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Agree Scooby but I have had enough and I am doing something about it. I have bought a yearling from Magic Millions the last 2 years and have bought several from Karaka plus I breed my own. I am firstly annoyed at the low level of stakes, it is absolutely pathetic. Owners are treated poorly. I am receiving $400 for my 2 horses after the Wanganui abandonment. What a joke. That will not even cover the Majestic's invoice. Everytime a meeting is abandoned we are told something is going to be done about it but we just seem to roll onto the next meeting and no one is ever made accountable. We race on tracks that should be closed, and we have tracks ( Foxton ) that should be utilised more, but because of a few self centered individuals who have their own agenda, they stop this happening. Why the hell do we not use Foxton more often, even just for trials and jumpouts instead of running on bog tracks like Otaki. What I have done is I am going to try my luck in Aussie. Sure training fees are higher but have a look at the stakemoney. Everyone can see them and they put our stakes to shame. A Gai Waterhouse or Chris Waller are twice the daily rate but all I have to do is get a syndicate, which I have done, and that problem is solved by distributing the training costs. For horses that are not quite up to City Racing I have contacted Mick Cornish and Donna Gaskin from Eucha, and they actually train for $65 per day and they travel anywhere. It is a 3-4 hour plane trip if we want to see our horse race, less than the time it takes for us to drive to some meetings, the facilities are unbelievable at the main Aussie tracks, owners are treated like royalty, and it is a great day out. Catering is more than the hot chips and hotdogs we get here. They just seem to do it right. I know some people are going to pick my thread to bits, but I have been racing here for nearly 20 years, have stayed loyal until now, but enough is enough.

Would have to agree with both your reasons I believe course managers have been whitewashed/brainwashed/forced into doing what some Turf professor that sits in an office believes is the right thing because his computer says so, We seem to have lost track with common sense , I remember an interview with Michael Pitman and Andre Neil? where Michael was asked ,What is the biggest problem in NZ Racing?: He said straight out "The Tracks!!" The watering/irrigation we use is stuffing our tracks? from memory he said along the lines of Trainers should be able to train horse for hard tracks they did 30 yrs ago no issue , Now days they demand a dead4 or no start!? So therefor clubs have to provide expensive irrigation systems to try and appease NZTR and trainers, Common sense would tell you that short burst of irrigation will bring the grass root system to the top of the ground instead of going downward to find water , Which in turn in my opinion gives a sort of Hard compaction of soil just beneath the root system because there is roots going through the dirt to keep it loose and aerated ?? That must be like having a carpet on a shiny varnished floor when any sort of rain comes on raceday?? I may be wrong but it just seems common-sense to me. I have been at Otaki just as an example where they have got a bit of rain on raceday and it looks like there is lumps of turf the size of dinner plate flying everywhere surely that's not normal or desired or safe?? .

Stafford "It's cool we have the same racing Minister. He gets it!" There's no re-education for a new minister" Gets what?? re-educate? FFS!!! Guy, go to Christchurch, Awapuni, Cambridge or Matamata training centres and talk to people there. Owners and trainers dividing their winning percentage for a $7000 race, while there too many employees at NZRB and with salaries that doesnt relate to the product.

Same old story... everyone moans and groans in here, but goes no further...Like the whole industry does. Keep whinging its still gonna keep happening.

CONGRATS to our winner Viceroy with a final tally of $4,125. Good effort also from runner-up Gaf1973 (Grant) who also made a healthy profit. Viceroy, post one selection on here next Saturday and I'll put a $50 multi on for us to share. Thanks to all who entered.

L.J. Shannon you are a breath of fresh air! In the old days a lot of the Clubs grazed sheep as well and strip grazed them on the course proper. This helped consolidate the tracks to such an extent that they always provided a safe surface regardless of weather conditions.

Interesting comments and I agree with all of you. Midget ,I must say I respect a high percentage of comments you make on here and look forward to your posts. When you watch racing from Flemington, Caulfield , Rosehill etc, everyone is dressed to the nines and are having fun, The stands are packed, the raceday presenters know what they are talking about and you actually want to listen to them. I cannot remember her name, but the girl who walks around the birdcage talking about the horses does an amazing job. Where do we get one of them from.? Instead we have Poppewell and Co talking about spected odds and carry forwards etc etc. At any track there is a minimal crowd, most, I say not all, are dressed like they are going to the local stock car meeting straight after the races and the only people having fun with smiles on their faces are the winning owners. The raceday presenters talk in their own language, Poppewell especially, Spected odds etc etc, and very rarely pick a winner. I have known Poppewell to pick up to 5 horses and still miss out. I know someone is going to stay , well you do better. Well I admit I cannot, so I do not do it. They should take my lead and stop trying to tip winners. Who decided that the presenters and race callers were experts in tipping winners.Gone are the days when we used to hear interesting facts like it was purchased at Karaka for x amount, bred by so and so and a bit of good interesting info about the horse. Now all we hear is how much it is paying and I would include it in my multis. Well if Poppewell practised what he preached, he'd be living off the streets. And why do we need to know what it is paying. It's on our screens the whole time because we cannot actually see our own horses in the birdcage or prelims or behind the barriers cause that stupid black screen is hiding them. That is another thing that bugs me. The blinds showing the dividends and not the horses. Aussie do it well. Trainers have gone over and all are doing well. Waller, Baker, and now the Busuttins. Tommy Hepinstall is there now and I am sure there will be more owners follow suit. Just syndicate your horses and the costs are easily manageable. Stakes last Saturday at Rosehill were $108,000 most races, Moonee Valley $86k, and Eagle Farm $64500 and $108k. And I am going to Ellerslie this Saturday for a $10,000 race if I can get in. I want a piece of what they are dishing up in Aussie cause we have been promised that for years now.

This performance makes Fawlty Towers look like a serious documentary. A triumph of spin over reality.

One thing I know is the stipes can intimidate young driver and at times put words or trick them into admitted to a charge, trouble is now you have stipes like nick ydgren , Scott wallis , Shane Renault and Brady jones all starting become more prominent stipes trying to rule the drivers and tell them what they should or shouldn't be doing but when you look at there records as drivers before they become stipes they were woeful, you should not have people in charge of drivers when at best they weren't even close to cutting it as a driver themselves. As they seem to like to charge easy prey when they can trick them into admitted stuff but when they try charge a senior horseman the likes of tony maurice mango dexter organge type drive unless it's 100% the drive is guilty they won't really try, but a junior who's 50/50 chance they try nd get them .

Thanks TC for a fun comp. Congrats to Viceroy. We just couldn't get Sally to get our gun out in time in the last at Cromwell

Less tracks overall. The ones we keep of a higher standard and more (at least 1) all weather tracks. Before its too late.

And they seem to mow them so short nowadays too.Might make look good on telly but not practicle

Not sure why they just don't can all gallop races altogether, it's only a matter of a few years when it's going to be all over anyway, it's an absolute farce.

Thanks Trump, kind words. Very proud of Tom, as his mother Colleen is to, and he has worked hard to get where he is, like most people in NZ Racing. He has had his critics, and he has coped well with all of this, especially the anonymous ones who feel they know more about the caper than he does. He is only going to get better as time goes on, and I know that he leaves these shores on good terms with his former employer. There are plenty of people to thank, and I would like to single out Reon Murtha, who took a personal interest in Tom a few years ago, and has had quite a hand in Tom's career up to this stage.

breeder: I dont think the majority of the vendors where being unrealistic in their expectations the costs of simply getting the horse to the sales is huge an average would be around $11,000 and then add the cost of breeding/buying the horse in the first place and then you are getting some quite frankly insulting offers for them for example $5000. for a horse that has just cost in the vicinity of $25.000 . Most of the rtrs i saw looked a picture and a credit to the vendors, and i would say the most ran up in very credible times. I think its a sign of the times that racing is pretty much stuffed, and the studs need to start looking at their fee structures if they want to attract some of the smaller breeders back.

Inspecting the track at Wanganui. Another abandoned meeting? Good God. Shouldn't rain improve matters? There are many reasons for the discontent in our racing game, but with inspections and abandoned meetings this year, I'm ready to surrender. Bugger racing horses.

Which means many horses earning capacity is severely restricted due to the choice of driver. Which means many horses earning capacity is severely restricted due to the trainer's ability. Harness racing is not all about the money for some. The small timers in harness racing are defended by several on here against the power of the stipes but as soon as it involves some of their own money, the small timers are targeted. The small timers are a vibrant part of the industry so how can you slag a father giving his daughter opportunities in something they obviously both love doing. Jessica Young can hit a few wheels (!) but she can also drive bloody well so next time you bet on a horse she is driving take that into account. That is what betting is all about.

Cornelius $450 an hour would be about the hourly rate Nathan Guy's Office would pay for consultants. If he read Race Cafe he would get more informed advice for FREE!

"Certainly nobody around the NZRBs executive table is sitting there saying [current profits] are enough. In fact, to the contrary. Having been out around the country, from North Cape .. well not quite, we didn't get to North Cape, we only got as far as Auckland." John Allen.

2 years ago I'd have disagreed with you as I love the game in this country, but I'm now at my wits end with it. Its being run like a joke and thus run into the ground. There is no vision,no leadership and no hope. We can talk all we like about closing tracks, improving infrastructure, increasing stakes but if you do not have the right leadership & energy behind the code in this country what hope is there?

You can only claim for GST purposes expenses incurred in the furtherance of a taxable activity. GST Registration for any "other business" does not bring with it any right to claim the GST on expenditures not related to that other business. I suspect that you are not registered for GST in relation to a thoroughbred breeding taxable activity and (even if you do breed mares in a GST registered business) are not also able to present an argument that racing the colt is part of that breeding activity. Cheers

Have opened an account with bet365 verified ready to go deposited $200 got a $200 bonus, they have live chat i was having trouble navigating the site very helpful. any questions u have are answered swiftly not swept under the carpet or the pie warmer like they do at petone feeling liberated Highly recommended

Lovely man is Des but I doubt he can be taken too seriously based on his history, and the need for job security, There are simple solutions of course but I'm over teaching the industry the error of its ways when the current management process and appointment process to positions of power is so fucked.

Don't think anyone at head office cares. In the last couple of years we've lost the likes of Gerard Peterson, Terry Jarvis et al, they were big owners, and no one was bothered. NZTR has a policy of "scapegoating" anyway, whenever you talk to them it's someone else's fault. The weather, the economy, the RIU..... Such an attitude gives them job security, and they're hardly going to be held accountable by their own board who're arguably equally ineffective, or the Members Council who are now devoid of credibility and have apparently been hijacked by Wayne Guppy and John Fokerd, who just happen to representing the Wellington Racing Club, and that same WRC is the worst run and biggest failure of all the major clubs in the country. I think Kane T is pursuing the only sensible option in relocating his racing interests to Australia.

Toblerone thanks for the clarification. Fair enough. As you know from other threads I defend drivers and jockeys on a regular basis because they have a very hard job to perform in the hurly burly of competition that people who have never ridden or driven don't appreciate!

Unfortunately Jim, your head is in the clouds on this one. If only you knew the real G Martin and how he actually operates.

Admittedly Franco Texas went huge to go down by only a head but to expect a horse to turn around a 61 length margin and win is not realistic. Amazing that Jessica could nearly get him up to win. She should be praised not bagged!

Not sure if you mean Pacific Playgirl or Pacific Girl? HRNZ shows Pacific Girl as a hack and never been raced. Pacific Playgirl was exported to Aussie years back and I recall she competed at top level there. Think she won the Ladyship (mile ) one year. Both mares are 12 years old now.

Sorry for not posting, I was aware that it was a three day competition I ended up getting caught up with a family matter this morning and didn't have any data on my phone to post. Thank you very much for the competition Crucible, I greatly appreciated the chance to enter and congrats to the winner. For the record last night I worked out some sections and would have spent about $2000 and bombed out horribly. Thanks again for the opportunity and sorry I was unable to enter by cut off time.

I disagree with the comments about both drives. If those drives are to be scrutinised then you might as well suspend 3 or 4 drives per race. A few wearing the dollar goggles while typing it seems.

Tom pretty unlucky TC. Beaten a nose which would have won him the comp, with the kicker being CWJ riding two other winners at 14-1 and 11-1......the wonderful uncertainty of racing eh.....

Aren't juniors also supposed to have a Senior Horseman assist them? I see no note of this?

Surely he appeals it and gets off.

Unlucky Tom...very deceptive finish......

Tom also called the recent NZ Breed Day in China that was shown on Trackside.

The guilt is in the positive sample so they are already guilty. Up to them to prove innocence.

I bloody agree, I cant believe it. Oh and while we are on it, how come John Key and one of the leading presenters have the same speech impediment? Try listening to both of them say straight and any other number of words! The above is rant for today because everything is so hopelessly wrong with racing in this country at the moment, that I have turned into a negative gin swigging bitch such is the desperation of poor tracks, running rails that fall over, 7k races everywhere, bullshit from the top, poorly educated presenters, others like Moncur who have kept jobs against all odds etc, etc, etc, etc. God I could go on but I might need further counseling if I do. I am not a Christian or a Muslim for that matter, but lets all pray for fine weather, a great track, and that some quality horses come out to play next weekend at Trentham.

He would probably get a stint on the sidelines for that drive here in Aussie or a decent fine at least

Look I am not saying they are doing it now but given they are going out develop significant outside income streams they are going to have money to burn. Bar three or four days a year BB there aren't too many 'beautiful' people on our thoroughbred tracks either. You seem to think I am saying this would be a good development - I am most certainly not but it is where I can see it going. What do you see to (1) fix the track issues (2) stop the elite of NZ racing bolting to Aussie and further afield and (3) attract consistent crowds. With the half wits in control at present please eliminate the 'more money from the TAB' option cos for where I sit it ain't happening

With all due respect I imagine you are not the demographic they are after Barryb. They want young dollies with at least a metre of leg showing below their skirt, plenty of warpaint and out for a good time (essentially the same as they are after at the Viaduct). That dolly wants close up, quick action(no sordid activity implied), nighttime entertainment and where she goes the boys will follow. You me and most cafe posters do not fit the profile I wouldn't think. John and Glenda think we all fools as we are the worker bees in the hive merely pumping cash through the chaff cutter to fund their grand plans. You might not like it but Harness Racing goes close to fitting the bill and from the perspective of consistent tracks, better quality horseman(drivers) and year round availability. I am not a fan either but if I have a punt ocassionally I can have confidence in a Dunn, a Purdon, a Butcher or a May and be reasonable confident they are not going to come back and say they didn't handle the track. Alexandra Park is going to have some fairly serious income streams available in the medium term and I can see it going from strength to strength. Thoroughbred on the other hand has to deal with a hopeless administration, impossible tracks, the elite among jockeys trainers (and commentators) deserting in droves. It has a bad bad feel about it. As for your comments about Aussie racing in an earlier post well I'm hate to say it but all of those venues looked a cut above the best we have got last night. Again I like it no more that you do but the reality is the product is superior.

Barron provided evidence ,backed up by vet, and i believe he got testing done on grass and soil to corroborate his evidence.He proved that in all probability he and his staff were innocent of administering banned substance. The other 2 provided no evidence or science in their defence therefore one can only assume culpability unless proven otherwise. Barron looked for a way to prove innocence ,other 2 didnt.Cant see how Barron was careless or negligent on the information provided. I think the RIU knew that if Barron appealed to courts they wouldnt have leg to stand on with evidence he provided. Howe and Edmonds have that option to try and clear their name but their defence very flimsy.

The issue is NZ runs low quality meetings on poor quality tracks . Nothing is going to change . The industry is being allowed to die a slow natural death as no one wants change. Save everyone time and close them all now and just bring in overseas races.

owners are leaving the game faster than the Kaikoura evacuation.

The liftout in the Otago Daily Times is up to its usual high standard. 7 pages of racing, with all meetings covered. The ODT is one of the last independent newspapers, and is by far an away the best. The rest are shit, full of lies and deceit, most being owned by Fairfax. 95% of the worlds media is now in the control of 6 people, and that includes NZ.

Newspapers for racing form - really!? Reminds of that one about faxes: "Sorry I can't send you a fax because of where I live" "Where do you live?" "In the 21st century!"

Trouble is, and I'm not being provocative, that nobody cares any more. Daily newspapers don't have any obligation to print stories or information about something that is now a minority pastime.

I have to comment mine was the opposite clear mistake on my part but race was 6 hours away forgot to press % so my $5 bet became $250 and would not help by cancelling bet said basically tough

I used them for a while, I stuffed up a bet that lost which was totally my fault and talked to them about it they were really good and refunded the money to my account. I can only imagine the response I would have got from Petone.

Yes thats my concern too Leggy. It has now reached the point of no return where owners are buggering off in droves and I myself have cut from major owner in 5 horses to 3 and these 3 will be my last unless this is sorted in 2017. i will put my thousands each month into a boat, rental houses around the country, overseas holidays, wine drinking, just about anything else rather than owning horses. they will also then lose me to visitng the many stacks of tracks I do every year as well. Tonight I have been working out my next 2 months race meetings Te Rapa 27th Nov Te Rapa 10th Dec Te Rapa 17th Dec Pukekura 24th Dec Taupo 30th Dec Tauherenikau 2nd Jan Matamata 13th Jan Te Rapa 22nd Jan Ellerslie 29th Jan Te Teko 30th Jan Te Rapa 4th Feb Actually shit its no wonder the Mrs hates me. Those visits will include a fair bit of food and beverage, 3 will have overnight accom and meals out with more beverage.

For those of you who haven't seen it here is a copy of a letter which was published in The Informant last month. Of course another top 3yo in Ugo Foscolo has also gone as of yesterday along with a large number from the Ready To Run sale last week. The feedback has been tremendous from a broad spectrum of the industry. Editor - The minimum stakes issue is one of the most talked about negatives by participants in New Zealand thoroughbred racing. Racing for $7,000 stakes these days by international standards is simply ridiculous. Money allocated to the codes by the NZRB is remaining stagnant, meaning the stake distribution stays constant whilst costs continue to rise for participants. Industry participants are looking to the Government and the Government are saying do something yourselves. Nothing viable has really been achieved to date. Last year on a website a person suggested a 3 per cent tax paid by overseas purchasers of our horses. I thought it a good idea at the time but no one apparently has run with it. With discussions about an all-weather track recently, the idea was raised again. I have considered the proposal and can see a lot of merit in the idea, so I have picked up the ball to run with it. Low stakes are not encouraging people to race in New Zealand and the biggest industry growth by far in recent years has been the selling and exporting of our horses. This has the effect of reducing the numbers of horses racing in this country and the removal of a lot of better horses that would have remained and raced here. New Zealand has created a reputation with international buyers as a great nursery for horses. This export market however means they are not racing in New Zealand and therefore there is no revenue to the industry from wagering that goes back into funding stakes in order to grow our own backyard from these horses. The sale this week of yet another promising three-year-old in Pearson Square and last week The Soultaker impacting on the quality of our domestic pool is further proof that a levy should be introduced. So why not a 3 per cent levy on the sale price of a horse if it is exported, payable by the overseas buyer? This levy would be specifically applied to stakes at the lower end of the scale. Figures I have heard attributed to overseas purchases per annum of New Zealand thoroughbreds is somewhere in the $100 million-$150 million range. Even at the minimum $100 million, the levy would generate $3 million to go directly to stakes - more than sufficient to raise all stakes to a five-figure category. The funding increase importantly does not come at any further burden to New Zealand industry participants. I believe that 3 per cent (after all is only $3,000 on every $100,000) would not be a major deterrent to an overseas purchaser with a clear explanation of what the levy is for, i.e. totally for the implementation of increased stakes to assist in the betterment and growth of the domestic product. Overseas buyers have the luxury if the horse is removed within a certain time frame of not being imposed with this country’s 15 per cent GST tax either, which local purchasers have to pay on top of their purchase price. That clear explanation of what the levy is for and assurances that it is not disappearing into a black hole should enable the overseas buyer to be more comfortable with it and indeed even support it. Take for example Mr Wolf of Inner Mongolian Racing fame, not only has he purchased more than 1,000 horses over the past couple of years, he also races a large number of horses in New Zealand and no doubt would want the local industry to progress by providing better stake-money to participants. If this proposal can be put in place, then the next step would be to go to the Government advising them of what has been achieved and getting a commitment from them to also directly contribute to the same level, dollar for dollar. The industry has shown it has done something towards raising stakes and with the Government having received GST on all costs prior to the sale, it too can show some support and commitment towards revitalisation of the industry. Imagine what $6 million of injected funds into stakes could do for participation at all levels in this country. Ted McLachlan