Sickopunter 403 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 Addington race 2. 8 horse field, 3 place divs. 1. 1.60 2. 1.08 3. 3.0 4. 1.90 5. 1.60 6. 1.80 7. 5.50 8. 3.80 Explain to me how this is fair. Almost money back for the fave and 4 other horses under even money. You know the odds. Now beat it. OK. I'm out. ivanthegreat 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Report post Posted September 8, 2017 No. And they have been getting progressively worse Sickopunter. Shit odds, can't get decent bets on, restricted saddlecloths etc. They are pathetic so called Bookies! End of story! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamour 673 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 16 minutes ago, Brodie said: No. And they have been getting progressively worse Sickopunter. Shit odds, can't get decent bets on, restricted saddlecloths etc. They are pathetic so called Bookies! End of story! Didn't know you were back posting. Hope you are back to stay, It has been a bit quiet without you here Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Report post Posted September 8, 2017 Lamour, couldn't help it! The site has become a bit boring I must admit, and so many things need to be brought up. I stopped,posting due to several dickheads and a couple calling me a liar, which is not true so wasn't worth my while. Someone needs to bring up the issues! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackSprat 947 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 2 hours ago, Sickopunter said: Addington race 2. 8 horse field, 3 place divs. 1. 1.60 2. 1.08 3. 3.0 4. 1.90 5. 1.60 6. 1.80 7. 5.50 8. 3.80 At 134% I would have thought it was a fairly typical opening market. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sickopunter 403 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 Just now, JackSprat said: At 134% I would have thought it was a fairly typical opening market. Typical bullshit. Are you defending it? Its also not an opening market. It was right before I posted it, 2 hours ago. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackSprat 947 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 It wasn't an unreasonable market percentage, and the result proves that the TAB were spot on. What do you expect? The TAB to offer overs to donate money to you? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sickopunter 403 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 53 minutes ago, JackSprat said: It wasn't an unreasonable market percentage, and the result proves that the TAB were spot on. What do you expect? The TAB to offer overs to donate money to you? It was an unreasonable market %, I explained why and they are biting the hand that feeds them. I expect that it's a challenge between tab and punter with the tab having a realistic edge. This ain't that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackSprat 947 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 No matter what we'd all like, the TAB have no plans to operate as a charity for the benefit of punters. The simple facts are, that the Final Fixed Place Odds prices on the race represented a 122% market. The Final Tote Place Odds represented a 121% market. So a 134% Fixed Odds market is about what you'd expect an hour or two before race start time. A good old fashioned bookie might back his judgement and lay horses he didn't fancy, but these guys aren't in that category. They're corporate bookies with solid risk management strategies, and a system they stick to. The figures above are typical of what they do race after race. globederby12 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sickopunter 403 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 50 minutes ago, JackSprat said: No matter what we'd all like, the TAB have no plans to operate as a charity for the benefit of punters. The simple facts are, that the Final Fixed Place Odds prices on the race represented a 122% market. The Final Tote Place Odds represented a 121% market. So a 134% Fixed Odds market is about what you'd expect an hour or two before race start time. A good old fashioned bookie might back his judgement and lay horses he didn't fancy, but these guys aren't in that category. They're corporate bookies with solid risk management strategies, and a system they stick to. The figures above are typical of what they do race after race. It wasn't an hour or two before start time. For memory it was within the last 30 mins before the race. At a guess 20 mins out. It's putting off punters. And owners. And I know that for a fact. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sickopunter 403 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 53 minutes ago, JackSprat said: No matter what we'd all like, the TAB have no plans to operate as a charity for the benefit of punters. The simple facts are, that the Final Fixed Place Odds prices on the race represented a 122% market. The Final Tote Place Odds represented a 121% market. So a 134% Fixed Odds market is about what you'd expect an hour or two before race start time. A good old fashioned bookie might back his judgement and lay horses he didn't fancy, but these guys aren't in that category. They're corporate bookies with solid risk management strategies, and a system they stick to. The figures above are typical of what they do race after race. The fact they do it race after race is hardly surprising, nor a defence lol. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil 333 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 11 hours ago, Sickopunter said: It was an unreasonable market %, I explained why and they are biting the hand that feeds them. Where did you explain why it's 'unreasonable'? Assertion and explanation aren't the same thing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackSprat 947 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 10 hours ago, Sickopunter said: The fact they do it race after race is hardly surprising, nor a defence lol. It's not my intention to "defend" anything. Simply trying to give you an understanding of the system, and the maths behind it. The small fields create the illusion of smaller dividends, but if you understand the maths behind the prices you'll see that in bigger field, which usually generate a wider spread of dividends, the same percentages are at work. The constant cry from some quarters that "the dividends are getting smaller", is simply not true. It's the fields getting smaller that are fooling you. Even if you don't fully grasp the maths behind the pricing, it's not hard to understand that the dividends are likely to be smaller when they pay 3 place dividends out of a field of 8, as compared to paying 3 place dividends out of a field of 16. Thejanitor 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pickel 45 Report post Posted September 8, 2017 Jack, I'd reasonably confident that Sicko and Brodie can do the Maths, its just that Race Cafe is the place that they come to whinge and like most whingers they're not big fans of facts. On Thursday night the Addington markets (Win and Top3) opened at 123% R8; 125% R1,2,3; 128% R5,7,9; and 130% R4,6. 24 hours out, these are easily the most punter-friendly harness markets in the world IMO. Thejanitor 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Report post Posted September 9, 2017 That is crap and you know it. The top 3 market is always over 130% week in and week out. Let's just follow the opening markets then for the next few meetings and see if they are opening them in the 120's. The TAB Bookies have become that pathetic with their place odds it is hardly worth even looking at them at opening time and when they do lengthen them it is so close to the race. Would be great if they would open them at 123% but will report back after Rangiora odds are posted. Even with the shorts they will not let anyone win consistently without heavy restrictions. Anyway, not going to continue to post as some on here have blinkers on, but just had to support what Sicko had stated! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Report post Posted September 9, 2017 Picked, you are talking crap. Check the Rangiora opening odds they are in the 130's and not in the 120,s at all. Thing is they only want the Mug punters betting early on the unders and anyone with nous is not able to get much on. They are quick to slash odds but not to lengthen out Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kotare_Hunter 748 Report post Posted September 9, 2017 1 hour ago, Brodie said: They are quick to slash odds but not to lengthen out Thats pretty vague. Do you have some actual examples ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kotare_Hunter 748 Report post Posted September 9, 2017 On 08/09/2017 at 5:12 PM, Brodie said: And they have been getting progressively worse Sickopunter. Can you back this up ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kotare_Hunter 748 Report post Posted September 9, 2017 1 hour ago, Brodie said: Check the Rangiora opening odds they are in the 130's and not in the 120,s at all. What are the opening odds ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Report post Posted September 9, 2017 Too flippen short for serious punters to take. race 7 133percent havent done all the races but they are in the 130's Have been late 130's very often. Biggest problem is even if u want to take unders they restrict you to ridiculous low amount to get on and then slash odds by heaps after you are on. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kotare_Hunter 748 Report post Posted September 9, 2017 1 minute ago, Brodie said: Too flippen short for serious punters to take. race 7 133percent havent done all the races but they are in the 130's Have been late 130's very often. Biggest problem is even if u want to take unders they restrict you to ridiculous low amount to get on and then slash odds by heaps after you are on. So what is the earliest from the race they drop below 130% Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Report post Posted September 9, 2017 Kotare, haven't really worked it out exactly as I will be only looking for the one I fancy to lengthen out . What I do know is that once they slash my horses odds they are extremely reluctant to lengthen it out again so I can have another go! I would estimate it wouldn't be in the 120's until the last half hour at best! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pickel 45 Report post Posted September 9, 2017 Brodie Just in case one of us is wearing blinkers and to not make this a complete waste of time... would YOU be in 100% agreement that "IF the opening percentages that I listed above for Addington WERE CORRECT, then they would indeed be, 24 hours out, the most punter-friendly harness markets in the world" If we cant agree on what is hypothetically Good, then we aint going to agree on anything. I am NOT asking you to believe that they are correct, Just conditionally, if they were available then they would be the most punter-friendly in the world. Do you know enough about fixed odds to say "Yes"? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sickopunter 403 Report post Posted September 9, 2017 1 hour ago, Pickel said: Brodie Just in case one of us is wearing blinkers and to not make this a complete waste of time... would YOU be in 100% agreement that "IF the opening percentages that I listed above for Addington WERE CORRECT, then they would indeed be, 24 hours out, the most punter-friendly harness markets in the world" If we cant agree on what is hypothetically Good, then we aint going to agree on anything. I am NOT asking you to believe that they are correct, Just conditionally, if they were available then they would be the most punter-friendly in the world. Do you know enough about fixed odds to say "Yes"? When you have a virtual Monopoly on fixed odds, a huge information advantage and tote pools which are small I think it is imperative that you are giving punters the option of having a bet. In the market I displayed which was absolutely not an opening market they were driving people away. The market percentage the TAB are betting is higher for longer than it used to be and the risks they take to a huge number of punters is lower. No surprise ownership/field size/the industry is suffering. I'm not saying its the only factor but I know for absolute certain that it is A factor. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pickel 45 Report post Posted September 9, 2017 S Here is the 125% Opening Top3 market for that Addington race: $1.75, $1.70, $2.70, $2, $1.35, $2.05, $5, $3.40 Something tells me those that took Ana Malak $1.70 Top3 were feeling pretty good when it started $1.70 to win on the Tote, I get the feeling that unfortunately you werent one of them. I also get the feeling, those that got the $1.70 in the 125% opening market felt that they, at the very least, got a fair deal. I certainly dont think that this market will drive them from the industry, quite the opposite in fact, I think they'll come back for more. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaceCafe News