jimbob 92 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 4 minutes ago, gubellini said: jimbob Alysha is the correct spelling of the jockey concerned. I suggest you take up a new hobby like line dancing, war gaming or scrapbooking. If you carry on like this you will soon fill a scrapbook with your punting tales of woe! Ok Grubalini . If you cant handle discussion, then go play pin the tail on the donkey. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gubellini 4,003 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 jimbob I will play pin the tail on the donkey if you take a course in remedial spelling! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insider 3,960 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 Jimbob, my guess is that the RIU will stop head to head betting in the near future as it can’t successfully be policed, primarily on the basis of animal welfare. If they don’t, they are not doing their job properly. Animal welfare going forward is one of our industries biggest hurdles, even though I think Thoroughbred Racing is the best by far. Greyhound Racing has a dreadful outlook and where do all the very slow cheaply bred Standardbreds, unsuitable for much, end up? napier 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohokaman 5,841 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 9 minutes ago, Insider said: Jimbob, my guess is that the RIU will stop head to head betting in the near future as it can’t successfully be policed, primarily on the basis of animal welfare. If they don’t, they are not doing their job properly. Animal welfare going forward is one of our industries biggest hurdles, even though I think Thoroughbred Racing is the best by far. Greyhound Racing has a dreadful outlook and where do all the very slow cheaply bred Standardbreds, unsuitable for much, end up? Same place very slow Thorougbreds end up I'm guessing.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
We're Doomed 4,865 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 48 minutes ago, jimbob said: Good Morning RIU (email sent) I would like to put forward a situation in which racing and been brought into disrepute The TAB offered a head to head bet Race 5 Matamata between Number 9 Hatrick Boys and Number 1 Neddy Nadeem A head to head option in racing is absolutely no difference between a head to head bet between The All Blacks and South Africa The Punters are expecting the participants in the head to head to put everything into winning the option Clearly Alysia Collett Stopped riding her horse well before the line, this enabled Hatrick Boys along the inside to get his nose in front. The stipendairy report is incorrect in saying Neddy Nadeem was running out of a little bit of room in the concluding stages. Neddy Nadeem was running out of a little bit of room at about the 200metre mark, but had plenty of room to be ridden out over the concluding stages. Failing this to happen by Alysia Collett has given the 7th position in the race to Hatrick Boys Please watch the replay Kind Regards Goodness. I certainly don't want to get into a slanging match here, especially since it doesn't sound like English is your first language. All I can say is good luck with that. I will though point out that there is actually a difference between a racing head to head and a rugby head to head. With the ABs and SA it really is a two horse race and they are each trying to win. In racing it could involve two horses as part of a 16 horse field and each of them have to be conscious of the fact that their major role is to try and win the race rather than beat the other horse home, so their riding tactics must take that into account. If a jockey rides only to beat one other jockey regardless of whether it costs them both the chance of winning the race then that would not be a good look. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gubellini 4,003 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 jimbob in the last 12 months dozens of jockeys including Alysha have ridden horses I have shares in at the trials or races. I have not one complaint against any of them! Funny that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chelseacol 2,488 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 3 minutes ago, gubellini said: jimbob in the last 12 months dozens of jockeys including Alysha have ridden horses I have shares in at the trials or races. I have not one complaint against any of them! Funny that. You must be an easy marker Gub I have regular moans about jockeys riding mine - it's one of the few perks of being an owner Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick 80 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 Couple of things Jimbob A- You lost a bet stop been a sooky. I bet this option quite often and have had lucky wins and unlucky losses. This is the risk i take with betting this option. Unless it is made into the same as Australia books where it is only paid out if winner finishes top 4 that’s the way it is. It’s a bet not a guaranteed return. B- This is not the same as the a sports h2h. In this option there is only a win or a loss for each team. In a h2h horse bet the horses can finish last and second which means a win or loss in the bet but no difference in stakes for the horses. elbow 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMD is rife 211 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 9 hours ago, barryb said: Oh dear, take a long while before you respond and realise how very silly you are after you have reread the above post a few times. I am not even going to try and explain it to you as it would be a lost cause. Crucible has pulled your pants down Barry. End of story. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crucible 632 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 1 hour ago, nick said: Unless it is made into the same as Australia books where it is only paid out if winner finishes top 4 that’s the way it is. This is a good idea and I've suggested it to the TAB but no response. Tauhei Notts 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb 2,064 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 42 minutes ago, SMD is rife said: Crucible has pulled your pants down Barry. End of story. Enlighten us as to how?. Because he clearly has zero idea about markets or value. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crucible 632 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 5 minutes ago, barryb said: Enlighten us as to how?. Because he clearly has zero idea about markets or value. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
N1MUE 1,877 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 13 minutes ago, barryb said: Enlighten us as to how?. Simply by virtue of the fact that he showed an understanding of basic probability theory, while you took the school playground approach of "I won't tell you because you won't be smart enough to understand it". Why don't you enlighten us with your wisdom - who knows we could all be better off as a result of that - as unlikely as that might be. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb 2,064 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 Are you laughing because you realise how stupid you have been. I just had a look at todays gallops and the market is as I thought dreadful. Its nothing more than gouging from dumb punters. Have a look at a 2 option sports event to compare. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb 2,064 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 Just now, N1MUE said: Simply by virtue of the fact that he showed an understanding of basic probability theory, while you took the school playground approach of "I won't tell you because you won't be smart enough to understand it". Why don't you enlighten us with your wisdom - who knows we could all be better off as a result of that - as unlikely as that might be. I have told you, the % is theft from dumb punters who dont understand value. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
N1MUE 1,877 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 2 minutes ago, barryb said: I have told you, the % is theft from dumb punters who dont understand value. QED Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMD is rife 211 Report post Posted December 20, 2017 Barry, you are making an idiot of yourself, the H2H option offers the lowest take out rate of any racing bet type. You do know the TAB removed this option from harness. I wonder why. Crucible has done the maths for you and yet you still can't see. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbob 92 Report post Posted December 21, 2017 Response from RIU I can respond to your email regarding the head top head betting option on race 5 at Matamata on 20 December. Under the rules of Racing the approach of the stewards is that a horse needs to be ridden out if it is in close contention to fill a stakes bearing position (usually the first 4 or 5). If a horse is outside these positions and is not making ground the rider is not expected to be vigorous in ridding to the line and in fact will be charged for using the whip or being too vigorous on a beaten horse.. This is an animal welfare issue, we cannot have horses who are beaten being vigorously ridden. I understand that this can cause an issue with head to head betting where both the runners may be out of contention. The RIU raised this with the NZRB when head to head betting was introduced. We made it clear we would not be charging a rider for easing up on a horse and losing a head to head result if the horse was out of contention.Our suggestion was that the Victorian betting rule should apply. In Victoria as I understand it if both the horses in the head to head run outside the first five placings the bet is refunded. NZRB have not taken this option up so it is a matter of caveat emptor (let the buyer beware). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbob 92 Report post Posted December 21, 2017 message sent to TAB I would like to put forward a situation in which racing and been brought into disrepute The TAB offered a head to head bet Race 5 Matamata 20th December between Number 9 Hatrick Boys and Number 1 Neddy Nadeem A head to head option in racing is absolutely no difference between a head to head bet between The All Blacks and South Africa The Punters are expecting the participants in the head to head to put everything into winning the option Clearly Alysia Collett Stopped riding her horse well before the line, this enabled Hatrick Boys along the inside to get his nose in front. as per the response below The Head to Head betting does not state these conditions that jockeys do not need to ride horses out This is the response from the RIU "The RIU raised this with the NZRB when head to head betting was introduced. We made it clear we would not be charging a rider for easing up on a horse and losing a head to head result if the horse was out of contention.Our suggestion was that the Victorian betting rule should apply. In Victoria as I understand it if both the horses in the head to head run outside the first five placings the bet is refunded. NZRB have not taken this option" So I am seeking a full refund from my bet yesterday or I will be taking this up with the NZRB and Racing Minister, then my Lawyer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb 2,064 Report post Posted December 21, 2017 1 hour ago, SMD is rife said: Barry, you are making an idiot of yourself, the H2H option offers the lowest take out rate of any racing bet type. You do know the TAB removed this option from harness. I wonder why. Crucible has done the maths for you and yet you still can't see. I rest my case. It would have been removed from Harness because its very easy to manipulate. The only person making a goose of themselves is you because you are commenting on something you have little knowledge on. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
We're Doomed 4,865 Report post Posted December 21, 2017 20 minutes ago, jimbob said: message sent to TAB I would like to put forward a situation in which racing and been brought into disrepute The TAB offered a head to head bet Race 5 Matamata 20th December between Number 9 Hatrick Boys and Number 1 Neddy Nadeem A head to head option in racing is absolutely no difference between a head to head bet between The All Blacks and South Africa The Punters are expecting the participants in the head to head to put everything into winning the option Clearly Alysia Collett Stopped riding her horse well before the line, this enabled Hatrick Boys along the inside to get his nose in front. as per the response below The Head to Head betting does not state these conditions that jockeys do not need to ride horses out This is the response from the RIU "The RIU raised this with the NZRB when head to head betting was introduced. We made it clear we would not be charging a rider for easing up on a horse and losing a head to head result if the horse was out of contention.Our suggestion was that the Victorian betting rule should apply. In Victoria as I understand it if both the horses in the head to head run outside the first five placings the bet is refunded. NZRB have not taken this option" So I am seeking a full refund from my bet yesterday or I will be taking this up with the NZRB and Racing Minister, then my Lawyer Oh goodness, I'm sure we all look forward to following this saga as it makes its way through the courts system. chelseacol 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
We're Doomed 4,865 Report post Posted December 21, 2017 1 minute ago, barryb said: I rest my case. It would have been removed from Harness because its very easy to manipulate. The only person making a goose of themselves is you because you are commenting on something you have little knowledge on. Gee Barry, if we stopped all those those people commenting who had little knowledge of something this place would go very quiet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chelseacol 2,488 Report post Posted December 21, 2017 jimbob however aggrieved you feel, the reality is here you bet into a bet type conducted in an environment you didn't fully understand. I'd learn from it rather than tilting at windmills... Col Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbob 92 Report post Posted December 21, 2017 11 minutes ago, chelseacol said: jimbob however aggrieved you feel, the reality is here you bet into a bet type conducted in an environment you didn't fully understand. I'd learn from it rather than tilting at windmills... Col Terms and conditions do not state these conditions I aim to get head to head betting stopped in NZ, unless they update the terms and conditions in regards to these bet types Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chelseacol 2,488 Report post Posted December 21, 2017 6 minutes ago, jimbob said: Terms and conditions do not state these conditions I aim to get head to head betting stopped in NZ, unless they update the terms and conditions in regards to these bet types The terms and conditions when I take a sports bet on American Football don't talk about the correct inflation level of the footballs either. But I realise the rules of the sport I am betting into allow some things and not others..... As for you crusading to stop this bet type because you got unlucky once ....mmmmmm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...