Nasrullah 180 Report post Posted June 28, 2017 When looking towards the future and selling the progeny of what we breed why is it that so many breeders get confused with what our biggest market wants from New Zealand? New Zealand moved away from what we were best at. Classic 3yo's who go onto 2000m to 3200 races. The breeders thought speed was what we needed and the studs supplied what part of the market wanted. Or was it that the studs told the breeders what they needed and the breeders believed this? As a generalisation Australia will not bred classic horses when you send a classic sire to a mare who has got speed throughout her pedigree. And New Zealand will not breed fast maturing 2yo sprinters from our general broodmare band. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fitzy 143 Report post Posted June 29, 2017 19 hours ago, Nasrullah said: New Zealand moved away from what we were best at. Classic 3yo's who go onto 2000m to 3200 races. The breeders thought speed was what we needed and the studs supplied what part of the market wanted. Or was it that the studs told the breeders what they needed and the breeders believed this? Nasrullah what facts do you have to support this statement. I'm fairly sure that the results show NZ breds have won around 50% of G1 Aus Derbies and Oaks over the past 5-6 years. This current season has been close to a clean sweep for the Kiwis (G1 Derbies/Oaks). Surely a horse such as Ocean Park at stud refutes your claims? As Berri has stated too many breeders confuse speed and stamina. Stayers must have speed as well. The key factor may well be maturity. Few can afford to wait till a horse is 4 before it races seriously. Personally I think many confuse precocity and speed, but they are very different. i.e. Black Caviar and Chautauqua etc. Mattski 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nasrullah 180 Report post Posted June 29, 2017 Fitzy...hi, don't forget Henri previously thought we were the same person! A good season for NZ on the Oaks and Derby front. May it long continue. A agree a stayer must be a fast stayer. A horse with a turn of foot. I am saying sprinting sires do NZ no favours. Ocean Park was not a sprinter. He was a top 1600m to 2000m racehorse out of a Zabeel mare. I recall the years 80's as great days. Apart for Sir T and Zamazaan, Nassipour. Am trying to recall or find a leading sires list from the late eighties showing how many NZ sires we had in the top 20. Currently we have none!!!!! The Dewar Trophy is awarded to each year's leading New Zealand-based sire by combined Australasian progeny earnings and effectively recognises our champion sire in Australia. It was first awarded to Summertime in 1965, and other multiple winners since then have been Le Filou, Pakistan II, Oncidium (three times), and Zabeel's own sire Sir Tristram (nine times). Only three times in 42 years has it been won by a stallion other than New Zealand's leading sire on the Australian general sires' list: in 1967, when Le Filou headed off Alcimedes; in 1982, when Noble Bijou defeated Sir Tristram; and in 1994, when Sir Tristram defeated his son Grosvenor for the Dewar title. A select group of six New Zealand-based sires have won the Australian premiership 15 times in that period: Alcimedes (1967 & 1970), Agricola (1968), Oncidium (1973 & 1975), Sir Tristram (1981, 1983, 1985, 1986, 1987, 1989 & 1990), Zamazaan (1988) and Zabeel (1998 & 1999). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
La Zip 468 Report post Posted June 29, 2017 My take on why things changed here... There was a period when the value NZ dollar was scraping the bottom of the barrel, thus making everything imported into NZ too expensive, including horses. On the flip side, any NZ revenue converted to mainstream currencies was just about worthless. Hence to buy a reasonable European / UK stallion was too expensive and Northern hemisphere operations wouldn't send stallions down here because there was no ROI. So where did NZ stud masters head to for their new stallions? Across the ditch and bought/conned into 2nd rate Aussie sprinters. Mind you there were 1 or 2 that did work out well. That coincided with the emergence of Asian racing and the slipping into oblivion of NZ racing. So the next stage of the industry's demolition occurred - everything not bolted down was/is sold. Hence robbing the industry of good colts & fillies that could potentially find their way to stud here. You can actually timeline the slide...but NZ industry, in particular, the rock solid owner/breeder type - the ones normally responsible for the success of the initially, moderately priced stallions - have stuck to breeding to what they can afford and it's starting to fill the gaps in the Aussie market being left by the Aussies (new entrants & their Agents) absolute obsession with money & "colts into stallion prospects", which will inevitably damage their industry along the way. Short term gain for long term pain, I think could best describe the current state of the industry across the ditch? Breeder, Insider, Huey and 1 other 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...