob Skelton. A very sad day.

 

[Leggy 4,195]

[Baz (NZ) 1,760]

Faded memory but as a kid I think I remember a horse called Little Vic winning on a Friday and backing up Saturday to win as well ?

gubellini may help clarify my memory?