RaceCafe..#1...Tipsters Thread.... Share Your Fancies For Fun...Lets See Who The Best Tipsters Here Are.
Midget

Jockeys lives ruined...

Recommended Posts

I'm trying to collate some data to present on NZ jockeys lives ruined by racing accidents, either trackwork or raceday, in the last 50 years.

I wonder if 'cafers' would assist me please in identifying prticular accidents and their unique characteristics.

Typically I'd like to know a) if the accident was fatal, or B) if the subject incurred a life changing injury, eg paralysis or brain damage.

Thirdly I'd like to categorise the accidents geographically to determine any patterns. Say South Island from Oamaru south, Oamaru North, then the CD, Waikato, and the North, 5 discreet areas.

Fourthly if any information is available on the cause that would be useful, eg the horse may have had a catstrophic failure such as a fracture, or there may have been a gear failure, or perhaps some environmental element like adverse weather.

Next, and this is not about playing the blame game, any alleged human involvement that may have contributed should be mentioned, and lastly, I'm really keen to ascertain common denominators so if there is a trainer, steward, or any other person of interest who was associated with the accident could you note their names please.

Thanks for your help and co-operation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm trying to collate some data to present on NZ jockeys lives ruined by racing accidents, either trackwork or raceday, in the last 50 years.

I wonder if 'cafers' would assist me please in identifying prticular accidents and their unique characteristics.

Typically I'd like to know a) if the accident was fatal, or B) if the subject incurred a life changing injury, eg paralysis or brain damage.

Thirdly I'd like to categorise the accidents geographically to determine any patterns. Say South Island from Oamaru south, Oamaru North, then the CD, Waikato, and the North, 5 discreet areas.

Fourthly if any information is available on the cause that would be useful, eg the horse may have had a catstrophic failure such as a fracture, or there may have been a gear failure, or perhaps some environmental element like adverse weather.

Next, and this is not about playing the blame game, any alleged human involvement that may have contributed should be mentioned, and lastly, I'm really keen to ascertain common denominators so if there is a trainer, steward, or any other person of interest who was associated with the accident could you note their names please.

Thanks for your help and co-operation.

There was an ACC report I think a couple of years ago might have had a geographic breakdown, nature of incident, injury etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sam Spratt, terrible head injury which lead her into future relationship and marriage? :tcheek:

Jokes aside, it is important that this information is collated and recorded, maybe the timing in a forum connects it to certain events, I am guessing at the parallel thread, but regardless of that, it should be on record somewhere and understood for what it is.

Ken Brown. Roger Brown. Sorry, lacking any real details.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i can not at this stage remember the guys name.. he was out on the road by walters road in takanini in the fog, and behind others and horse reaed and they fell into a ditch on side of the road, hewas killed.

he also had a brother in racing..

stacey..........

buggar he was quite a good rider tooo.

someone will rememer his surname.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Of bringing this up again???/

i SAY LET PAST SORROWS BE LEFT ALONE....

Is this any reference to Rangiora in the back ground??

Also apart from Judy Lawson has there been any serious casulties at Rangiora??

Lastly i asked what the opinion of the local trainers at Rangiora...NAMELY..//PAUL HARRIS, GUS CLUTTERBUCK AND MARK TODD'S opinion of the track for racing at Rangiora???

If you continue to fire shots, please relay to me there opinions, as they are working on the track every day??

Thank you...If not hear i will ring them personally and then relate back...

NIGEL L

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Of bringing this up again???/

i SAY LET PAST SORROWS BE LEFT ALONE....

Is this any reference to Rangiora in the back ground??

Also apart from Judy Lawson has there been any serious casulties at Rangiora??

Lastly i asked what the opinion of the local trainers at Rangiora...NAMELY..//PAUL HARRIS, GUS CLUTTERBUCK AND MARK TODD'S opinion of the track for racing at Rangiora???

If you continue to fire shots, please relay to me there opinions, as they are working on the track every day??

Thank you...If not hear i will ring them personally and then relate back...

NIGEL L

The thinking Nigel is that we will follow the scientific principles of epidiemiology and chart a pattern of incidents, fatal and non fatal, and then we'll do a compare and contrast analysis and ascertain if we have a 'cause and effect' relationship between geographical areas, and individuals.

To answer your question about Rangiora, well if you don't know about Rangiora and the history of issues there you really don't know about South Island racing so best you go and do some research, and secondly, I suspect that when this data is collated we will be able to prove that the South Island has a major problem, and in particular Canterbury.

I can name a few who have died there in various circumstances, some on the track raceday, some not.

Tucker, Gosling, Reed, Peters, Hewitson, McGartland, and of course those whose didn't die but whose lives have been changed forever, Jackie Jamison, Judy Lawson, that young lass Lawn, and no doubt I've missed a good few, hopefully someone else will tell me who.

There's a story here Nigel, a story of shame, abuse of the vulnerable, and the smug indifference of those who stalk the pie warmers but who have little heart or appetite for risk themselves (and you).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

out of your lot,i dont believe he was licenced at the time and i think he was full of ink when he rode a horse in trackwork when trying to relive "glory days" and it proved a bit strong for him.

"some on the track raceday, some not" eg Des Tucker was in a car, but this is about jockeys in the South Island who died on duty not about jockeys who've died in races.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

zzz why have you got such a morbid obsession with the death and maiming of jockeys. For gods sake get a hobby, I can't believe you are still dragging this up.

I have got absolutely no hidden agenda, I'm not from Rangiora, but hell I'm sick to death of your negative attitude, and the slanderous accusations that spew forth from your postings.

I knew you many years ago as a cheeky, mischevious jockey, who wasn't opposed to hitting the oppositions horse over the head in a tight finish, so get over yourself.

And Kevin I can't believe you are letting him write under your name, I thought you had more sense.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i can not at this stage remember the guys name.. he was out on the road by walters road in takanini in the fog, and behind others and horse reaed and they fell into a ditch on side of the road, hewas killed.

he also had a brother in racing..

stacey..........

buggar he was quite a good rider tooo.

someone will rememer his surname.

The Stacey brothers were Murray and Stephen. But I cannot recall either coming to grief in the way you mention. I do recall one of the Rowland brothers being killed by such means in Cambridge about 1974. It took several hours to find him, given how thick the fog was.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

zzz why have you got such a morbid obsession with the death and maiming of jockeys. For gods sake get a hobby, I can't believe you are still dragging this up.

I have got absolutely no hidden agenda, I'm not from Rangiora, but hell I'm sick to death of your negative attitude, and the slanderous accusations that spew forth from your postings.

I knew you many years ago as a cheeky, mischevious jockey, who wasn't opposed to hitting the oppositions horse over the head in a tight finish, so get over yourself.

And Kevin I can't believe you are letting him write under your name, I thought you had more sense.

You must be confused surely? my interest is in Rangiora and not normally jockeys welfare (although they overlap), however, the more you look at the South Island and in particular Canterbury, the more you realise there is a problem there.

Seeing as you made the unsubstantiated accusation about my 'morbid obsession' why don't you prove it and show the historical threads that pertain to the subject, or alternatively, just watch as the data comes to hand and then do a comparison on the South Island & Canterbury v. the rest of NZ and offer some informed comment.

I understand why you feel a little uneasy about the thread though, just as I understand why the Parsons, Pam Robson, and the Prices feel uneasy. It must be awfully inconvenient to have the undeniable statisitics made public, and as unpalatable as it is the facts are that you guys have a dreadful record when it comes to jockey welfare, and you're in denial about it.

I should add that this might be about track management and the lack of appropriate skills in that domain, or it could be environmental, but the inescapable facts are that on a proportional basis more jockeys lose their lives or quality of life in your part of NZ than anywhere else in the world.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Midget if you're expecting to demonstrate that horse related injuries have a higher prevalence south of Cook Strait on a per head of population basis, then I suspect you are looking in the wrong place according to any reliable data that I have seen e.g.

http://www.nzma.org.nz/journal/116-1182/601/content.pdf

The thinking Nigel is that we will follow the scientific principles of epidiemiology and chart a pattern of incidents, fatal and non fatal, and then we'll do a compare and contrast analysis and ascertain if we have a 'cause and effect' relationship between geographical areas, and individuals.

To answer your question about Rangiora, well if you don't know about Rangiora and the history of issues there you really don't know about South Island racing so best you go and do some research, and secondly, I suspect that when this data is collated we will be able to prove that the South Island has a major problem, and in particular Canterbury.

I can name a few who have died there in various circumstances, some on the track raceday, some not.

Tucker, Gosling, Reed, Peters, Hewitson, McGartland, and of course those whose didn't die but whose lives have been changed forever, Jackie Jamison, Judy Lawson, that young lass Lawn, and no doubt I've missed a good few, hopefully someone else will tell me who.

There's a story here Nigel, a story of shame, abuse of the vulnerable, and the smug indifference of those who stalk the pie warmers but who have little heart or appetite for risk themselves (and you).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Midget if you're expecting to demonstrate that horse related injuries have a higher prevalence south of Cook Strait on a per head of population basis, then I suspect you are looking in the wrong place according to any reliable data that I have seen e.g.

http://www.nzma.org.nz/journal/116-1182/601/content.pdf

One word Leggy, Relevance.

My query pertains to jockeys (read it) and naturally racehorses. Trying to digress and distract is not a useful tactic, it's usually an admission of defeat.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One word Leggy, Relevance.

My query pertains to jockeys (read it) and naturally racehorses. Trying to digress and distract is not a useful tactic, it's usually an admission of defeat.

but zzz you never be able to prove in the deaths of these people if its horse jockey or track probs or just accidentail

i just think its a coincidence that they have happened

fact rangioras been open up to trials again must sort tell you that they are starting to have faith in the track

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

zzz why have you got such a morbid obsession with the death and maiming of jockeys. For gods sake get a hobby, I can't believe you are still dragging this up.

I have got absolutely no hidden agenda, I'm not from Rangiora, but hell I'm sick to death of your negative attitude, and the slanderous accusations that spew forth from your postings.

I knew you many years ago as a cheeky, mischevious jockey, who wasn't opposed to hitting the oppositions horse over the head in a tight finish, so get over yourself.

And Kevin I can't believe you are letting him write under your name, I thought you had more sense.

And I guess you are just the man to handle all this information you intend to gather discreetly and sensitively.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I had a track work accident which could have been avoided......It was at the jumpouts up north....I will not name the track, however it was in the middle of winter and the races had been held the day before....some track manager thought it was a great idea to have the babies jump out at the 250m on the home straight and 20m past the post was a great big black sand gap around 8m wide which to a young horse looks like a big black hole.....I protested to the trackmanager and he and a couple others just laughed at me and said have you lost your nerve......anyway to cut a long story short we jumped and the baby I was on went well up until we got to the gap I felt him hesitating and then he put in this almighty jump, we were find until he landed...one leg on the packed gap and the other on the deep mud on the track, he fell and we slid arcross the track for about 30metres, the horse did not get up off the ground for about an hour, I had cracked my skull cap in half but I seemed to be ok. I went to the doctors showed him my cap and he rushed me to get xrayed....I had broken my neck and it took years for it to come right again.......The fall was so big that the jockeys were coming up to me at the races and saying we heard you did a DC7 fall and a couple were concerned about why and how it had happened.

That trackmanger never put the barriers there again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

but zzz you never be able to prove in the deaths of these people if its horse jockey or track probs or just accidentail

i just think its a coincidence that they have happened

fact rangioras been open up to trials again must sort tell you that they are starting to have faith in the track

That's the whole purpose of this thread Fordie, to collate information that will be presented to the relevant authorities in order that they may understand the probability that there will be another accident in the Canterbury, and statistically it's likely to be at Rangiora, and then they can factor that into their decision making processes.

Stats don't lie Fordie, history is the best guide to the future and at the moment it appears that the South Island has 1/4 of the races but three times more fatalities and accidents that result in permanent disabilities. In other words you're something like 1200% more likely to suffer a career ending accident in the South than the North.

What we have to ascertain now is this; is it the tracks?, environment?, seasonal?, the track management?, the judiciary/stewards decision making?, or the actual horse persons who're responsible? and how do we minimise the chance of a repeat.

That said it's absolutely clear that post trauma the Canterbury trainers remain indifferent to the victims predicament, eg, the Parsons have never been in touch with Jude Lawson and I doubt the Prices ever sought reconciliation or aplogised to the Peters family yet the very same Prices are the loudest campaigners to restore racing at Rangiora which just happens to be the most dangerous of all tracks.

Have they no morality?, no sensitivity?, no compassion? no deceny? and why don't they come on here and reply and explain why they did what they did that fateful day?. Conversely they seem very keen to express their feelings when it meets their selfish needs over a resumption at Rangiora, you tell me if that's selective and objectionable behaviour.

Then we have the issue of cover ups. We can prove Rangiora/Lawson was a cover up and I cannot for the life of me understand how the Prices and Ching were never held accountable for letting Becs Peters go out on that dangerous horse Centalac when it had just been described as too dangerous too ride.

I know one thing for sure Fordie, and this is only an expression of my values, if I was responsible in any way for the death of a jockey, or for ruining their life, I'd do my absolute best to seek reconciliation with the family, to beg forgiveness, and to make absolutely sure that I worked to minimise a repeat and to make good damage I had done.

I see no evidence of that attiude or those values in Canterbury.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

qualified fact.....'but the inescapable facts are that on a proportional basis more jockeys lose their lives or quality of life in your part of NZ than anywhere else in the world'

....please post the comparative stats for Argentina,Hungary,Malaysia,Sth Africa,Sth Korea and Chile.Thanks in advance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What planet are you on zzz?

What on earth do mean by "You guys have a dreadful record when it comes to jockey welfare"

Jo McGartland was originally apprenticed to Gary, but it was years later when she was free lance that she clipped heels at Rangiora and died as a consequence.

Jo was a wonderful friend of ours and her accident was just that, an accident, she was riding a horse that she loved and rode all of the time in trackwork for the Coles.

Accidents do happen in all walks of life, and unfortunately some are more serious than others and the consequences are irrepairable.

It is very upsetting to friends and family when these awful tragedys are dragged up again and this is why I do not like where you are going with this topic.

I have nothing to feel guilty about and would never intentionally risk another human being or animal for that matter, so please refrain from labelling Gary & I in "You guys have a dreadful record when it comes to jockey welfare".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.