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HANDICAPPING POLICY

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Is this based on the Australian model?

Changes to the handicap rating bands will be introduced by New Zealand Thoroughbred Racing for the 2018-19 racing season.

In addition, from 1 June 2018 most races will have a re-rating ceiling for the first five placegetters.

The changes follow NZTR’s annual handicap review meeting, which was held this month.

No winner will be given more than 12 rating points, with a maximum of five points for finishing from second to fifth.

The maximum re-rating will not apply to Listed or Group races nor to races that are restricted by age.  Jumps races and maiden flat races will also be excluded from the re-rating ceiling, with the policy of re-rating maiden flat winners at 62 or higher maintained.

The introduction of a maximum re-rating is to provide a clearer indication of the likely impact of running horses out of their grade, particularly in Open handicaps. It is felt that the changes will encourage greater participation, while still providing sufficient discretion for the Handicapper.

The changes in the rating bands, which will take effect on 1 August 2018, are designed to help horses move through the grades more quickly, which should lead to a boost in Open class numbers.

Rating 65 races will be retained but Rating 75 races will be replaced by Rating 72 races and Rating 85 races will be replaced by Rating 82 races.

This should produce a greater spread of weights in the “new” Open grade (R83+), at Feature meetings, with horses rated at 97 carrying 60kg and horses rated above that carrying another 0.5kg per rating point. Under the current template, horses rated at 99 are allotted 60kg in the open races at Feature meetings.

However, from 1 August the connections of the top-weighted horses will also have the option of using an apprentice rider, with apprentice allowances to be claimable in all Open races - excluding Group and Listed races - on Feature days and below. At present, allowances are usually only available in one Open race per Feature meeting.

A minor alteration will also be made to the balloting conditions for set weight and weight-for-age Group and Listed races.

The timeframe for Group II placegetters and Group III and Listed winners to have priority entry has been reduced from 18 months to 12 months. The same timeframe will apply to horses who were placed in a Group I two-year-old race.

 

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What a farkin' embarrassment that is. Did anyone put their name to being on the review group that made these decisions? Was there anyone that had a remote clue about handicapping? Lowering the minimum rating for open handicaps will improve the spread of weights? What are they on? Capping the number of points given to winners will make races more competitive and attractive to punters? If you want evidence that the game is rooted and NZTR have not a clue how to fix it, this is it.

As P4P suggests, it does nothing to solve the R65 congestion problem which is largely a weight spread one. Most of those horses will never win an R65 and duly give up and move on to show-jumping careers or similar. What a disaster. In fact, I wonder why I even bother commenting.

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I''s reflective of NZ Racing in general, what a shambles, who on earth oversees these idiotic decisions? The CEO is keeping a very low profile, surely it's all going to end in tears, and sooner rather than later......

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It’s worth noting that any reduction in the 75 grade, whether it be to a 72 or a 70 upper limit, does allow those horses in the 60-65 range to race in a higher grade, carrying lower weight, whilst remaining “in the handicap”.

That may possibly ( but most likely in a minor way ) help to free up the 65 grade ( thanks for the phone call Pitty, and it’s a pity you can’t post here any more as no one reads that other shit site you shifted to with your low achieving and disillusioned mates ).

You can cone back to Cafe when you want to make a meaningful contribution to the discussion of racing matters champ :) 

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1 hour ago, poundforpound said:

It’s worth noting that any reduction in the 75 grade, whether it be to a 72 or a 70 upper limit, does allow those horses in the 60-65 range to race in a higher grade, carrying lower weight, whilst remaining “in the handicap”.

That may possibly ( but most likely in a minor way ) help to free up the 65 grade ( thanks for the phone call Pitty, and it’s a pity you can’t post here any more as no one reads that other shit site you shifted to with your low achieving and disillusioned mates ).

You can cone back to Cafe when you want to make a meaningful contribution to the discussion of racing matters champ :) 

Can you explain how a say R65 horse will carry a lower weight in an R72 than they would have in an R75 under the old policy? I'm not getting this.

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As far as I can see under the current policy a 72 rated horse in an R75 would carry 58.5 and an R65 in that race would carry 55.0, a 3.5kg spread.

Under the new policy, in an R72, the 72 rated horse would carry 60kgs and the R65 would get 56.5. Again a 3.5kg spread but because of the higher weights, a slightly lesser advantage on a percentage basis.

What am I missing? Or, is it in fact a pity that Pitty has pulled the wool over your eyes?

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Leo you are correct 

This should free up the r65 grade 

and increase participants in r72 races

Does a rating 62 male go round with 58.5kg or start in r72 with 54kg or 50kg with a full claim 

Will horses with multiple wins now drop back to r65 races or run in r72 races with less weight bearing in mind the maximum penalty has been capped at 12 points. Hopefully some of these small open class fields will have increased numbers and avoid the excessive 13 to 18 point penalties eg Boxachocolates

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Clearly you don’t understand handicapping Leggy, and you didn’t read my post.

Try again using a 60 rated horse in a 75 grade, and then use the same horse in a 72 grade

Actually I’ll do it for you.

A 60 rated make racing in a 75 is 15 points or 7.5kg from the top weight, in a race with a 6 kg spread that horse must be 3 points or 1.5kg out of the handicap.

The same horse in a 72 is 12 points from the toppy, and in a 6kg spread carries 54 and is in the handicap.

This ( minor ) adjustment by NZTR means some make horses can race up a grade with no disadvantage now.

Have they gone far enough with these changes, absolutely not, but it’s a start and if you want to criticise them you have a duty to acknowledge when they do something positive, even when it’s very minor.

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This new handicapping policy is not the right answer!!

By downgrading the system, they have downgraded all NZ horses.

The problem lies entirely with the handicappier and administrators/trainers he listens to.

The problem is horses are winning too many races in the lower grades and not being pushed through.

Classic example:

Touch of Silver (was entered at Counties today). Won by 15 lengths in Rating 65 $22,000 on a Premier day - gets ONLY 5 points and doesnt even go out of the grade!

There's your problem!

There many examples like this, hence the congestion in the lower grades.

George Strictland had no experience taking this position and in 4 years hes f..ked the system.

This new policy is only hiding his mess. And that is exactly what the NZ rating system is. A mess! 

It is time, NZTR swallow their pride and re-employ Dean Nowell as a consultant. Talking to others in the industry, also agree. We didn't have these problems when he was handicapper for 30 odd years.

Only when Purcell along with Australian sidekick Mark Webby that the whole system gone to sh.t! And Strictland has followed their practice.

This new policy is not handicapping.

Another example of Strictland's inability of handicapping

Rodrico rated 74. Won over $320K in Australia.

Rodrico ran second in the Group One Queensland derby, while the winner Eagle Way runs in the Group One in Hong Kong on Sunday, Rodrico runs in Rating 75 at Trentham!!!.

ok, he obviously didn't settle in HK but after racing in HK Derby, Classic Cup and Classic Mile, he's rated 74 here???

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I’ve ridden Rodrico many times, hundreds of times, I trained him until he went to Waller, I think he’s rated correctly, and maybe too highly 

I take your point but he’s a bad example of the problem and will almost certainly prove Strickland correct 

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39 minutes ago, poundforpound said:

I’ve ridden Rodrico many times, hundreds of times, I trained him until he went to Waller, I think he’s rated correctly, and maybe too highly 

I take your point but he’s a bad example of the problem and will almost certainly prove Strickland correct 

Strickland cops a lot of stick. Whether or not this is deserving I don't know.  His job is to apply the handicapping policy which NZTR sets .  If the policy is crap, and Strickland had a major say in it, he deserves stick on that account.  Otherwise, so long as Strickland applies the policy diligently, surely he is no more to blame if the policy leads to absurd ratings, than he is deserving of credit if horses run to their ratings.

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On 5/26/2018 at 0:28 PM, mastermind said:

This new policy is not handicapping.

Classic example:

Touch of Silver (was entered at Counties today). Won by 15 lengths in Rating 65 $22,000 on a Premier day - gets ONLY 5 points and doesnt even go out of the grade!

There's your problem!

Another example of Strictland's inability of handicapping

Rodrico rated 74. Won over $320K in Australia.

Rodrico ran second in the Group One Queensland derby, while the winner Eagle Way runs in the Group One in Hong Kong on Sunday, Rodrico runs in Rating 75 at Trentham!!!.

ok, he obviously didn't settle in HK but after racing in HK Derby, Classic Cup and Classic Mile, he's rated 74 here???

Easy win for Rodrico at Egmont in the wrong grade. Good money too.

This weeks classic example:

Lambrusco won by 11 lengths at Egmont. Given only 5 points to 64 and still remains in the same grade after a 11 length win??

Theres the problem with Strictland's handicapping. Horses are not being pushed through the grades. 

All Strictland does is give 5 points for a win. It proves, he is NOT judging wins/runs on merit. A computer can do this! It is not handicapping!!
Within a couple of unplaced runs, a previous winner has lost those 5 points (from the win) and back in same rating, hence not going through the grade. Any idiot can see this.

Strictland is out of his depth and its proven with the shambles the rating system is in now.

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Be sensible and take the emotion out of it.

Rodrico went 2 + seconds slower than the R65 over the same trip, and his time was only just faster than the maiden 3yo immediately following.

He led them up in a canter and sprint affair, so using your logic ( that Strickland has to look at the “ whole picture “)  he could arguably have decided that was a “bad race” and given Rodrico a very small penalty rather than take him out of the grade.

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On 6/2/2018 at 11:00 AM, mastermind said:

This weeks classic example:

Lambrusco won by 11 lengths at Egmont. Given only 5 points to 64 and still remains in the same grade after a 11 length win??

Theres the problem with Strictland's handicapping. Horses are not being pushed through the grades. 

All Strictland does is give 5 points for a win. It proves, he is NOT judging wins/runs on merit. A computer can do this! It is not handicapping!!
Within a couple of unplaced runs, a previous winner has lost those 5 points (from the win) and back in same rating, hence not going through the grade. Any idiot can see this.

Strictland is out of his depth and its proven with the shambles the rating system is in now.

This weeks classic example:

New York Minute won by 11 and half lengths at Trentham. Given only 4 points to 92??

If NYM meet the same field again, Dolcetta remains on rating 98 will carry 60kg, NYM (R92) will go to 55kgs with the 2kg sex allowance.

So, New York Minute been re-handicapped only 1kg for the 11 length win?? This is beyond a joke! Did he actually see the race? or a computer?

Theres the problem with Strictland's handicapping. Has no idea.

Dean Nowell was more than happy to help trainers program their horses when he was handicapper.
Strictland ratings are inconsistent. He is impossible to get hold of. Doesnt give answers. He's incompetent. 

All Strictland is doing is dropping horses too fast and not putting horses through the grades. Every week there are classic examples.

What do NZTR do? drop the rating bands??? This is detrimental to NZ racing.

If rating bands are done properly, there would be plenty of horses in each grade means bigger fields in each grade/race.

The rating bands numbers are a mess now.

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On 5/24/2018 at 7:42 PM, poundforpound said:

There’s your ultimate indictment of the bewildered and the brainless.

The issues are twofold..... the most compelling of which is the congestion in the 65 grade....so what did the lobotomised morons do with that 65 grade ......absolutely far-king nothing.....

They should be running R60 races for 1 win horses instead of them competing against 5 win horses who have dropped back in the grades and then get an apprentice up.  Very unfair and it happens all the time & looks deliberate in cases.  This is why there is congestion and it the 1 win horses who cannot get a start and get put into emergency B! B2 B3 B4 B5 B6 & so on until their owners get sick of paying bills for nothing angive the game away.  Why can’t the handicappers see this glaring fact?  This is where we haemorrhage horses and disillusioned owners from and meantime the higher grades race with minimal fields and make money.

 

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1 hour ago, Tapu said:

They should be running R60 races for 1 win horses instead of them competing against 5 win horses who have dropped back in the grades and then get an apprentice up.  Very unfair and it happens all the time & looks deliberate in cases.  This is why there is congestion and it the 1 win horses who cannot get a start and get put into emergency B! B2 B3 B4 B5 B6 & so on until their owners get sick of paying bills for nothing angive the game away.  Why can’t the handicappers see this glaring fact?  This is where we haemorrhage horses and disillusioned owners from and meantime the higher grades race with minimal fields and make money.

 

Your making too much sense hence it won’t happen.

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Where do you think those 5 win horses came from? They are part of the same system that has been in use for many years. The trouble is that many horses are simply not good enough to win more than one race and importing NI rejects does not always work, I have found that out many times!!!  They ran a rating 60 race at Riccarton recently only 12 horses were in it. You can always run horses in the next rating band they are very rarely full fields, claim an apprentice allowance and carry no weight as Kevin and Pam Hughes did with Pat In Brackets on Friday at Timaru and stayed in R65

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If you want to use the option of racing out of your fair enough.But that shouldn’t be your only option.The 65 system is extremely tough on horses that manage to win a maiden race in its first few starts (especially geldings) .They pretty much end up st the top of the 65 band carrying topweight. Hopefully  they can sort this grade out sooner than later. These 4/5 win horses should be racing in the 75 band not expecting lower the 1/2 win horses to race out of their grade IMO. Another point is you don’t have to pay noms and acceptances in the 65 grade but you do in the 75 grade.

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Why don't they just sort the system out so i works or may five win horses carry top weight in R65 Grade. It's crazy sometimes seeing 5 or more win horses running around with 52-53kg after the claims.

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