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MrBigStuff

Another meeting bites the dust

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3 hours ago, We're Doomed said:

I take it you are trying to say in your own subtle way that you don't necessarily agree with my thoughtful comments.

If an all weather track was built somewhere, say Matamata, then it would be expected to be used about 24 times a year, or more, as horses who discover they quite like the surface will need regular opportunities on it. Matamata currently has about 12 meetings a year. I imagine they would still want to hold 6-8 of those on their existing grass surface so that does leave up to 18 meetings that will have to come off other clubs around Auckland and the Waikato. Rather than taking a couple of meetings each off nine clubs, surely it would be easier just to close two or three tracks down altogether.

Don't you mean 'Date Rape" ?

I'd imagine the likes of Ruakaka wouldn't be needing so many dates if there was an AW in the Waikato?

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On 6/14/2018 at 6:38 AM, poundforpound said:

 

Can I ask why you presume an AW track will not be turf ?

In my experience any polymer or wax based track world wide seems to attract a different type of horse with a different action, and we haven’t bred that type of horse in NZ, so you invariably find horses that prefer AW tracks in countries that are turf driven, for example the UK and NZ, are of a lesser standard.

Conversely the turf style AW track, Strathayr, as seen in Hong Kong, Mooney Valley and Singapore tends to suit horses bred for turf tracks, typicallly those with British, Irish or Australian heritage.

Whilst I accept that a polymer track would be better than nothing I also think it’d be madness to create tracks that suit second rate horses, that’ll just further diminish our international reputation and favour bad horses and the production of a bad product.

Coukd you revert and help me understand what the  fraternity think of my intelligent observations.

Thanks.

 

Thank you for your encouragement pound, I am sorry I don't post so often these days, although it is one less disappointment in your life 

I had always assumed we could only really afford a Geelong or Pakenham type surface somewhere like Matamata. If we are going for a Moonee Valley type surfare surely that would have to be at Avondale or Ellerslie?

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1 hour ago, Huey said:

I can't pick the winner in an 8 horse field , I sure as hell won't be betting into a 30 horse field.

30 horses in a straight line. Be more like the charge of the light brigade.

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1 minute ago, We're Doomed said:

Thank you for your encouragement pound, I am sorry I don't post so often these days, although it is one less disappointment in your life 

I had always assumed we could only really afford a Geelong or Pakenham type surface somewhere like Matamata. If we are going for a Moonee Valley type surfare surely that would have to be at Avondale or Ellerslie?

If we used our assets more productively we could easily afford six Strathayr tracks WD.

Look at Ellerslie, they’ve got 40 million in cash reserves and about the same again coming, yet they’re cutting lateral drains that are doomed to fail when they could easily do a world class Strathayr.

That’s one of the major problems with NZ racing, it’s run by people with no ( or limited ) horse experience, usually breeders or owners who selfishly just want higher stakes to subsidise their own activities.

A few years ago I was talking to Purcell about this, just after they’d bought in a world expert on wax based tracks to look at NZ feasibility, I tried to explain to him that wax based tracks increased fractures and catastrophic injuries, but he didn’t know there was a difference between wax and polymer tracks.

WTF can you do when you’re confronted with that level of ignorance ?

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Trentham has that dog leg 1200m which I’ve always liked. Big fields can be had and most with a chance. The straight at Longchamp is the best I’ve seen (the width of it is incredible) followed closely by The Curragh. I don’t like sprint races as much as do middle distance races, but they can be entertaining. I’ve never been a fan of Flemington’s 1200m races, the bias over one side can be ridiculous from either the wind or track condition.

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That is why i posted PFP about the strathayr type ,is does not cause  as many injuries compared to artificial tracks like Geelong which are really hard on horses.As my first post said DO IT ONCE DO IT RIGHT

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"I imagine that if there was an all-weather at Matamata you wouldn't need Te Teko anymore would you? This meeting would have been scheduled for the all weather in the first place. Several tracks would probably become redundant if an all weather was built. No one seems to have factored that in so far." .....We're Doomed

I reacted because you said we maybe didn't need Te Teko..... moronic statement. P4P is right....strathayr is probably the right surface for the majority of the all weather tracks. It's proven technology and doesn't break as many horses down. We have bred grass track horses not dirt trackers.

Where in Matamata would you put this track We're Doomed? At the actual Matamata race track by replacing the grass track? FFS you obviously don't think things through do you?

As for all of you who question having the ability to have up to 30 runners.....read my post. It says IF we are looking to the future.....

I have absolute evidence, from multiple nations around the World that if you have more runners in a race you lift betting numbers. In the UK if you have more than 24 runners betting sky rockets. Tracks with either barrier draw bias or runner bias have decreased betting activity. I will name call all I like if those of you are imbeciles enough to argue against this. P4P is right....most of you have no idea.

That Elerslie didn't go strathayr is criminal, short sighted and ridiculous. All they are doing is more of the same with the expectation that things will change. Dumb and dumber.

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The major problem with us NZers is that we do not complain  or query when something goes wrong.I know that when they tried to fix Pukekohe a friend of who was an experienced earthmover and sub division creator tried to tell what they were doing was wrong.He was told to piss off ,look what they got 

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If Matamata is too small for an internal track how about something different. A half all weather track and half grass track. For heaven's sake they put obstacles up for hurdle and jumps racing so a crossing  for few metres of all weather surface hardly a big deal.

It would appear Matamata through acquiring land in the back straight has some options.

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3 hours ago, slam dunk said:

If Matamata is too small for an internal track how about something different. A half all weather track and half grass track. For heaven's sake they put obstacles up for hurdle and jumps racing so a crossing  for few metres of all weather surface hardly a big deal.

It would appear Matamata through acquiring land in the back straight has some options.

That would be an ideal way to break your horse down .

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2 hours ago, Berri said:

What.... buy land off the O’Sullivans?!?!

Half a track?!?

Oh dear....how enlightening 

Ok lets try another "idea"

A roll of sheeting substance that can be spread to cover a track and transported from track to track. This would allow unwanted rainfall to run into a drain.

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8 minutes ago, slam dunk said:

Ok lets try another "idea"

A roll of sheeting substance that can be spread to cover a track and transported from track to track. This would allow unwanted rainfall to run into a drain.

And in your expert opinion where would you find such a material to handle 500KG animals plenty of them running over it 8 to 10 times a day... :blink:

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20 minutes ago, scooby3051 said:

And in your expert opinion where would you find such a material to handle 500KG animals plenty of them running over it 8 to 10 times a day... :blink:

I meant a sheeting material as per material they they spread over a cricket pitch and REMOVE prior to restart.

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Hk was mentioned.they don't leave anything to chance.quality not quantity.18 races a week.best advice .they are formula one.we are go carts.I wish we would take advice off them.look at Avondale .run by amateurs .the decline in that track facilities is alarming.  No horses trained there.all weather tracks  are not the total answer.good management of the industry is. Sadly I feel it is too late.the only reason can remember a meeting in Hk being postponed in my 20 years of experience there is when the typhoon forecast reaches a certain level.

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15 hours ago, poundforpound said:

We’re Doomed, I always have very low expectations when you post, and you seldom disappoint.

Can I ask why you presume an AW track will not be turf ?

In my experience any polymer or wax based track world wide seems to attract a different type of horse with a different action, and we haven’t bred that type of horse in NZ, so you invariably find horses that prefer AW tracks in countries that are turf driven, for example the UK and NZ, are of a lesser standard.

Conversely the turf style AW track, Strathayr, as seen in Hong Kong, Mooney Valley and Singapore tends to suit horses bred for turf tracks, typicallly those with British, Irish or Australian heritage.

Whilst I accept that a polymer track would be better than nothing I also think it’d be madness to create tracks that suit second rate horses, that’ll just further diminish our international reputation and favour bad horses and the production of a bad product.

Coukd you revert and help me understand what the idiot fraternity think of my intelligent observations.

Thanks.

 

The vast majority of horses in Hong Kong wouldn’t have more than about 6 rating points difference (they only have one rating) in their performance start to start on the grass against the all weather. A few a little more, most a lot less. 

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4 minutes ago, Sickopunter said:

The vast majority of horses in Hong Kong wouldn’t have more than about 6 rating points difference (they only have one rating) in their performance start to start on the grass against the all weather. A few a little more, most a lot less. 

I think you will find the better ones would never race on the all weather...only the inferior horses do.

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1 minute ago, scooby3051 said:

I think you will find the better ones would never race on the all weather...only the inferior horses do.

A lot of nice middle grade horses do. You’re right they don’t really cater for 90+ type horses but why would that matter? Only a handful of horses in NZ up to that class anyway and how many of them are racing in Winter?

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Mediocrity breeds mediocrity. Mediocre people produce mediocre results. Mediocre horses produce mediocre events. Mediocre events are watched by mediocre people....and mediocre people produce mediocre results....

why would we expect anything else other than mediocre under the current thinking....which includes some of the thinking in this thread?

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