swampfox 94 Report post Posted May 5, 2017 On 5/9/2016 at 5:13 PM, von Smallhaussen said: Does not belong amongst this thread but did your family stand Musical Phantasy? did he stand alongside quito.gould the studmaster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Smallhaussen 3,226 Report post Posted May 5, 2017 3 hours ago, swampfox said: did he stand alongside quito.gould the studmaster no - was at Millfield then went to South Island where he did buggar all. I would like to know who imported him to NZ Left a couple of Group 1 winners too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOM(the other Molloy) 1,774 Report post Posted May 5, 2017 Only just started looking at this thread but a couple of comments. Someone mentioned Country Dance as a 'no hit' wonder - he sired Flying View who won a Telegraph and was a pretty smart horse And the mention of brothers who were contrasting in performance. Noble Bijou had a half brother called Kimberly Mine(already mentioned in this thread) who failed to set the world alight at stud in NZ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOM(the other Molloy) 1,774 Report post Posted May 5, 2017 Honey Crepe got a lot of well bred (esp Gate Keeper) mares - Gordon Thomson stood him at stud so that is understandable. Produced two good horses Sporting Show and Every Show - not sure if they were stakeswinners - but Mum(Show Gate) would have helped impart some ability in each case. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gubellini 3,923 Report post Posted May 5, 2017 May have been mentioned but Crimson God the sire of Axeman. Other progeny total duffers. Black Kirrama 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Kirrama 1,477 Report post Posted May 6, 2017 Gube.. only you would remember the awful Stallions I have bred from and the poorly bred weanlings /yearlings I have endorsed. Have a laugh, Buddy. Magic of Sydney ( Lee and I raced That's Magic..won 3 :Sylvia Kaye Trained him) Crepeeno ( Bill Holmes at Rockfield Stud Matamata also stood Blue Carnation and My Pal in his last one eyed years) I sent mares to all of them ! We did get The last living Foxbridge mare ( Bridgeway) in foal to Bill Holme's Green Perfume stallion . Called Te Kooti he had more Maori holidays than Winston Peters. Babaroom ( ?) Brian Corbett's, Alan and Lynda Jones sponsored sire.He covered huge numbers of mares, as did Istidaad 12 years later.I got the only good Babaroom. Called Salonaire, we raced him with Peter Hanson and his sister. We Sold him to HK.King Delamere: Phil Brown never charged me a service fee .Dam of Cumberland Diamante Dee Travelled with Lee to Te Awamutu to look at a filly. I didnt like her. Lee said" what's that boof headed pot bellied un wormed colt , by ?"We lassooded him and leg tied him. Took him home...and that was SACI fluked a win over Bonecrusher. BISCAYO Sam Brosnan's chestnut by Biscay . Cant remember his race record but Sam gave me a free service.I sent an Alvaro mare that Doug Fisher lent me. We called him PURSE SNATCHER elbow, gubellini, Peter Jenkins and 3 others 6 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Vivian 742 Report post Posted May 7, 2017 I was working at Haunui when Church Parade arrived to start his career. He was from a lovely family, but by Queen's Hussar from memory. I later prepared a yearling by him when I worked at Akarana Stud who was one of my favourites. However, I can't seem to remember him leaving many winners?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
uneasy 497 Report post Posted May 7, 2017 Fan Letter sired our Group1 winner (Thornton Mile) Just Tommy don't think he left another that went close to his record Black Kirrama, elbow and We're Doomed 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOM(the other Molloy) 1,774 Report post Posted May 7, 2017 2 hours ago, uneasy said: Fan Letter sired our Group1 winner (Thornton Mile) Just Tommy don't think he left another that went close to his record I think Fan Letter was another half brother to Noble Bijou. By Secretariat I believe. Kimberly Mine was by Tom Rolfe I think Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOM(the other Molloy) 1,774 Report post Posted May 7, 2017 47 minutes ago, TOM(the other Molloy) said: I think Fan Letter was another half brother to Noble Bijou. By Secretariat I believe. Kimberly Mine was by Tom Rolfe I think Sorry forget that. Fan Letter was out of mare called Admiring not Priceless Gem Noble Bijou's dam. Interesting though to look up Flying View's record. When he won the Telegraph(1980) his prior start was a Reefton win. Respective stakes $15000 and $4000. Today $200000 and $25000. Shows how the low level stakes have not kept up with the elite as they should have. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Kirrama 1,477 Report post Posted May 7, 2017 On 5/2/2016 at 2:42 PM, Peter Jenkins said: A summary of suggestions: NON-QUALIFIERS 1 SW Blue Razor, Tempio, Kimberley Mine, As Before, Lire News, Americus, Nuclear Pulse (Wellington Guineas winner Honour Bright), Attalas (Gr3 wnr Saddleback), Black Prince II , Piccolo Player, Pirgos, Aberconway (Wanganui Cup wnr Arcon), Princes Gate (Sandown Guineas wnr Ascot Lane), Iades (1 NH SW and 0 from 165 SH foals. Also: Bold Tale (2 SWs) Faith Guest (2 SWs) Travolta (2 SWs) Masterpiece (2 SWs incl. Gr1 wnr Rodin) Depot (2 SWs incl. Petrify) Umteen (3 SWs incl. Glamour Star) Jiggs Alarm (3 SWs) Sovereign's Charm (3 SW incl. He'll Do - Queensland Guineas) Young Brolga (3 SW incl. WA Gr2 wnr Super Red) Val Dansant (3 SW incl. Queensland Derby wnr Dorset Downs) Minardi (3 SWs - 1 NZ-bred - but from 455 foals !) Valuta (3 SWs incl. Beaver Boy) Star Wolf (4 SWs) Danehill's brothers were disappointing but still left SWs - Nuclear Freeze (2 SWs) and Anziyan (8 SWs) Brocco left 11 SWs incl. 2 Gr1 wnrs Imperial March left 3 NZ-bred Gr1 wnrs in South Africa Catrail - almost Arrowfield's worst stallion - still left 16 SWs incl 5 down under the best of which was Catatonic Zieten left 12 SWs, mostly in France but left the NZ Magic Millions winner (and later a sire himself) Quorum The following left a Gr1 wnr: Creag-an-Sgor (NZ Oaks wnr Let's Sgor), Wham (Captain Cook - Cambridge Stud Intl), Takearisk (Mr Trick), Gleam Machine (Oaks wnr Lady Agnes), QUALIFIERS - 0 SWs - total foal numbers in brackets Rimex (88), Realistic (36), Persian Hope (83), Blue Carnation (82), Aliyoun (75), Scotch Dewar (65), Sergeant Major (66), Magellan (35), Sleipnir (53), North Pole (83), Welsh Whistler (72), Zarabanda (72), Rossini (83 - but left 7 NH SWs), Try To Stop me (40), Warsaw Pact (33), Royal Chase (52), Special mention - Tod Craig (105), Quito (143), Domingly (115), Ski Captain (194 in both Japan & NZ). BIJOU D'INDE still rules One everyone has missed was HEADLAND II who stood at Jack Macky's Pirongia Stud. A son of Ribot and closely related to Nasrullah he was a non-winner in 2 starts. he got the very best of mares which his predecessor Le Filou had converted into many sires premierships but was found out after fathering 194 foals the best of whom was probably Ploughman who took 19 starts to clear maiden ranks, was runner-up in a Parliamentary (to Ross Hunter) and a Great Northern Hurdles (to Mr. Hickey) among his 104 career starts. Great research Pete. The issue with the importing of Stallions in the 60's and on wards was identification. Wrightsons (Peter Kelly ) had a sure fire policy. (Like Car dealers) They imported a Stallion and charged a finance fee.Sell your yearlings at Trentham. Good diary Farmers like Bill Holmes sold their cows at Tauhau Rd ( ?) Matamata and set up a Thoroughbred stud. Rockfield Stud. Bill Holmes "stood " an imported Entire called "Blue Carnation". Financed by the then only Sales Team Kelly and Wright what ever. Now here is the issue....Blue Carnation had no brands, no lip tattoos.no Identification.He was a liver Chestnut.He was a very distinctive horse. He was worthy of a finance Deal between Wrightsons and Bill Holmes. The FAX from England said Lester Piggot had won on him at ? and again at ? Piggott came to Nz and rode in The international at Te Rapa( Sailing Home) and wanted to see his special unlucky horse " Blue Carnation". Lester went to Matamata. Sailing Home's spinster trainer Miss Edgar Jones again missed a nuptial. So , Lester went to Rockfield Stud with Bill and Beet Holmes waiting with scones and on seeing "Blue Carnation" Lester didnt go and pat him .or go near. "Not Him...." hedley, Trump, rdytdy and 3 others 6 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue 1,080 Report post Posted May 8, 2017 17 hours ago, Black Kirrama said: Great research Pete. The issue with the importing of Stallions in the 60's and on wards was identification. Wrightsons (Peter Kelly ) had a sure fire policy. (Like Car dealers) They imported a Stallion and charged a finance fee.Sell your yearlings at Trentham. Good diary Farmers like Bill Holmes sold their cows at Tauhau Rd ( ?) Matamata and set up a Thoroughbred stud. Rockfield Stud. Bill Holmes "stood " an imported Entire called "Blue Carnation". Financed by the then only Sales Team Kelly and Wright what ever. Now here is the issue....Blue Carnation had no brands, no lip tattoos.no Identification.He was a liver Chestnut.He was a very distinctive horse. He was worthy of a finance Deal between Wrightsons and Bill Holmes. The FAX from England said Lester Piggot had won on him at ? and again at ? Piggott came to Nz and rode in The international at Te Rapa( Sailing Home) and wanted to see his special unlucky horse " Blue Carnation". Lester went to Matamata. Sailing Home's spinster trainer Miss Edgar Jones again missed a nuptial. So , Lester went to Rockfield Stud with Bill and Beet Holmes waiting with scones and on seeing "Blue Carnation" Lester didnt go and pat him .or go near. "Not Him...." I love how these threads throw up the odd curve ball re Blue Carnation. Brought to mind as a kid in the late fifties, my Dad had a friend who worked at Alton Lodge who confided in him on one occasion that a number of offspring attributed to boom stallion Balloch were actually by the teaser. Great old game this racing. Black Kirrama 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
crustyngrizzly 1,682 Report post Posted May 8, 2017 LE FANU and SUIZU both by Le Filou cannot recollect any winners. Le Fripon possibly the best sire by Le Filou but then i can't recall any others. Black Kirrama 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gubellini 3,923 Report post Posted May 8, 2017 Other sire sons of Le Filou included Snatchem, Wilton Park and The Fijian in Australia. Cracksman in N.Z. and England. Also in N.Z. Filong, Rohe Potae, Ce Filou, Final Filou and Curran. Black Kirrama and elbow 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insider 3,875 Report post Posted May 8, 2017 I once bred to Creosote [son of Crepello] here in NZ. I doubt very much if he ever left a Stakes Winner from the few foals he got. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz (NZ) 1,719 Report post Posted May 8, 2017 Lucky Ring (Blandford) Dorchester (Grasslands) Kingsbridge (Redoubt) Lanfranco (Windsor Park) Schweppeshire Lad (Ancroft) Dance Floor (Trewlawny) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midget 4,489 Report post Posted May 8, 2017 Dance Floor was ok wasn't he, especially in North America. In the south Mystery. In the north Khaipour. Up north, Green Monkey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
crustyngrizzly 1,682 Report post Posted May 8, 2017 16 hours ago, Blue said: I love how these threads throw up the odd curve ball re Blue Carnation. Brought to mind as a kid in the late fifties, my Dad had a friend who worked at Alton Lodge who confided in him on one occasion that a number of offspring attributed to boom stallion Balloch were actually by the teaser. Great old game this racing. I recall a horse by BLUE CARNATION winning 4 in a row and rumour was that should he win his next start the money was up. Sadly he failed.CADET was the horses name trained at Te Awamutu by G.Pepper. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Smallhaussen 3,226 Report post Posted May 8, 2017 Down South - Hastings Road ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tauhei Notts 1,403 Report post Posted May 9, 2017 22 hours ago, Blue said: I love how these threads throw up the odd curve ball re Blue Carnation. Brought to mind as a kid in the late fifties, my Dad had a friend who worked at Alton Lodge who confided in him on one occasion that a number of offspring attributed to boom stallion Balloch were actually by the teaser. Great old game this racing. That might have been possible for Balloch horses born in 1951 or later. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeepers 276 Report post Posted May 9, 2017 Crusty, was it something out of Whirikoka? Not sure of its name but I seem to recall one from that mare winning a few. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
crustyngrizzly 1,682 Report post Posted May 9, 2017 6 minutes ago, jeepers said: Crusty, was it something out of Whirikoka? Not sure of its name but I seem to recall one from that mare winning a few. No idea of the mares name but his name was CADET owned by a Te Awamutu vet Jack Stewart in partnership i think. and trained by Graeme Pepper Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patiti 274 Report post Posted May 9, 2017 Double Nearco mentioned? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gubellini 3,923 Report post Posted May 9, 2017 crusty Cadet was a 1974 bay colt by Blue Carnation out of Countess Rose a mare by Count Rendered out of the imported English mare Cairnduff. Black Kirrama and crustyngrizzly 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tryagain 74 Report post Posted May 9, 2017 A , really fantastic thread.. Completely enthralled until reminded of the cheats and sires that were, but infact, were not.!! The biggest nonnie for me was Cameron George and Ross Neal.. They both had a go at "Integrity" but failed.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...